Bullying desguised (badly) as precaution

One favorite saying that I repeat to students at our airport: "If you hang
around here long enough, you'll see something stupid happen every single
day." It's meant to keep students alert to what's going on around them and
to observe and learn from the mistakes of others. Hopefully, the student
will keep that in the back of his head and he'll ask himself "Is what I'm
about to do going to look stupid to another pilot? Is it stupid?" If the
noise abatement procedures are clearly posted and a pilot repeatedly ignores
the procedures for no good reason, then I would classify his actions as
described above and I can all but guarantee you that the well respected
pilots at the airport do not approve of it either. Should you resume your
training, your complaint may be met with more understanding by the other
pilots than by the airport management or the other officials. Peer pressure
can be stronger than official notices.

Good luck
Jim

I hope I won't need 5500 feet to land a C-172 or Piper! But...you never
know. As the saying goes, "Where you stand depends upon where you sit."

("Jim Burns" wrote)
[snip]
I personally can not tolerate neighbors. Not that I do not enjoy people,
but I am a rather private person. I do not like unannounced visitors,
salesmen, or even phone calls. When I'm at home, I want to be left alone.


Note to group - Jim's surprise Birthday Party is off indefinitely.


Montblack :-)

LMAO! Now Paul, I think I would at least know the date of it!!! So, you
really wouldn't suprise me... however you may be suprised if I just happened
to be out of town! )
Jim

On the flight training biz: Thanx for the advice. One of the local
schools trains on Pipers, another Cessnas. I'm over 6' too, and the old
152 i trained in years back doesn't leave an awful lot of head room or leg
room. I've never been in a Piper before. Cessna bills its Skylane as a
"stable, easy to fly" machine. Do you think that's true, and how would
the Piper compare?

The Skylane (Cessna 182) is a fine bird, but it's also a high-performance
plane, not generally used for primary training. Not to say that it can't be
done, but the per-hour rate on a Skylane is much higher than a 150/152.

Unless, by chance, did you mean a Skyhawk? That's a 172, and is often used
as a primary flight trainer. Good plane, very stable, low-powered, but
that's okay -- you can't get into too much trouble that way. It's a lot
roomier inside than a 152, being a 4-seater, and is more along the lines of
the Pipers I was recommending.

I trained in a Piper Cherokee 140, which they don't make anymore. Many
people train in a Piper Warrior (a "stretched" Cherokee 140), which is still
in production and is basically a Cessna 172 with the wing on the bottom.
Personally, I like riding on TOP of the wing, rather than hanging beneath
it -- but that's just a personal preference.

Either plane will give you more head/shoulder room than a 150/152, but will
cost commensurately more per hour to operate. I think the few extra bucks
per hour are worth not having to lay on top of your instructor -- unless
she's good looking... ;-)

(I'll be good (not that I won't ever go after the nefarious Phil Boyer
anymore); the rest of the group can thank Jay!)

Jeez, don't be too good -- who will we have to abuse? ;-) Seriously, over
time I think you will find pilots to be an outstanding group of people, for
the most part. Not to say that every group doesn't have bad apples, but
they are few and far between at airports, in my experience. Not only are
pilots my best friends, but I've built a business plan around them -- and
haven't been disappointed yet.

In closing, getting your pilot's certificate will be unlike anything you've
ever accomplished before -- I urge you to do it! That certificate, for me,
is far more significant and meaningful than my high school diploma, my
college degree, or any award or title of won, before or since.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:
Either plane will give you more head/shoulder room than a 150/152, but will
cost commensurately more per hour to operate. I think the few extra bucks
per hour are worth not having to lay on top of your instructor -- unless
she's good looking... ;-)


another advantage of the warrior or C172, is that once you have
your ticket, you are already flying an aircraft that is a lot
more capable than a C152; these are neat cross country aircraft
(well, at least for a while, some people are never satisfied),
i.e., you won't have to transition into a more capable aircraft
soon after the checkride.

--Sylvain

"Sylvain" wrote in message
...
Jay Honeck wrote:
Either plane will give you more head/shoulder room than a 150/152, but
will cost commensurately more per hour to operate. I think the few extra
bucks per hour are worth not having to lay on top of your instructor --
unless she's good looking... ;-)


another advantage of the warrior or C172, is that once you have
your ticket, you are already flying an aircraft that is a lot
more capable than a C152; these are neat cross country aircraft
(well, at least for a while, some people are never satisfied),
i.e., you won't have to transition into a more capable aircraft
soon after the checkride.

--Sylvain

Your local geography can play a part in this process too. Here in Arizona,
one must be very aware of density altitude issues. Some places are just not
reachable when it's hot and/or the destination is "high." I opted to train
in 180hp 172s for this very reason. Doesn't mean that I can discount
density altiude (far from it), but I don't run out of performance chart as
fast as I would with a 150/152 or lower powered Piper.

Just my $0.02 worth...

Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

another advantage of the warrior or C172, is that once you have
your ticket, you are already flying an aircraft that is a lot
more capable than a C152; these are neat cross country aircraft

Absolutely. I trained in a Cherokee 140, transitioned seamlessly to renting
Warriors after I got my ticket, and made the Warrior the first plane I
bought.

If my kids didn't get so danged big, I'd STILL be flying that Warrior. It's
a great plane -- just a bit underpowered if you have to fly with four real
people all the time.

Your local geography can play a part in this process too. Here in
Arizona, one must be very aware of density altitude issues.

Well, since Skylune is a New Yorker, I don't think he'll have to worry too
much about density altitude.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Peter Clark wrote:

On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 11:19:43 -0400, "newsgroups.comcast.net"
wrote:


As others have indicated, double tap refers to two shots fired body center
mass in rapid succession, followed up by one shot to the head (in case there
is body armor in play). This is standard defensive shooting methodology.
I've carried concealed for over thirty years, and fortunately have never had
to draw a weapon in defense, and hope I never have to. I have had several
times that I have had to "consider" it. If I was confronted with an enraged
man with a club (technically assault), coming at my daughter and myself, I
would have to "consider" my options, before battery resulted from the
assailant.


Including evaluating your options regarding fleeing the scene before
producing your weapon, right?


It doesn't sound like it got close to that point, only pointing out that if
the mall cop, (who I don't "believe" has any more legal standing than any
one else), kept coming with a club, then someone who could defend
themselves, may just do that.


The way I understand it, at least in the jurisdictions I'm familiar
with, you're only legally allowed to use the bare minimum force
necessary to deal with the oncoming assailant and escape, and if you
have the option to run, you're required to do that before shooting at
them, unless they also have a weapon with some range (a-la they have a
gun themselves). I don't think that shooting someone with a club who
is out of range of using it, who is not pursuing you, taking place in
an open area where you can run away would be justified homicide in
these parts.

I believe this is correct in most states, but, fortunately, no longer
true in Florida. I'm hoping other states will follow suit in the near
future as many did with the concealed carry laws. It is insane that I
should be expected to flee from somewhere that I have a right to be,
just because some perp is around.

Matt

Skylune wrote:

On the flight training biz: Thanx for the advice. One of the local
schools trains on Pipers, another Cessnas. I'm over 6' too, and the old
152 i trained in years back doesn't leave an awful lot of head room or leg
room. I've never been in a Piper before. Cessna bills its Skylane as a
"stable, easy to fly" machine. Do you think that's true, and how would
the Piper compare?

Consider then a 172 for training rather than a 150. It likely isn't
much more costly than a Cherokee.

Pipers are as easy to fly as the 1xx Cessnas, probably easier as they
don't really stall and you can see the runway while flying the pattern.
Some people seem to need to be able to do that, but I never could
figure out why as the runway isn't moving so when I roll out of my turn
it will be right where I expect it to be based on where I started my turn.

I'd much rather be able to easily see down while flying so that I can
keep an eye on emergency landing sites, than be able to see the runway
during a normal approach. I find emergency landing site selection much
more difficult in the Arrow I now fly as compared to the 182 I formerly
owned. The 182 also had a much better glide ratio, landed more easily,
took off more easily (the Arrow will over rotate, so you have to relax
pitch as soon as the wheels break ground), and was more responsive in
all axes of control. It also had much more rudder authority for forward
slips and side slips for cross wind landings. I rarely had to use full
rudder on the Skylane, but it isn't hard to run out of rudder on the
Arrow. I think a lot of the issue with the Arrow is that it seems to
have a lot more friction in the control system than the Cessnas, so if
you don't keep things lubed up often, the control column gets pretty
sticky, especially in pitch.

Having said that, the Arrow is much better than not flying at all, but
I'll take a Cessna any day ... especially a rainy day. :-)

Matt