What a shame; another military newsroup gone!

Cub Driver wrote:

So she became a foredeck hand on a around-the-world sailboat race

Sailboat crew?? Excellent choice!

If she's ever down Fairhaven (New Bedford, MA) way, I can always
use a crewmember.

I "race" around Buzzard's Bay and the Elizabeth's at about 6
knots on a "fast day", nonetheless, I *always* seem to win!

Funny about that!

I've spent a lot of time at sea, much of it under not so nice
conditions, yet I'm still envious of her. What a clever gal
you have!


SMH

Ya gotta just love the email filters and spam blockers. Put in a few key words
and writers on the list and it becomes a good group again. I filtered it down
from 151 msgs to 28 on topic in three minites

The ration of junk to on topic msgs seems to be about 5 junk to 1 good.

Ed Rasimus wrote:
This semester, I'm doing POS 111 American Government and POS 125 State
& Local Government as online courses. They are taught with an
incredible software called Blackboard which is relatively easy to use
and offers a lot of course flexibility.

I've used Blackboard and it is, indeed, excellent.


If I leave the
school, there won't be any online Political Science classes in the
fall.

Ah well. Undoubtedly the optimism-curing effects are
much greater in class than over the wires. That's really
what I wanted to see. I would pay lots to attend a class
or two with my elder son, who is now a sophomore (in
more ways than one, I sometimes think). Odd points of
view that boy has, and all joking aside, I dunno where he
got 'em... still, I am definitely an optimist at heart. Versus
the wife, who is, as she says, "a realist."


Jeff

On Fri, 9 Apr 2004 07:10:32 -0600, "Jeff Crowell"
wrote:

Ed Rasimus wrote:

If I leave the
school, there won't be any online Political Science classes in the
fall.

Ah well. Undoubtedly the optimism-curing effects are
much greater in class than over the wires. That's really
what I wanted to see. I would pay lots to attend a class
or two with my elder son, who is now a sophomore (in
more ways than one, I sometimes think). Odd points of
view that boy has, and all joking aside, I dunno where he
got 'em... still, I am definitely an optimist at heart. Versus
the wife, who is, as she says, "a realist."

As a student in the class, it is not as easy to have your optimism
shattered, since you don't see the literary efforts (or lack thereof)
from your classmates. Online, you also don't get as much of the impact
of blank stares that greet such overhead questions as "does anyone
here read Hemingway"" or, has anyone seen the movie Patton, Dr.
Strangelove, The Last Emperor, Seven Days in May.....

Probably my lowest expectations were unmet the time, on Nov. 11th, I
asked the class what was significant about the day. Few knew, until
after prompting that it was some kind of holiday, one student
remembered it was Veteran's Day. When asked if they had ever heard it
called Armistice Day, none had. Asked why it was 11/11, they didn't
know that the armistice to end the "War to End All Wars" had been
signed at 11:00 AM on 11/11. When asked which war that was, they
guessed Vietnam, Korea and the Civil War.....all high-school grads and
all enrolled in college! Amazing, isn't it?

There are always bright spots, of course.

Your wife probably went to the same school as mine, who regularly
quotes a professor who liked to say to his idealistic under-grads,
"it's not right, but it's real!"



Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
Smithsonian Institution Press
ISBN #1-58834-103-8

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Rasimus"

As a student in the class, it is not as easy to have your optimism
shattered, since you don't see the literary efforts (or lack thereof)
from your classmates. Online, you also don't get as much of the impact
of blank stares that greet such overhead questions as "does anyone
here read Hemingway"" or, has anyone seen the movie Patton, Dr.
Strangelove, The Last Emperor, Seven Days in May.....

Probably my lowest expectations were unmet the time, on Nov. 11th, I
asked the class what was significant about the day. Few knew, until
after prompting that it was some kind of holiday, one student
remembered it was Veteran's Day. When asked if they had ever heard it
called Armistice Day, none had. Asked why it was 11/11, they didn't
know that the armistice to end the "War to End All Wars" had been
signed at 11:00 AM on 11/11. When asked which war that was, they
guessed Vietnam, Korea and the Civil War.....all high-school grads and
all enrolled in college! Amazing, isn't it?

There are always bright spots, of course.

Your wife probably went to the same school as mine, who regularly
quotes a professor who liked to say to his idealistic under-grads,
"it's not right, but it's real!"



Ed Rasimus

Ed,

I have a lot of hours in college and the thing I liked about community
colleges and commuter campuses was the mix of students you encountered. The
students who entered directly out of high school, with few exceptions, had
little to contribute. Without some life experience their horizons were very
close.

Perhaps no student should be permitted to attend college until they had
worked a couple of years to smooth over some of the unfinished edges. I was
particularly struck by a literature class where we had just read "Death of a
Ball-turret Gunner" by Randall Jarrell when one of the older students spoke
up and described his experiences as a WW-II ball-turret gunner.

I'm sure my USAF travels did not handicap me in class.

Regards,

Tex Houston

Tex Houston wrote:
I have a lot of hours in college and the thing I liked about community
colleges and commuter campuses was the mix of students you encountered.
The
students who entered directly out of high school, with few exceptions, had
little to contribute. Without some life experience their horizons were
very
close.

So very true. After I got out of the Navy I went back to school to
correct previous errors (I got the worng degree the first time
'round). So I knocked out the Mech E program in 2 years. I had
very little in common with the "regular" students, who were not
that much younger than I (I was 28, these were juniors and
seniors). We had very different goals.


Perhaps no student should be permitted to attend college until they had
worked a couple of years to smooth over some of the unfinished edges. I
was
particularly struck by a literature class where we had just read "Death of
a
Ball-turret Gunner" by Randall Jarrell when one of the older students
spoke
up and described his experiences as a WW-II ball-turret gunner.

What a priceless gift!


Jeff

My kill-file grows daily, but much like spammers, the posting source
keeps mutating and as soon as one mole gets whacked another pops out
of a nearby hole.

I have rules of fame and rules of shame. The killfile is pretty big, yes,
but I also have "positive rules", that highlight in red the posts from the
people I always enjoy reading. Granted it is a lot of black and precious few
red lines, but then again, quality counts ;-)
_____________
José Herculano

"Tex Houston" wrote in message
...
|
|
| I have a lot of hours in college and the thing I liked about community
| colleges and commuter campuses was the mix of students you encountered.
The
| students who entered directly out of high school, with few exceptions, had
| little to contribute. Without some life experience their horizons were
very
| close.
|
| Perhaps no student should be permitted to attend college until they had
| worked a couple of years to smooth over some of the unfinished edges. I
was
| particularly struck by a literature class where we had just read "Death of
a
| Ball-turret Gunner" by Randall Jarrell when one of the older students
spoke
| up and described his experiences as a WW-II ball-turret gunner.
|
| I'm sure my USAF travels did not handicap me in class.
|
| Regards,
|
| Tex Houston
|
|






"When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose"





I was about 11 when I read that for the first time, the poem was like a
short, sharp slap in the face.



Gets your attention quickly.


--


Regards


Dave Kearton

In message , Tex Houston
writes
I have a lot of hours in college and the thing I liked about community
colleges and commuter campuses was the mix of students you encountered. The
students who entered directly out of high school, with few exceptions, had
little to contribute. Without some life experience their horizons were very
close.

I went to university almost right from school, with one year of work
experience intervening.

Just over a decade later, I went back into academe to do a Master's,
having been in full-time gainful employment until then (and during the
course, it being a part-time degree). I gained *much* more from the
second course, most of it from my fellow students (which is no
disrespect to the excellent tutors).

Perhaps no student should be permitted to attend college until they had
worked a couple of years to smooth over some of the unfinished edges.

I was interested to see who pressed the course and graduated on time,
and who delayed and deferred. I was very surprised by some of my fellow
students: some I'd expected to fail graduated on time beside me, others
I was sure would excel were no-shows for reasons never stated.

And I learned a *lot* from my colleagues on the course, much more so
than I did getting my BEng.

I'm sure my USAF travels did not handicap me in class.

One of my fellow students was a former RN submariner. He at least I feel
deferred because he was a perfectionist: he was going to submit his
dissertation when it was ready, and if he could cheaply get an extra
year then he'd take the time to polish the cannonball to a fine gloss.

I personally think he was wrong, but that's just opinion. (I feel that I
was given a deadline, and I met it... I might have got a distinction
with another year of editing and honing, or I might have reduced my
dissertation to meaningless pap by eliminating everything controversial.
Whatever... I submitted on time and passed)

--
When you have to kill a man, it costs nothing to be polite.
W S Churchill

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

In message , Ed Rasimus
writes
Probably my lowest expectations were unmet the time, on Nov. 11th, I
asked the class what was significant about the day. Few knew, until
after prompting that it was some kind of holiday, one student
remembered it was Veteran's Day. When asked if they had ever heard it
called Armistice Day, none had. Asked why it was 11/11, they didn't
know that the armistice to end the "War to End All Wars" had been
signed at 11:00 AM on 11/11. When asked which war that was, they
guessed Vietnam, Korea and the Civil War.....all high-school grads and
all enrolled in college! Amazing, isn't it?

Yeah, but...

WW1 wasn't a critical win-or-die for the US. Meanwhile, ask your typical
class of UK under-18s what happened at Appotamox (probably spelled that
one wrong... shows how much I know!), or why Gettysburg was significant,
or about just about anything about the War Between The States or the War
Of Those Ungrateful Rebellious American *******s Forsaking Our
Enlightened Rule (I'm sure there's a more politic US phrase for both of
those )

For that matter, ask your typical UK under-18 to find the Somme or Ypres
and they'll probably point to somewhere in the Middle East (it was a big
fight and that's where we fight our wars, right?). Let's not even start
on trying to pin Spion Kop or Omduran or Balaklava on the map, even for
UK students. (Let's be modern: where's Imphal, where's Goose Green,
where's Neuve Chapelle, where's Dhofar?)



There's a lot of UK history I don't actually know jack about, let alone
other countries'. I console myself by admitting ignorance and trying to
learn when I feel the need: or, in areas that interest me, by bothering
those with experience.


I'd suggest that basic school education isn't necessarily able to
provide detailed world history (my World History O-level covered the
Russian and Chinese revolutions, the economic and political buildup to
WW2, and the Arab-Israeli conflicts: good stuff and I really enjoyed it,
helped by a good teacher, but how much of the 20th century's woes went
ignored if that's all you think about?) but to at least let the student
know that there aren't usually quick, simple soundbite answers to the
problems of the real world and to give some idea of where to look to
learn more if you're interested.


And I admire and respect teachers as a general rule. Tough job with few
thanks.


It's late, I'm tired and emotional, I'm rambling. All opinions above
have been assayed as worth at best $0.02.

--
When you have to kill a man, it costs nothing to be polite.
W S Churchill

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk