East River turning radius

wrote in message
...
Ah... Well... I just through some random numbers in there... Of course,
one
would not try and pull a 57G turn as cool as it sounds...

Thanks for the lesson! I learned something new today...


The calculator is correct by my reckoning. 80mph and 89 degree bank
gives 8 ft radius turning circle which is correct in theory. it sounds
ridiculous but really the 89 degree angle of bank is what is ridiculous
..
such a turn if possible would pull 57 g. the calculation is not that
difficult. radius= v squared / g tan ( bank angle)
terry

I should add that this calulation assumes all the lift is coming from the
wing , but that theory would imply that an aircraft cant hold altitude in a
90 degree bank, and of course we have all seen aerobatic aircraft do this.
For this to occur the lift must be coming from the fuselage of the aircraft
and so the equation will not be strictly correct. But for the type of turns
that mere mortals like me will do I think it tells the story. I have heard
guys on this group regulary mention 60 degree or 2 g turns, but in my
training steep turns were 45 degrees maximum.
terry

There's an NTSB update about Lidle's crash:
http://www.ntsb.gov/pressrel/2006/061103.htm.

Unsurprisingly, they conclude that the plane didn't bank enough for the
turn.

--Gary

Gary Drescher wrote:
Unsurprisingly, they conclude that the plane didn't bank enough for the
turn.

Duhhh!

Kind of the definition of a too wide turn, isn't it?

Grumman-581 wrote:

Gary Drescher wrote:
Unsurprisingly, they conclude that the plane didn't bank enough for the
turn.

Duhhh!

Kind of the definition of a too wide turn, isn't it?

Or they did not roll out of the bank soon enough. Busting airspace
(go AROUND the building) or violating altitude above a populated area
is far better than what they did.

Ron Lee

Ron Lee wrote:
Or they did not roll out of the bank soon enough. Busting airspace
(go AROUND the building) or violating altitude above a populated area
is far better than what they did.

Oh, I think that if they were still around, they would agree that just
about *anything* is better than what they did do... sick-grin

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 20:54:26 +0000, Grumman-581 wrote:

Oh, I think that if they were still around, they would agree that just
about *anything* is better than what they did do

Indeed. I was at a dinner last night where someone asked me whether or
not those flying that airplane had made a mistake.

- Andrew

Ron Lee wrote:

Grumman-581 wrote:


Gary Drescher wrote:

Unsurprisingly, they conclude that the plane didn't bank enough for the
turn.

Duhhh!

Kind of the definition of a too wide turn, isn't it?


Or they did not roll out of the bank soon enough. Busting airspace
(go AROUND the building) or violating altitude above a populated area
is far better than what they did.

Ron Lee

If they were in a steep bank and high AOA, I wonder if they could even
see the building over the nose?

Matt

It would have been high in the windshield, the roof would
have blocked it until the last 1/2 of the turn. But I doubt
they were experienced acro pilots trained to look out all of
the windows. They also probably did not bank even 45°, let
alone the 53-55° they needed to complete the turn.
They didn't plan the turn well, where they needed to be when
they started or what they would have done if the weather or
other traffic had blocked them, had they been prepared to
call for a Class B clearance, in other words the CFI screwed
up because he did not plan ahead, Casey Lidle screwed up
because he didn't act like the PIC, they both screwed up
because they expected the other pilot "did the planning" so
two dead pilots for no good reason.



"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...
| Ron Lee wrote:
|
| Grumman-581
wrote:
|
|
| Gary Drescher wrote:
|
| Unsurprisingly, they conclude that the plane didn't
bank enough for the
| turn.
|
| Duhhh!
|
| Kind of the definition of a too wide turn, isn't it?
|
|
| Or they did not roll out of the bank soon enough.
Busting airspace
| (go AROUND the building) or violating altitude above a
populated area
| is far better than what they did.
|
| Ron Lee
|
| If they were in a steep bank and high AOA, I wonder if
they could even
| see the building over the nose?
|
| Matt

"Grumman-581" wrote in message
...
Gary Drescher wrote:
Unsurprisingly, they conclude that the plane didn't bank enough
for the turn.

Duhhh!

Kind of the definition of a too wide turn, isn't it?

Kind of the definition of 'unsurprisingly', too.

Gary Drescher wrote:

There's an NTSB update about Lidle's crash:
http://www.ntsb.gov/pressrel/2006/061103.htm.

Unsurprisingly, they conclude that the plane didn't bank enough for the
turn.

--Gary

I'm a little surprised there seems to be no mention of reducing speed before
beginning the turn as something to be learned from this accident.

Do pilots flying this corridor use this technique?

--
Frank....H