Handhelds and alkaline batteries

I have an old (12 years) Sporty's A300 that uses 6 cells, and now I have the
new model with 8 cells. It runs a lot longer.

I think it is more a voltage issue rather than a current issue, but 33% more
batteries makes the radio last more than 200% longer.



"Ross Oliver" wrote in message
...

I recently purchased an Icom A23 Sport handheld transceiver, which
uses 6 AA alkaline batteries rather than the rechargable NiCad.
I chose the Sport model because I plan to use it primarily as an
emergency backup, the alkalines will hold a charge much longer than
the NiCads. The radio receives great, but it will not transmit
at all. Even with brand new name-brand batteries, the "low battery"
warning comes on as soon as I key the PTT, and the transmission is
so badly clipped that it is unreadable. I'm guessing that the alkalines
simply cannot provide enough current to adequately power the transmitter.

Has anyone else tried transmitting using a handheld powered by alkalines,
either the A23 or any of the other brands? I'm thinking about trying the
Sporty's model next. It uses 8 AA rather than the A23's 6.


Ross Oliver

my ICOM A-22 has a battery pack that holds 10 AA batteries, and no problems,
lasts about a 5 hr day of soaring. I use a 1500mAh NiMH pack and carry the
AA battery pack as a back-up when I forget to charge the NiMH.

The NiMH will last for days..

BT

"Ross Oliver" wrote in message
...

I recently purchased an Icom A23 Sport handheld transceiver, which
uses 6 AA alkaline batteries rather than the rechargable NiCad.
I chose the Sport model because I plan to use it primarily as an
emergency backup, the alkalines will hold a charge much longer than
the NiCads. The radio receives great, but it will not transmit
at all. Even with brand new name-brand batteries, the "low battery"
warning comes on as soon as I key the PTT, and the transmission is
so badly clipped that it is unreadable. I'm guessing that the alkalines
simply cannot provide enough current to adequately power the transmitter.

Has anyone else tried transmitting using a handheld powered by alkalines,
either the A23 or any of the other brands? I'm thinking about trying the
Sporty's model next. It uses 8 AA rather than the A23's 6.


Ross Oliver

"Jim Weir" wrote

Try www.thomasdistributing.com Probably the best price in the country.

Jim

How about the "quest" brand at walmart? Less than 9 bucks for 4 1500mah
AA's. Can they beat that?

--
---Jim in NC---

"Chris W" wrote in message
...
Jim Weir wrote:

Alkalines have a problem when you get to the power levels we are talking
about
for transmit. They last a mercifully short time in most HTs. We've
found that
popping for the NiMH cells is far better from a time and life point of
view.

For an emergency only radio, NiMH are about the worst battery to use.
They have a
self discharge rate of 10% per day. The Lithium Ions are the next best
then
NiCd. Of course the self discharge rate of alkaline batteries are a lot
better
than any of the rechargeable but they don't do well with high current
loads that
some electronic equipment need. The non rechargeable Lithium batteries
are the
best in that regard, they last a long time, lowest self discharge rate of
any
battery and they can take the high current loads, the only down side is
they are
expensive, especially if you go to the corner drug store where they some
times will
charge $8 or more each, if you look around on the internet you can get
them for
less than $2 each. Of course that doesn't do much good if your radio
doesn't have
a pack that will take the CR123 lithium batteries.


--
Chris Woodhouse
Oklahoma City

"They that can give up essential liberty
to obtain a little temporary safety

Chris, can you quote a source on the 10% discharge per day on the NiMH? I
have not found that to be the case.
--
---Jim in NC---

Morgans wrote:

Chris, can you quote a source on the 10% discharge per day on the NiMH? I
have not found that to be the case.
--
---Jim in NC---

http://www.allegromicro.com/techpub2/cadex/index32.htm

apperently I didn't remember the details exactly right but the fact that NiMH
have a very bad self discharge rate is true. In fact rechargable batteries as a
group have a self discharge rate that is a lot worse than most non rechargable
batteries.

--
Chris Woodhouse
Oklahoma City

"They that can give up essential liberty
to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin, 1759 Historical Review of Pennsylvania

I don't own Energizer (ENR) or Duracell (G) stock and I don't think Jay
does
either. We just stopped by the closest battery booth and that's what was
readily available for alkalines.

Yeah -- for some bizarre reason, the guy who sold me the ICOM said that
Duracell brand alkaline batteries were just a tad too long to fit in the
ICOM battery box properly.

I haven't measured them with a micrometer (yet!), but it sure sounded goofy
to Greg and me. Nevertheless, I didn't risk it and bought some "Brand X"
alkaline batteries from the next "Batteries Plus"-kinda place we ran across.
Even *those* batteries fit quite tightly -- but they work just fine.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay, any problems with either new radio or the other goodies?

Nope. The ICOM A5 works as advertised, and is WAY better than my old (and
ten-times bigger) ICOM A21. I can clearly and easily receive Iowa City
AWOS from my home with this thing -- something that was very scratchy and
intermittent with the old model.

And the new NARCO 810R -- the slide-in replacement for our old NARCO 120
com -- has been truly wonderful. Once we located the proper sized allen
wrench (thanks again, Greg -- I've still got your wrench set!), it literally
slid right into the tray where the 120 used to live -- and has worked
perfectly ever since.

It's digital, transmissions are crystal clear, it's flip-flop, and -- best
of all -- it's got 10 memory pre-sets that I can actually access in flight!
(Unlike our old TKM MX170B, that required an awkward simultaneous
2-button-push that was virtually impossible in even light turbulence.)

And the AvMap continues to just blow us away. We just got back from a
flight over to Pella (a neat old-world Dutch settlement) with the kids, and
we just couldn't stop raving about it. What an amazing tool this thing is!

--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Most likely your problem is poor contact somewhere in the battery/holder/
power switch series string. The radio gets enough current to receive OK,
but the heavy draw of transmitting causes the voltage to drop to the point
that the radio will no longer operate. Try a different set of batteries
(only one bad one will cause the problem), and make sure that all are
seated properly in the holder and that the contacts apply firm pressure
against the terminals. A bad power switch can cause the same symptoms.

I have used my Icom A2 with an aftermarket AA battery pack for years with
good results. Always carry a spare set of cells. They will keep for several
years.

Nicads are fine but you must exercise them. The right way to treat a Nicad
is to run it down then charge it up ASAP - at least once a week, and
preferably daily. Letting it sit for months will kill it, as will leaving
it on the charger all the time.

On Wed, 06 Aug 2003 18:05:01 GMT, Larry Fransson
wrote:

In article ,
(Ross Oliver) wrote:

Has anyone else tried transmitting using a handheld powered by alkalines,
either the A23 or any of the other brands?

My King KX-99 works fine on alkaline batteries.

ditto for my KX-99

Jim Weir wrote in
:

Alkalines have a problem when you get to the power levels we are
talking about for transmit. They last a mercifully short time in most
HTs. We've found that popping for the NiMH cells is far better from a
time and life point of view.

The trouble with NiMH in a handheld used for emergencies (i.e. toss it
into the flight bag and forget it) is the HORRIBLE self-discharge rate.
Basically you need to recharge then every couple of months - especially
if they are kept in a warm environment. [Worst case self-discharge rate
is listed at 3% per day!!! NiCad is almost as bad, at 1% per day.
Note that both of these are WORST CASE.]

Alkalines are great at shelf life, but as Jim (furture govenor) says,
they may not support the current draw during transmit.

Two possible tests:

1. Put a scope directly on the battery pack during transmit - if you can
see the modulation (or any significant change), that's the problem.

2. If the result of step 1 is that you actually see the modulation (as
opposed to the overall voltage simply dropping too low) then it might be
possible to rig a super-cap across the battery.

What's the transmit power of that little handheld supposed to be anyway?

-----------------------------------------------
James M. Knox
TriSoft ph 512-385-0316
1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331
Austin, Tx 78721
-----------------------------------------------