2014 SSA/US Tasking Analysis

On Saturday, January 31, 2015 at 8:15:22 PM UTC-5, Karl Striedieck wrote:
Sean,

I say again, if a pilot hopes to do well with the TAT and MAT they need to realize all tasks are races/speed tasks. Being "bored" would seem to me to have a negative effect on ones performance. The greater demands of the TAT/MAT keep most pilots awake, compared to the those of the AT where you can put your mind in neutral and do OK.

"Completely different sport" "rogue leadership"??? Did Tiffany approve those???

Answer to last question: Yes.

KS

Karl, please look at the 2014 Opinion Poll.

Do you want to see more or less of Assigned Tasks?
50% more
38% same
8% lees

Do you want to see more or less MAT tasks with few assigned points?
11% more
35% same
52% less

I did not make up these numbers. It seems Sean's views are not in minority.

I think you belong to the 8% group .

I personally like flying Assigned Tasks or MAT tasks with more points than one could use.

AK

Trying to digest all the information from this thread, it appears to me that the better of the pilots want MAT's or such and the weaker pilots want AT's. Am I correct in this assumption? I can imagine in perfect variable weather with very long turn points that can have divergent paths an AT would be okay.

Thanks Karl for your involvement in the discussion I go back and reread "Winning" all the time.

J

On Sunday, February 1, 2015 at 1:04:55 PM UTC-5, wrote:
Trying to digest all the information from this thread, it appears to me that the better of the pilots want MAT's or such and the weaker pilots want AT's. Am I correct in this assumption? I can imagine in perfect variable weather with very long turn points that can have divergent paths an AT would be okay.

Thanks Karl for your involvement in the discussion I go back and reread "Winning" all the time.

J

As Karl said the best pilots will find a way to win. I would not call Sean a weak pilot considering his results in 2013 and 2014 18 m Nationals. You can call me a weak pilot but I still would like to fly Assigned Task from time to time.

On Saturday, January 24, 2015 at 11:44:38 PM UTC-6, Sean Fidler wrote:
2014: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

2013: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

2014 US Tasking Highlights
Total Number of Tasks - 189
TATs - 122 or 65%
MATs - 63 or 33%
ASTs - 4 or 2%

2014 US Nationals Tasking Highlights
Total Number of Tasks - 36
TATs - 17 or 47%
MATs - 17 or 47%
ASTs - 2 or 5% (Club Class Nationals)

Of the Modified Assigned Tasks (63)...
49% (thats right, 49) were ONE or ZERO TP's (aka HAT or Half Ass Tasks)
9 Zero Turn MATs
22 One Turn MATs

Number of TATs with Average Turn Area Radius 20 miles - 16 or 13%
Number of TATs with all 30 mile Turn Areas - 10 or 8%

I really enjoyed flying the assigned tasks at the club class nationals last summer. I also enjoyed the long MATs at the 2013 Region 10. To me, on the TAT you get to fly with other gliders for about 30 to 40 minutes, then you spend about 2 and half hours alone with your flight computer. Finally, you will work a couple of thermals with two or three other gliders and then glide home. I am sure that if you are top pilot and attract a lot of leaches, your experience is different than mine. In my limited international experience, it seemed to me that the pilots were very much at home flying aggressively and fast in groups of 7 to 15 gliders.

Bill Snead
6W

Andrez,

I was going to wait until Karl dug himself a little further in...

Excellent point and I am shocked that nobody had the guts to bring that up yet.

Remember, Karl has openly stated that he wants to to end Assigned Tasking for all US pilots. Even for pilot pilots in the pure classes which he rarely competes in anymore.

Only 4 assigned tasks in the US in 2014.

Karl (and John Cochrane) really hate assigned tasks. They are great people (and great pilots), and mean well. Yep, they have probably experienced their fair share of mass handouts, etc. Regardless, assigned tasks are very fun to fly when the weather is strong and offers the last true racing task left. Thankfully, we are not all drinking their cool-aid even though they lobby against racing tasks as often I lobby for them. But if you disagree with them, If you want a few racing tasks in the US each year, you had better speak up. They (and I am sure there are others in the SSA hierarchy) are very close to their goal of ending ALL assigned tasking in the USA in favor of ALL timed OLC "like" tasking.

Sincerely,

Sean

On Sunday, 1 February 2015 02:15:05 UTC+10, John Galloway wrote:
At 15:04 31 January 2015, Karl Striedieck wrote:
Sean,

I have trouble wading through your (what seem to me) rambling,
unrelated
st=
ats and invectives to get to your points.=20

Suggestion: Ask that gem of a spousal unit of yours, Tiffany (PhD
Mechanica=
l Engineering, Law Degree), to proof read your tomes to make
them more to
t=
he point and with less unrelated baggage.

"Lord of the OLC" for example.=20

You asked who are we that race against the clock. Answer: those
of us who
w=
in contests.=20

Why does the "rest of the world" fly more AT's? So the pilots can
hold
hand=
s and not have to make as many decisions/screw ups.=20

Pilot's herd mentality and conservative nature led to a mass land
out of
al=
l the standard class on a blue day at the 1987 WGC at Benalla
because no
on=
e would start first and they all played start gate roulette until 4PM.

If any characteristic typifies the US compared to Europe it is our
initiati=
ve and pioneering spirit: Internet, Moon landing, SR-71, Jazz,
research,
=
etc. Let's lead the way in contest tasking as well, rather than
surrenderin=
g to the dull bureaucracy that stifles improvements.=20

KS

Was it not European initiative and pioneering spirit that resulted in
the US?

John Galloway

Yes John, but that may have selected the innovative, pioneering spirit, the others stayed in Europe . BTW, I am not associated with USA in any way.

Cheers

paul

On Sunday, February 1, 2015 at 11:04:49 PM UTC-5, Sean Fidler wrote:
Andrez,

I was going to wait until Karl dug himself a little further in...

Excellent point and I am shocked that nobody had the guts to bring that up yet.

Remember, Karl has openly stated that he wants to to end Assigned Tasking for all US pilots. Even for pilot pilots in the pure classes which he rarely competes in anymore.

Only 4 assigned tasks in the US in 2014.

Karl (and John Cochrane) really hate assigned tasks. They are great people (and great pilots), and mean well. Yep, they have probably experienced their fair share of mass handouts, etc. Regardless, assigned tasks are very fun to fly when the weather is strong and offers the last true racing task left. Thankfully, we are not all drinking their cool-aid even though they lobby against racing tasks as often I lobby for them. But if you disagree with them, If you want a few racing tasks in the US each year, you had better speak up. They (and I am sure there are others in the SSA hierarchy) are very close to their goal of ending ALL assigned tasking in the USA in favor of ALL timed OLC "like" tasking.

Sincerely,

Sean

John does not hate assigned tasks. He does, however have a pretty strong view of the plus and minus of calling them, which is what he has communicated.
The RC has no intention of trying to eliminate the AT and stands solidly behind the principle of having a variety of tasks.
You are over stating their positions in an attempt to polarize this discussion and, in my view, are going more than a bit too far.
I like John and the RC, don't hate the AT, we just think it's usefulness and value is limited and that other tasks, properly called, can test skills almost as well with less potential down side risk.
UH

On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 6:37:55 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Sunday, February 1, 2015 at 11:04:49 PM UTC-5, Sean Fidler wrote:
Andrez,

I was going to wait until Karl dug himself a little further in...

Excellent point and I am shocked that nobody had the guts to bring that up yet.

Remember, Karl has openly stated that he wants to to end Assigned Tasking for all US pilots. Even for pilot pilots in the pure classes which he rarely competes in anymore.

Only 4 assigned tasks in the US in 2014.

Karl (and John Cochrane) really hate assigned tasks. They are great people (and great pilots), and mean well. Yep, they have probably experienced their fair share of mass handouts, etc. Regardless, assigned tasks are very fun to fly when the weather is strong and offers the last true racing task left. Thankfully, we are not all drinking their cool-aid even though they lobby against racing tasks as often I lobby for them. But if you disagree with them, If you want a few racing tasks in the US each year, you had better speak up. They (and I am sure there are others in the SSA hierarchy) are very close to their goal of ending ALL assigned tasking in the USA in favor of ALL timed OLC "like" tasking.

Sincerely,

Sean

John does not hate assigned tasks. He does, however have a pretty strong view of the plus and minus of calling them, which is what he has communicated.
The RC has no intention of trying to eliminate the AT and stands solidly behind the principle of having a variety of tasks.
You are over stating their positions in an attempt to polarize this discussion and, in my view, are going more than a bit too far.
I like John and the RC, don't hate the AT, we just think it's usefulness and value is limited and that other tasks, properly called, can test skills almost as well with less potential down side risk.
UH

I can attest to that - and speak for others on the RC as well. It is a requirement of the job to have a balanced, unbiased view of the strengths and weaknesses of various task types and to encourage their use to maximize challenge, enjoyment and safety for those flying in contests. ATs add to the variety and, has been stated, test a mix of skills that are somewhat different from other task types. Feel free to call them as conditions permit.

9B

On Sunday, February 1, 2015 at 7:40:15 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Saturday, January 24, 2015 at 11:44:38 PM UTC-6, Sean Fidler wrote:
2014: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

2013: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

2014 US Tasking Highlights
Total Number of Tasks - 189
TATs - 122 or 65%
MATs - 63 or 33%
ASTs - 4 or 2%

2014 US Nationals Tasking Highlights
Total Number of Tasks - 36
TATs - 17 or 47%
MATs - 17 or 47%
ASTs - 2 or 5% (Club Class Nationals)

Of the Modified Assigned Tasks (63)...
49% (thats right, 49) were ONE or ZERO TP's (aka HAT or Half Ass Tasks)
9 Zero Turn MATs
22 One Turn MATs

Number of TATs with Average Turn Area Radius 20 miles - 16 or 13%
Number of TATs with all 30 mile Turn Areas - 10 or 8%

I really enjoyed flying the assigned tasks at the club class nationals last summer. I also enjoyed the long MATs at the 2013 Region 10. To me, on the TAT you get to fly with other gliders for about 30 to 40 minutes, then you spend about 2 and half hours alone with your flight computer. Finally, you will work a couple of thermals with two or three other gliders and then glide home. I am sure that if you are top pilot and attract a lot of leaches, your experience is different than mine. In my limited international experience, it seemed to me that the pilots were very much at home flying aggressively and fast in groups of 7 to 15 gliders.

Bill Snead
6W

I completely agree with Andy and UH. I am all for variety of tasks MAT, TAT, AT. However I feel that the MAT and TAT are more Strategic and build a broader set of skills than the AT. All are true racing tasks. I even support the expansion of OLC type tasks/gatherings as I think it will attract more competitors to the sport.

Matt H

With respect UH, balance? :-). Seriously?

The SSA is down to 4 assigned tasks in 2014 and rapidly trending towards zero in 2015. On the other end of that "balance," 98% of 2014 US tasks were (Karl's) "timed" tasks.

I am regularly getting beat up on this topic by RC members (John C especially). Karl actually seems downright angry about the topic being discussed. He actually involves my wife in most of his posts when responding to me.

From my vantage point, there does not seem to be any real SSA support for assigned tasking in the US. In fact, it appears to me that the SSA is fairly happy to let them die. If there is SSA support for assigned tasking, I have a newsflash........the SSA is currently on track to hold only 1 AT in 2015. I suggest that we consider "increasing" the "support" soon.

This is really all quite depressing if you think about it. Put yourself in the shoes of the overwhelming majority of pilots who responded that they would like MORE ASSIGNED TASKING in the latest opinion poll.

At this point, if the SSA is "supporting" assigned tasks (and not their extinction), why not create a rule (or guideline at least) which requires at least 10%? That would be tangible support. That would have a lot more meaning that the ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that is being done to protect them from reaching zero in 2015 (a very real possibility based in the data over the past 10 years).

All of this debate and not one member of the RC mentioned their own opinion poll which showed a very CLEAR PREFERENCE by the majority of CURRENT US CONTEST PILOTS for MORE ASSIGNED TASKS. I wonder, if that data was the other way around (US pilots showed a clear preference for LESS ATs), would it have been cited?

Finally, is there a rule about no ATs in "sports/modern/OLC" class or not? Many seem to "think" there is. Is there? If there is, how was an AT conducted (successfully and to the delight of many) in a 2014 SSA sanctioned Sports (Modern) class contest? This must mean either there "is no rule" or "the rule was ignored." Please clarify as some confusion seems to exist.

Thanks,

Sean