Back up Flight Recorder for US contests

I need help interpreting the 2006 rules regarding the above subject.
The rules do not discuss a back up flight recorder.
What options exist for a backup flight recorder that would be
excepted across the board in US contests for none team use.
Udo
PS. If you have a used GPS Nav 20 or 25 let me know.

Hi Udo

Is a backup needed? My GPS Nav has worked flawlessly for the last 10
years {:))

I need help interpreting the 2006 rules regarding the above subject.
The rules do not discuss a back up flight recorder.
What options exist for a backup flight recorder that would be excepted
across the board in US contests for none team use.
Udo
PS. If you have a used GPS Nav 20 or 25 let me know.

--

Hello Charles,
mine has worked flawlessly for many years as well.
I would like to have a second Nav / PDA system.
It should generates a flight log that is acceptable
as a back up for contests in the US.
If you like to know, I had a bit of a hick up in Florida with
my PDA I got it resolved in time but I wish, at that moment, I had
a second set-up. Having invested time and money for a contest
it could ruin an otherwise pleasant outing.
Udo

Hi Udo

Is a backup needed? My GPS Nav has worked flawlessly for the last 10
years {:))

I need help interpreting the 2006 rules regarding the above subject.
The rules do not discuss a back up flight recorder.
What options exist for a backup flight recorder that would be excepted
across the board in US contests for none team use.
Udo
PS. If you have a used GPS Nav 20 or 25 let me know.

--

Udo Rumpf wrote:

I need help interpreting the 2006 rules regarding the above subject.
The rules do not discuss a back up flight recorder.
What options exist for a backup flight recorder that would be excepted
across the board in US contests for none team use.
Udo
PS. If you have a used GPS Nav 20 or 25 let me know.

You can use an off-the-shelf GPS unit (handheld, or track log capable
Bluetooth device) that records GPS altitude as a primary or backup
recorder, at any SSA sanctioned contest. You'll need to avoid cutting
the start altitude too close, to allow for the fact that GPS altitude
may be as much as 500 feet higher than indicated pressure altitude, due
to normal pressure altimetry errors.

Marc

Udo,

I had the same issue as you and couldn't justify spending another
$800-$1000 for a "backup" (equal to one family vacation). So, I went
and bought a Garmin GPSMap76 for $130 on eBay. Best investment I ever
made! Advantages:

- Self-contained logger and display. So, no interface issues,
cables, software conflicts, etc.
- If you spend the time to get familiar with it, you can input a task,
set arrival radius, etc. It's easy to zoom in our out, and you can add
various maps to the background if you want to get fancy.
- Compact, so easy to mount. I molded a small cradle from plexiglas
and used the camera mounting holes provided in my LS8. RAM makes all
sorts of very slick mounts if you want something more elegant.
- It has been 100% reliable over the last year. In fact, it has been
so much easier to use when submitting OLC claims (given the recent VALI
issues) that it has been my primary logger for that purpose.
- As Marc cautions below, you need to be aware of the altitude
differences between barometric altitude and GPS altitude on anything
other than an ISA day. I have mine set up to show GPS Altitude on the
pointer screen itself; that way you have access to it in case you find
your Cambridge has gone down.
- You will need to have SeeYou, G72Win, or an equivalent program to
download and create an IGC format file.
- I use 2 rechargable 2500mAh rechargeable AA batteries which are good
for at least 6 hours each. I just swap 2 pairs each day during the
contest and I'm all set. I keep a spare pair of alkalines in the side
pouch just in case.

Hope this works for you.

Erik Mann (P3)

You might check with Tom Stowers...he had one at High
Country Soaring for several years.

Papa3 wrote:

I had the same issue as you and couldn't justify spending another
$800-$1000 for a "backup" (equal to one family vacation). So, I went
and bought a Garmin GPSMap76 for $130 on eBay. Best investment I ever
made!

That works very well for me, too. Get the GPSMAP 76-S, with the
barometric sensor and compass. A few bucks more but better altitude
readings.


Advantages:

- Self-contained logger and display. So, no interface issues,
cables, software conflicts, etc.
- If you spend the time to get familiar with it, you can input a task,
set arrival radius, etc. It's easy to zoom in our out, and you can add
various maps to the background if you want to get fancy.
- Compact, so easy to mount. I molded a small cradle from plexiglas
and used the camera mounting holes provided in my LS8. RAM makes all
sorts of very slick mounts if you want something more elegant.
- It has been 100% reliable over the last year. In fact, it has been
so much easier to use when submitting OLC claims (given the recent VALI
issues) that it has been my primary logger for that purpose.
- As Marc cautions below, you need to be aware of the altitude
differences between barometric altitude and GPS altitude on anything
other than an ISA day. I have mine set up to show GPS Altitude on the
pointer screen itself; that way you have access to it in case you find
your Cambridge has gone down.
- You will need to have SeeYou, G72Win, or an equivalent program to
download and create an IGC format file.
- I use 2 rechargable 2500mAh rechargeable AA batteries which are good
for at least 6 hours each. I just swap 2 pairs each day during the
contest and I'm all set. I keep a spare pair of alkalines in the side
pouch just in case.

Hope this works for you.

Erik Mann (P3)

Jack wrote:
That works very well for me, too. Get the GPSMAP 76-S, with the
barometric sensor and compass. A few bucks more but better altitude
readings.

Careful, the pressure sensor equipped Garmins don't necessarily provide
"better" or "more accurate" altitude, at best, they provide "smoother"
altitude readings. Plus, if you get the calibration mode wrong, they
can give very poor results...

Marc

Marc Ramsey wrote:
Jack wrote:
That works very well for me, too. Get the GPSMAP 76-S, with the
barometric sensor and compass. A few bucks more but better altitude
readings.

Careful, the pressure sensor equipped Garmins don't necessarily provide
"better" or "more accurate" altitude, at best, they provide "smoother"
altitude readings. Plus, if you get the calibration mode wrong, they
can give very poor results...

And how would we know which of the readings in the cockpit was more
accurate? We know better than to believe the altimeter on the panel when
it comes to consistent accuracy. I'll take GPS, properly calibrated to
barometric, if only because that's what goes in the file.

For OLC, why spend more?


Jack

Jack wrote:
Marc Ramsey wrote:
Careful, the pressure sensor equipped Garmins don't necessarily
provide "better" or "more accurate" altitude, at best, they provide
"smoother" altitude readings. Plus, if you get the calibration mode
wrong, they can give very poor results...

And how would we know which of the readings in the cockpit was more
accurate? We know better than to believe the altimeter on the panel when
it comes to consistent accuracy. I'll take GPS, properly calibrated to
barometric, if only because that's what goes in the file.

You have it backwards, it is barometric calibrated to GPS, if you have
it set up properly. Otherwise, it is just a slightly more inaccurate
than normal altimeter, with an arbitrary setting (unless you are, again,
very careful) and no calibration. And, there is no way to tell from the
track log or the IGC file what mode was actually used.

For OLC, why spend more?

I'm actually suggesting spend less, go with the units that lack pressure
sensors, at least that way you (and the OLC) know exactly what you are
getting...

Marc