Q: PBY

The owner of a restored ex-houseboat PBY told me that its landing gear
was added after the war. Maybe the various installations reflect
whatever surplus equipment was available.

In article ,
Rolf Blom wrote:

http://www.sa-transport.co.za/aircra...by-5a_ra98.JPG

This is a PBY-5A. You can see the outline of the nosewheel door. That
large circle on the side of the fuselage is where the mainwheel retracts
into. The aircraft that used beaching gear did not have the opening for
the mainwheel. Go here for a pic of a PBY on beaching gear:
http://www.pbycat.org/mainp.htm

I doubt that it would be possible for a Catalina to be able to take
off with the beaching wheels, They were not made for that kind of
speed on land. In fact, in the water you'd never get up enough speed
either, it would be like dragging two anchors.

Even the information on the picture states it is a -5A and can be
confirmed by running the registration number through the FAA database.
The shadow on the picture obscures the outline of the wheel well on
the side of the aircraft, the wheel was exposed when retracted, only
the strut was covered by doors, much the same as other aircraft such
as the Goose and Albatross.

The reason for the creation of an amphibian seaplane was that being
strictly a seaplane meant limiting its areas of operations. Many
locations in the world do not have or would it be feasible to create
beaching facilities. Having to haul the beaching gear and crews was
also unpractical. The amphibian could use inland runways to stop for/
deliver fuel/supplies. Remember the more time spent in salt water the
greater risk for corrosion which adds to operational maintenance. Its
nice to be able to land on water when needed but it has its drawbacks
too.

When Kermit Weeks brought his Sunderland from the UK to the US, he had
to provide for the logistics of landing on bodies of water large
enough which also had good water surface conditions plus access to
refueling facilities capable of supporting such a large aircraft at
each stop of the journey. Had he had an emergency, he might not been
able to find a spot with suitable water conditions...ever been in a
small boat in rough water. Its harder in an airplane!

Fortunately the Sunderland made the trek stopping and over wintering
in Oshkosh until the pond/lake at his new Florida facility was ready
for its arrival. They installed the beaching gear and parked it at a
boat storage area in a local marina.

On Feb 27, 7:12*am, Rolf Blom wrote:
On 2008-02-27 06:47, John Keeney wrote:





On Feb 26, 8:14 am, Rolf Blom wrote:
On 2008-02-26 05:59, John Keeney wrote:

On Feb 25, 10:56 pm, Dale wrote:
In article ,
*Peter Twydell wrote:

In message
,
Hawkeye writes
On Feb 25, 4:24 pm, Cubdriver usenet AT danford DOT net wrote:
Here is a photo on Wiki that shows how the outer wing floats
(pontoons) can swing up, so that *the pontoon becomes the wingtip.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...K_RNZAF_Catali...

That has got to be the case with your photo. A larger question is:
where's the tail wheel? *Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:30:54 -0800 (PST), William Hung

wrote:
http://www.sa-transport.co.za/aircra...by-5a_ra98.JPG

OK, I've seen pictures of PBYs with;

1. All three gears down and the outer potoons down,
2. All gears down, potoons up,
3. Gears up, potoons down,
4. and now the above picture with only the main gears down, but nose
wheel still tucked in and pontoons still up or maybe no pontoons.

My question are; are the gears controlled individually, are the
pontoons controlled separately, are the font and main gears controlled
separately also? *If so, why?

Wil

Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
new from HarperCollinswww.FlyingTigersBook.com

It is a tricycle geared aircraft Dan...the question is...where is the
nose gear!

No, it isn't. It's a PBY-5, not a PBY-5A. The wheels alongside the
fuselage are beaching gear, not landing gear. No mainwheels, no nose
gear.

Comparisons he
http://www.catalina.org.nz/what%20is%20a%20PBY.htm
The photo of the PBY-2 shows the beaching gear.

Looks like a 5a to me, you can see the outline of the still closed
nosewheel door.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Peter's right, Dale. There's no place to retract those "main wheels"
and it is sitting tail heavy on a stand.
Not to mention the older style tail.

Interesting thread, I always liked the PBY.

I see that the catalina.org.nz states: "all surviving operational
aircraft are amphibians".

I think I found a likely reference to the OP's plane in a PBY survivors
list at the Catalina society;http://www.catalina.org.uk/catalina-...2_articleid/23

C/n 1656 from that list, matches the one in the photo, but with slightly
different registration: N9521C
(the Photo text has N952ZIC - that may simply be a misspelling)

In any case with that C/n, the plane is listed as a PBY5a, just as the
photo says, so it's an amphibian, owned by 'Training Services Inc TA',
based at Virginia Beach.

Anyone living nearby & so inclined could perhaps go and ask about the
nose gear?

/Rolf- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Maybe we're looking at different pictures. There's been more than one
posted here.
Which URL are you referring to?

Perhaps, I was referring to this picture, with a retracted nosewheel:http://www.sa-transport.co.za/aircra...by-5a_ra98.JPG

/Rolf- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

OK, different picture.

On Feb 26, 1:17*pm, Peter Twydell wrote:
In message
,
William Hung writes





On Feb 25, 11:59*pm, John Keeney wrote:
On Feb 25, 10:56*pm, Dale wrote:

In article ,
*Peter Twydell wrote:

In message
,
Hawkeye writes
On Feb 25, 4:24 pm, Cubdriver usenet AT danford DOT net wrote:
Here is a photo on Wiki that shows how the outer wing floats
(pontoons) can swing up, so that *the pontoon becomes the wingtip.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...K_RNZAF_Catali...

That has got to be the case with your photo. A larger question is:
where's the tail wheel? *Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:30:54 -0800 (PST), William Hung

wrote:

http://www.sa-transport.co.za/aircra...by-5a_ra98.JPG

OK, I've seen pictures of PBYs with;

1. All three gears down and the outer potoons down,
2. All gears down, potoons up,
3. Gears up, potoons down,
4. and now the above picture with only the main gears down, but nose
wheel still tucked in and pontoons still up or maybe no pontoons.

My question are; are the gears controlled individually, are the
pontoons controlled separately, are the font and main gears

separately also? *If so, why?

Wil

Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
new from HarperCollinswww.FlyingTigersBook.com

It is a tricycle geared aircraft Dan...the question is...where is the
nose gear!

No, it isn't. It's a PBY-5, not a PBY-5A. The wheels alongside the
fuselage are beaching gear, not landing gear. No mainwheels, no nose
gear.

Comparisons he
http://www.catalina.org.nz/what%20is%20a%20PBY.htm
The photo of the PBY-2 shows the beaching gear.

Looks like a 5a to me, you can see the outline of the still closed
nosewheel door.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Peter's right, Dale. There's no place to retract those "main wheels"
and it is sitting tail heavy on a stand.
Not to mention the older style tail.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yeah, Peter's right and like Mortimer said, this place is great for
learning about aviation.

Wil

It's nice to know one's efforts are appreciated.

I try to give credit where credit is due. :-)


I was able to put my pedant/nitpicker hat on here as a result of
converting the Airfix PBY-5A to a USN PBY-5 many years ago. Plugged the
wheel wells with balsa, smoothed over with a mixture of talc and clear
dope. Blue Gray/Light Gray camo with tail stripes and national insignia,
all hand painted.


What was the reasoning for the reversal?

A share in the Catalina at Duxford was available for about GBP 17k last
year. Bit beyond my budget at the moment!
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Think I came across that also, in barnstormer,com or maybe it was
Ebay. The 17k was doable, the monthly upkeep wasn't. The fact that
they were across the big pond didn't help.

Wil

On Feb 27, 12:58*pm, Hawkeye wrote:
I doubt that it would be possible for a Catalina to be able to take
off with the beaching wheels, They were not made for that kind of
speed on land. In fact, in the water you'd never get up enough speed
either, it would be like dragging two anchors.

Even the information on the picture states it is a -5A and can be
confirmed by running the registration number through the FAA database.
The shadow on the picture obscures the outline of the wheel well on
the side of the aircraft, the wheel was exposed when retracted, only
the strut was covered by doors, much the same as other aircraft such
as the Goose and Albatross.

The reason for the creation of an amphibian seaplane was that being
strictly a seaplane meant limiting its areas of operations. Many
locations in the world do not have or would it be feasible to create
beaching facilities. Having to haul the beaching gear and crews was
also unpractical. The amphibian could use inland runways to stop for/
deliver fuel/supplies. Remember the more time spent in salt water the
greater risk for corrosion which adds to operational maintenance. Its
nice to be able to land on water when needed but it has its drawbacks
too.

When Kermit Weeks brought his Sunderland from the UK to the US, he had
to provide for the logistics of landing on bodies of water large
enough which also had good water surface conditions plus access to
refueling facilities capable of supporting such a large aircraft at
each stop of the journey. Had he had an emergency, he might not been
able to find a spot with suitable water conditions...ever been in a
small boat in rough water. Its harder in an airplane!

Fortunately the Sunderland made the trek stopping and over wintering
in Oshkosh until the pond/lake at his new Florida facility was ready
for its arrival. They installed the beaching gear and parked it at a
boat storage area in a local marina.

Cool... Yeah amphibian would be the way to go.

Wil

In message
,
William Hung writes
On Feb 26, 1:17*pm, Peter Twydell wrote:
In message
,
William Hung writes





On Feb 25, 11:59*pm, John Keeney wrote:
On Feb 25, 10:56*pm, Dale wrote:

In article ,
*Peter Twydell wrote:

In message
,
Hawkeye writes
On Feb 25, 4:24 pm, Cubdriver usenet AT danford DOT net wrote:
Here is a photo on Wiki that shows how the outer wing floats
(pontoons) can swing up, so that *the pontoon becomes the wingtip.



http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...K_RNZAF_Catali...

That has got to be the case with your photo. A larger question is:
where's the tail wheel? *Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:30:54 -0800 (PST), William Hung

wrote:



http://www.sa-transport.co.za/aircra...by-5a_ra98.JPG

OK, I've seen pictures of PBYs with;

1. All three gears down and the outer potoons down,
2. All gears down, potoons up,
3. Gears up, potoons down,
4. and now the above picture with only the main gears
down, but nose
wheel still tucked in and pontoons still up or maybe no pontoons.

My question are; are the gears controlled individually, are the
pontoons controlled separately, are the font and main gears

separately also? *If so, why?

Wil

Blue skies! -- Dan Ford

Claire Chennault and His American Volunteers, 1941-1942
new from HarperCollinswww.FlyingTigersBook.com

It is a tricycle geared aircraft Dan...the question is...where is the
nose gear!

No, it isn't. It's a PBY-5, not a PBY-5A. The wheels alongside the
fuselage are beaching gear, not landing gear. No mainwheels, no nose
gear.

Comparisons he
http://www.catalina.org.nz/what%20is%20a%20PBY.htm
The photo of the PBY-2 shows the beaching gear.

Looks like a 5a to me, you can see the outline of the still closed
nosewheel door.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Peter's right, Dale. There's no place to retract those "main wheels"
and it is sitting tail heavy on a stand.
Not to mention the older style tail.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yeah, Peter's right and like Mortimer said, this place is great for
learning about aviation.

Wil

It's nice to know one's efforts are appreciated.

I try to give credit where credit is due. :-)


I was able to put my pedant/nitpicker hat on here as a result of
converting the Airfix PBY-5A to a USN PBY-5 many years ago. Plugged the
wheel wells with balsa, smoothed over with a mixture of talc and clear
dope. Blue Gray/Light Gray camo with tail stripes and national insignia,
all hand painted.


What was the reasoning for the reversal?

It was a newly-released kit, and I wanted to do something other than the
standard all-white or greygreen/white RAF/RCAF colours. ISTR there was
no kit of the -5 at the time. I thought the USN colour scheme was cool.

There were two Cats at a show at Duxford a while back, when the Dutch
one from Lelystad came over. Quite a sight.

A share in the Catalina at Duxford was available for about GBP 17k last
year. Bit beyond my budget at the moment!
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Think I came across that also, in barnstormer,com or maybe it was
Ebay. The 17k was doable, the monthly upkeep wasn't. The fact that
they were across the big pond didn't help.

Wil

The only part I can do easily is access, as Duxford is only some 40
minutes' drive from here. Less if the roads are clear and I'm very
naughty...
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!

Originally Posted by Bob Martin

Morgans wrote :
My question are; are the gears controlled individually, are the
pontoons controlled separately, are the font and main gears controlled
separately also? If so, why?

Maybe it's a case of one gear (nose in this case) retracting before the others? I've
noticed many airplanes where each gear retracts at different rates, or one part of the
gear retracts before the others. I think it just has to do with how the hydraulics are
run and all that. Not sure about this case though.

Gears :
You are right.
It is a sequence, to lighten the burden of the pump :
1. Nose gear (283 lb),
2. (Right) main gear (747 lb),
3. (Left) main gear (747 lb).

You clearly see it on videos.



Floats :
Both floats are actuated together by a single power gear box.

J-Chris.