Questions for you glass-panel folks

On Wed, 05 Mar 2008 15:42:20 -0600, Gig 601XL Builder
wrote:

xyzzy wrote:


A better analogy would be requiring all new computer programmers to
learn assembler, which as far as I know they still do. You still have
to learn the basics before you can learn the modern stuff.


A pilot coming on now could very easily fly all his life and never see a
working ADF in an aircraft.

But don't throw out the old Loran just yet. They are talking about
mandating LORAN as the ground based backup for GPS and getting rid of
the VORs along with the NDBs. I liked NDBs as there is always
something around on which you can get a fix..
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 22:15:37 GMT, Benjamin Dover
wrote:

Mxsmanic wrote in
news
Dylan Smith writes:

And you wonder why they still code buffer overflows into their C code
and C++ code?

It isn't because they don't know assembler. They just aren't very
good programmers.

Any programmers, certainly any writing C or C++, need to have had
exposure to assembly language.

Too time-consuming and completely unnecessary.

Knowledge at the raw iron level is also very useful when debugging C
code. You won't have debug symbols for everything (or indeed source
code for everything).

Modern debuggers make this largely unnecessary, and writing code
carefully to begin with greatly diminishes the need for debugging and
the complexity of doing so.

No wonder you couldn't make a living as a programmer.

Lordy, Some of those beginning students could write code I couldn't
figure out and I was a GA working on my Masters. Nothing like working
with pointers and not understanding what's going on.:-))
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 14:28:17 -0600, Rich Ahrens
wrote:

Dylan Smith wrote:
On 2008-03-05, Dan wrote:
A better analogy would be requiring all new computer programmers to
learn assembler, which as far as I know they still do. You still have
to learn the basics before you can learn the modern stuff.
Nope.

There may be one that I know in a company of +500.

And you wonder why they still code buffer overflows into their C code
and C++ code?

There's nothing like stepping through assembler and seeing your code
munch the return address on the stack to understand why it's so
important to do basic things like check buffers.

I agree, but let's take it further - make them learn to microprogram the
raw silicon to implement the instruction set!

Introduction to Logic Design by Shiva plus a 4 credit course in
Boolean Algebra.
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Real Computers are cooled by freon.

"Rich Ahrens" wrote in message
ouse.com...
Darkwing wrote:
The first computer I owned was a nightmare, it had no hard drive, you had
to load all the operating system with disks everytime you booted it up,
most of the commands were done in DOS. That pales in comparison to a new
computer with WinXP, but I wouldn't go back to what I used to have to do
just because it worked well at the time but I have always liked new
technology, it keeps me interested.

You had disks? Paper tape and punch cards were an advance - I remember
having to load the boot loader in machine code via the front panel
switches...

On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 11:40:03 -0500, "Darkwing"
theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com wrote:


"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...
On 5 Mar, 17:05, "Jay Honeck" wrote:
2. Assuming that it is, has the FAA considering a new, simplified
curriculum
for obtaining an IR in a glass cockpit?

Until there is zero possibility of things going tango-uniform, and you
ending up using the backup steam gauges, I seriously doubt the FAA will
reduce the requirements.

Simplifying doesn't necessarily mean a reduction in requirements. Rather,
I
am wondering if they will change the required tests to more accurately
reflect the reality of flying a glass cockpit plane.

If I'm remembering correctly, the lion's share of the written test covered
VOR and NDB interpretation. After flying the G1000, it seems that testing
a
student on his ability to chase needles on a VOR would be like requiring
all
new computer programmers to learn Cobol. The skill set that the FAA is
testing doesn't seem to fit the reality of flying the new technology.

I suppose the same thing happened when the old A/N radio ranges were
supplanted by the VORs?

This is depressing beyond words. Another advocate for dumming
down....

Bertie

The first computer I owned was a nightmare, it had no hard drive, you had to
load all the operating system with disks everytime you booted it up, most of
the commands were done in DOS. That pales in comparison to a new computer
with WinXP, but I wouldn't go back to what I used to have to do just because
it worked well at the time but I have always liked new technology, it keeps
me interested.

Ah, my old Ohio Scientific C2-8P. A one MHz 6502, 48K of dynamic ram
(16K X1 at 30 some bucks a chip) and dual 8" floppy drives. Cost me 4
Grand WITHOUT a monitor or keyboard. Those I had to find on my own.
You booted it by entering Go 800 (I think) and then typing in the
address for the disk drive as well as the track and sector to start
(IIRC) That was 1979 or 80.

Today I can build up two multi core, state of the art machines with
big time graphics cards, 4 Gig of at least DDR2-800 RAM, and a
Terabyte of HD space and my OS on a 10,000 RPM Raptor. I think I could
even include the 22" wide screen monitors and do it for less than that
C2-8P.

My first HD cost a $100 a megabyte. Tonight I installed a heavy duty
750 Gig HD that cost 26 cents a Gigabyte. IOW a 10 Meg drive cost me
a thousand bucks in the early 80's and I just picked up a WD RE
version of the 750 Gig for $200. Were I to settle for the SE version
and shop around I could get it for around $140. Actually there were
one Terabyte drives available for about $240 or 24 cents a Gig.
A little over a year ago I paid near $300 for 2 Gigs of DDR-2 800 (PC
6400) RAM. Now I can get the same stuff (make and model) for less
than $100. Actually 4 Gigs is around $140. Check NewEgg. sigh

One thing to remember about the new technology. When it comes to
small planes that tech is still a small fraction of what's out there.
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 14:31:16 -0600, Rich Ahrens
wrote:

Darkwing wrote:
The first computer I owned was a nightmare, it had no hard drive, you had to
load all the operating system with disks everytime you booted it up, most of
the commands were done in DOS. That pales in comparison to a new computer
with WinXP, but I wouldn't go back to what I used to have to do just because
it worked well at the time but I have always liked new technology, it keeps
me interested.

You had disks? Paper tape and punch cards were an advance - I remember
having to load the boot loader in machine code via the front panel
switches...

Ohhhhh...Lordy... We had those on the old Westinghouse P2000s at work.
Most had 8K, but a couple had 16K of core memory. It took nearly two
hours to boot the system. We had Teflon coated paper tape for
durability. Besides, in that atmosphere paper didn't last very long
at all. It's a wonder we did.

IIRC we paid nearly a quarter million each. Just a few years later we
purchased a "truckload" of them for parts at $450. I bought one to
play with for $30.


Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Wed, 05 Mar 2008 22:19:02 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
wrote:

Jay which version of MSFS are you running? By your specs the system
could support FSX.

Yep, we're running FSX. The Mooney that comes with FSX has the G1000
system built-in.

Did you notice much change with the new 8800GTS?

Yes. We are running multiple screens with very good performance.

One of my machines has the 8800GTS 640OC and the other a Saphire
X1950XT 256. The Saphire is noticably faster in either machine than
the 8800GTS 640OC when running FSX

I'm waiting for the 8800GT to be released with all its features
enabled. It's smaller, faster, and uses about half the power of the
GTS. (and costs far less than the GTS, let alone the 640OC.)
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

WingFlaps wrote:
On Mar 7, 9:31 am, Rich Ahrens wrote:
Darkwing wrote:
The first computer I owned was a nightmare, it had no hard drive, you had to
load all the operating system with disks everytime you booted it up, most of
the commands were done in DOS. That pales in comparison to a new computer
with WinXP, but I wouldn't go back to what I used to have to do just because
it worked well at the time but I have always liked new technology, it keeps
me interested.
You had disks? Paper tape and punch cards were an advance - I remember
having to load the boot loader in machine code via the front panel
switches...

PDP11 or IBM360 perhaps?

I originally learned to program on a 360, yes, using punch cards. Used
paper tape on both PDP-8s and PDP-11s.

The front panel play was a PDP-8. Someone actually posted a video on the
net of booting one by loading the boot loader on the front panel:

http://www.pdp8.net/pdp8em/pdp8e.rm

That's only two instructions, the sequence for loading from an RK05 disk:

http://www.pdp8.net/rk05/rk05.jpg

That drive would astound folks today. The capacity of each removable
disk pack was 1.6 million 12-bit words on a 14-inch platter. The drive
weighed more than 100 lbs. The boot loader required entering more
instructions if you were booting from paper or mag tape.

Actually, come to think of it, I had to use front panel switches for
booting in some cases on a Microdata Reality, too:

http://www.microdata-alumni.org/imag...fullsystem.jpg

In article O6zzj.62598$yE1.27408@attbi_s21,
"Jay Honeck" wrote:

My questions a

1. For those who fly instruments behind a glass panel, is the depiction of
the G1000 in MS Flight Simulator close to accurate? Is it REALLY that
easy?

When everything is working, yeah, pretty much. Trick is, that
simplicity is a two-edged sword because when things break you may have
to be able to fall back and do things the old fashioned way, and that
can get to be much harder if you've gotten used to the easy way.

rg

In article ,
Rich Ahrens wrote:

http://www.pdp8.net/rk05/rk05.jpg

That drive would astound folks today. The capacity of each removable
disk pack was 1.6 million 12-bit words on a 14-inch platter. The drive
weighed more than 100 lbs.

And it required head realignment and new air filters as part of routine
periodic maintenance. Oh, those were the days!