Rumsfeld's on Bravery

On Wed, 17 Dec 2003 05:11:39 GMT, Kevin Brooks wrote:

Please don't confuse my comments with other posters'.

YOUR post on 15 DEC: "Anywhere near a war zone?" Short term memory problem?

Evidently. I got that wrong. Sorry.

--
"It's easier to find people online who openly support the KKK than
people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
(Email: , but first subtract 275 and reverse
the last two letters).

"phil hunt" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 04:07:33 GMT, Kevin Brooks
wrote:

"phil hunt" wrote in message
...
Saddam was an assassin in his youth, which presumably took osme
courage. What's the bravest thing Rumsfeld has personally done?

He flew jets onto and off of carriers at one time

Anywhere near a war zone?

IIRC his service was just after the Korean Conflict. That said, it takes
a
decent pair to land a high performance aircraft on a pitching and rolling
deck IMO.


--have you done that?

Nope. The only thing I've ever flown is a glider.

So you are somewhere beneath Rumsfeld then on this mythical
totem-pole-of-courage?

I've no idea whether I am or not. I've never claimed to be
courageous, BTW, and in any case it is irrelevant to the quewstion
of whether Saddam or Rumsfeld is more courageous.

Ooops, Kevin may as well surrender, a personal attack didn't work.

On Wed, 17 Dec 2003 14:26:24 GMT, Steven P. McNicoll wrote:

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
et...

There may also be something wrong with those who take the actions and
rants
of the radical element and ascribe them to the majority.

I don't see much condemnation of the radical element from the majority.

How about http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3230206.stm?

--
"It's easier to find people online who openly support the KKK than
people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
(Email: , but first subtract 275 and reverse
the last two letters).

"Tarver Engineering" wrote in message
...

"phil hunt" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 04:07:33 GMT, Kevin Brooks
wrote:

"phil hunt" wrote in message
...
Saddam was an assassin in his youth, which presumably took osme
courage. What's the bravest thing Rumsfeld has personally done?

He flew jets onto and off of carriers at one time

Anywhere near a war zone?

IIRC his service was just after the Korean Conflict. That said, it
takes
a
decent pair to land a high performance aircraft on a pitching and
rolling
deck IMO.


--have you done that?

Nope. The only thing I've ever flown is a glider.

So you are somewhere beneath Rumsfeld then on this mythical
totem-pole-of-courage?

I've no idea whether I am or not. I've never claimed to be
courageous, BTW, and in any case it is irrelevant to the quewstion
of whether Saddam or Rumsfeld is more courageous.

Ooops, Kevin may as well surrender, a personal attack didn't work.

That was hardly a "personal attack"--it was merely an observation regarding
the danger of belittling the courage of others. A bit like "observing" that
you have a habit of making things up, Tarvernaut--things like "optical
nukes", alleged carriage of AIM-7 and AIM-9 by F-106's, "recoiless" cannon
in AC-130's, the supposed absence of pitot tubes in modern aircraft, etc.

Brooks

On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 17:45:13 GMT, "Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:


"Alan Minyard" wrote in message
.. .

And the Israelis will try to destroy the Palestinians. There are no "clean
hands" in that mess.


Maybe not, but one side's hands are significantly dirtier than the other
side's. The majority of Israelis are willing to live alongside a peaceful
Palestinian state, few Palestinians are willing to live in peace alongside
Israel.

And you know this how?? From Israeli polls? I am not saying that you are
incorrect, I am simply saying that I, and I believe you, do not really know.

Al Minyard

On Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:05:30 GMT, "Kevin Brooks" wrote:


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
t...

There may also be something wrong with those who take the actions and
rants
of the radical element and ascribe them to the majority.


I don't see much condemnation of the radical element from the majority.

Maybe you are suffering a bit of myopia, then. I guess you consider all of
the Muslims in Turkey to be radicals? We have garnered the support of a
number of predominantly Muslim nations during our recent fight against the
Taliban and AQ--Turkmenistan, Kyrgyzstan, Kazakhstan, Pakistan, and Turkey
all contributed to that fight, as did IIRC Jordan with non-combat support.
I'd think that qualifies as "condemnation" of the radicals, IMO. Not to
mention that lady who just picked up the Nobel Peace Prize.

Brooks

You mean the "lady" who viciously attacked the US and the west during
her acceptance rant (oops, speech)??

Hardly a peaceful person. The prize was an anti-American statement
on the part of the "committee".

Al Minyard

"Alan Minyard" wrote in message
...

And you know this how?? From Israeli polls? I am not saying that you are
incorrect, I am simply saying that I, and I believe you, do not really
know.


I base it on adherence to the Camp David Accords by Egypt and Israel. There
has been peace between Egypt and Israel since Egyptians decided to live in
peace alongside Israel. When Palestinians decide they can live in peace
alongside Israel there will be a peaceful Palestine alongside Israel.

"Alan Minyard" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Dec 2003 16:05:30 GMT, "Kevin Brooks"
wrote:


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
t...

There may also be something wrong with those who take the actions and
rants
of the radical element and ascribe them to the majority.


I don't see much condemnation of the radical element from the majority.

Maybe you are suffering a bit of myopia, then. I guess you consider all
of
the Muslims in Turkey to be radicals? We have garnered the support of a
number of predominantly Muslim nations during our recent fight against
the
Taliban and AQ--Turkmenistan, Kyrgyzstan, Kazakhstan, Pakistan, and
Turkey
all contributed to that fight, as did IIRC Jordan with non-combat
support.
I'd think that qualifies as "condemnation" of the radicals, IMO. Not to
mention that lady who just picked up the Nobel Peace Prize.

Brooks

You mean the "lady" who viciously attacked the US and the west during
her acceptance rant (oops, speech)??

Hardly a peaceful person. The prize was an anti-American statement
on the part of the "committee".

I missed that. Regardless, there are plenty of Muslims who have not joined
the radical bandwagon, and as pointed out above there are quite a few Muslim
nations that have supported us over the last couple of years--add Qatar and
Kuwait to that list, as I apparently left them out. Turning this into a "us
versus Islam-at-large" confrontation does little good, and is in fact
incorrect.

Brooks


Al Minyard

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote
"Alan Minyard" wrote

And you know this how?? From Israeli polls? I am not saying that you are
incorrect, I am simply saying that I, and I believe you, do not really
know.


I base it on adherence to the Camp David Accords by Egypt and Israel. There
has been peace between Egypt and Israel since Egyptians decided to live in
peace alongside Israel. When Palestinians decide they can live in peace
alongside Israel there will be a peaceful Palestine alongside Israel.

Actually they don't. U.S. Forces are deployed in the Sinai between the two.
A few years ago they all got killed in a plane crash in Newfoundland on a
cheap two-bit airline because MAC didn't have enough crews to support
the worldwide deployments.

"Gene Storey" wrote in message
news:%Y9Eb.2174$6l1.184@okepread03...
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote
"Alan Minyard" wrote

And you know this how?? From Israeli polls? I am not saying that you
are
incorrect, I am simply saying that I, and I believe you, do not really
know.


I base it on adherence to the Camp David Accords by Egypt and Israel.
There
has been peace between Egypt and Israel since Egyptians decided to live
in
peace alongside Israel. When Palestinians decide they can live in peace
alongside Israel there will be a peaceful Palestine alongside Israel.

Actually they don't. U.S. Forces are deployed in the Sinai between the
two.
A few years ago they all got killed in a plane crash in Newfoundland on a
cheap two-bit airline because MAC didn't have enough crews to support
the worldwide deployments.

No, they (and it was not "all of them"--the MNF-Sinai is a battalion sized
force, and you are not fitting a battalion on a single DC-8) died in the
crash of that charter DC-8 at Gander because that is the way we routinely
move large numbers of troops--the AMC cargo haulers are better utilized
carrying the heavy boxes and rolling stock. And what's more, had you asked
any of those troops who unfortunately were onboard that aircraft which they
would prefer to make a trans-Atlantic redeployment on, a charter airliner or
a C-141, I guarandamntee you it would have been the former. Having done a
few long range deployments by both methods of conveyance, I'd have agreed
with them.

Brooks