Student Pilot Gets Five Months In Prison

Recently, Dave S posted:

AINut wrote:

It could also be that the person figured that since it wasn't any of
their business and totally irrelevant to flight safety, he wasn't
going to tell them about it. I can empathize with that.

David

Fortunately, the FAA doesn't leave it up to individuals to decide what is
or is not relevant to flight safety. In this case, there is more than one
reason to suspect that his problem *could* be a risk, and that possibility
was underscored by his lying about it.

Unfortunately, if he wanted to seek the PRIVELEDGE of flying in the US
(outside the confines of the sport class)he needed to obtain the
medical. He made his choice and they made an example of him. Had he
simply owned up to it, he would likely had finally been issued the
medical... and wouldn't be incarcerated now.

I'd guess that he lied about it because a drug conviction may pretty much
eliminate his chances of being issued a medical. And, it's an indictment
against his judgement that he didn't expect the feds to find out about it.

Regards,

Neil

Ron Natalie wrote:
AINut wrote:

He might have the same thoughts that I have:
1) It's none of the FAA's business what crimes you may or may not have
committed -- if you already done your time, you've paid your dues.


The FAA medical process is exceptionally intrusive into your private
affairs in the supposed name of flight safety. Frankly, there's no
"privacy issue" here anyhow. Criminal records are public knowledge.

2) the FAA has no NEED of old info that is completely irrelevant to
earning a license.


The FAA does not consider of history of drug issues to be irrelevant.

Obviously. But they are wrong.

AINut wrote in
:

Ron Natalie wrote:

The FAA does not consider of history of drug issues to be
irrelevant.

Obviously. But they are wrong.

...and with respect to your statement, your medical and/or psychiatric
credentials are?.....

--

AINut wrote:

Ron Natalie wrote:

AINut wrote:

He might have the same thoughts that I have:
1) It's none of the FAA's business what crimes you may or may not
have committed -- if you already done your time, you've paid your dues.



The FAA medical process is exceptionally intrusive into your private
affairs in the supposed name of flight safety. Frankly, there's no
"privacy issue" here anyhow. Criminal records are public knowledge.

2) the FAA has no NEED of old info that is completely irrelevant to
earning a license.



The FAA does not consider of history of drug issues to be irrelevant.


Obviously. But they are wrong.

No, they are being prudent.

Matt

In article ,
AINut wrote:
Ron Natalie wrote:
AINut wrote:

He might have the same thoughts that I have:
1) It's none of the FAA's business what crimes you may or may not have
committed -- if you already done your time, you've paid your dues.


The FAA medical process is exceptionally intrusive into your private
affairs in the supposed name of flight safety. Frankly, there's no
"privacy issue" here anyhow. Criminal records are public knowledge.

2) the FAA has no NEED of old info that is completely irrelevant to
earning a license.


The FAA does not consider of history of drug issues to be irrelevant.

Obviously. But they are wrong.

You have *your* opinion.

They have _theirs_.

The law says "their opinion is the only one that counts".

Since they 'own the game', *IF* you're going to "play the game", you play
by _their_ rules.

Note: criminal convictions -- even after 'time served' -- ARE indicative of
the prior exercise of "bad judgement", among other things. Telling lies about
prior convictions on a document where it says "you can go to jail if you
lie here" is _continued_ exercise of "bad judgement".

The FAA has a *valid* "public safety" interest in evaluating the 'judgement'
of the candidate 'pilot in command' in life-and-death situations -- affecting
not only said pilot, but passengers, and potentially _large_ numbers of
people on the ground.

AINut wrote:

Ron Natalie wrote:

AINut wrote:

He might have the same thoughts that I have:
1) It's none of the FAA's business what crimes you may or may not
have committed -- if you already done your time, you've paid your dues.



The FAA medical process is exceptionally intrusive into your private
affairs in the supposed name of flight safety. Frankly, there's no
"privacy issue" here anyhow. Criminal records are public knowledge.

2) the FAA has no NEED of old info that is completely irrelevant to
earning a license.



The FAA does not consider of history of drug issues to be irrelevant.


Obviously. But they are wrong.

No, you are. A history of drug abuse is an indicator of future
behaviour. The FAA does have the right and obligation to keep druggies
from flying.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

"Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired" wrote in message
news:qkyVd.20908$Sn6.6551@lakeread03...
No, you are. A history of drug abuse is an indicator of future
behaviour.

This is blatent bull****... you've eaten way too many government MRE's


The FAA does have the right and obligation to keep druggies
from flying.

This is true... so require the person to take drug tests more frequently.

I agree that in this case... falsifying the app was what screwed him.

Jughugs wrote:

"Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired" wrote in message
news:qkyVd.20908$Sn6.6551@lakeread03...

No, you are. A history of drug abuse is an indicator of future
behaviour.


This is blatent bull****... you've eaten way too many government MRE's

That's your opinion. Since you can't debate without being abusive this
discussion is closed.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

read: Since you won't agree with me, I'll take my marbles.

If history of drug abuse is an indicator of future behavior, that explains
the actions of the moron in the White House...

"Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired" wrote in message
news:Z1LVd.21110$Sn6.8789@lakeread03...
Jughugs wrote:

"Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired" wrote in message
news:qkyVd.20908$Sn6.6551@lakeread03...

No, you are. A history of drug abuse is an indicator of future
behaviour.


This is blatent bull****... you've eaten way too many government MRE's

That's your opinion. Since you can't debate without being abusive this
discussion is closed.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

"Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired" wrote in message
news:Z1LVd.21110$Sn6.8789@lakeread03...
Jughugs wrote:

"Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired" wrote in message
news:qkyVd.20908$Sn6.6551@lakeread03...

No, you are. A history of drug abuse is an indicator of future
behaviour.


This is blatent bull****... you've eaten way too many government MRE's

That's your opinion. Since you can't debate without being abusive this
discussion is closed.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Ah, but Dannie, they can prosecute you for lying about a lot of other little
sins you may have committed and not fessed up to on that airman medical
form:

Back in the summer of 2004, I flipped out the airman medical application
form and showed it to about 8 airmen at my airport. Most
of them sheeple-ishly admitted to having trouble with the two questions
about
criminal records and motor vehicle traffic convictions. None of them would
admit to any rational connection between an airman's medical exam to
determine if he were safe to fly and a criminal record, especially a
misdemeanor record. One of them admitted to having to call a lawyer about
one question on his form and then having to answer it, "YES," i. e., that he
had had a conviction for which he had had to attend driver improvement
school to get points off
his driver license in order to operate a motor vehicle on the streets and
highways. He had to pay a higher fee to the doctor (for having to come back
later to finish his medical) and of course an attorney fee. Once we began
to have a full discussion of the meanings of the questions, we found that
most of these pilots were unconvicted felons for having answered one or more
of the questions uncandidly. We the sheeple.


One of the pilots had been convicted of resisting an officer, another of a
simple
non-traffic misdemeanor, one of assault, one of bedding and cohabitation (i.
e., shacking up, which Dannie is probably guilty of, if he would only admit
it),
and one said that although unconvicted he felt a little guilty because he
had committed onanism. I must confess I had a bulge in my pants once while
standing in line at the movies in South Carolina with a voluptuous girl in
shorts and halter just in front of me (which was a serious crime calling for
a year's imprisonment and fine). All of them -- all of us -- are now more
aware of the irrational deviousness of Big Brother.


Do you have any despicable scofflaws operating aircraft out of your airport?

And then there's this, which I wrote in August, 2004, titled "Big Brother
Wants to Know What Infractions You've Committed Before He Lets You Fly":

And he asks this nosy, meddlesome affront to the Constitution on your
application for a third class medical.

Here's the question: Do you have a history of nontraffic convictions
(misdeameanors or felonies)? And take a look at the intrusive question
next to it. Then ask yourself WTF that information has to do with a third
class medical. Oh, and by the way, the Social Security Act specifically
guarantees that the social security number is for social security and social
security ONLY. So would Big Brother lie to you? Do government agencies
lie?

So, now let's see here. Big Brother somehow thinks this criminal record
inquiry into your moral character and social status has something to do with
your ability to fly safely, but not until after 9-11. Thus, if you have
been convicted of simple
assault, disturbing the peace, jaywalking, failure to apply for a privilege
license, joyriding, cussing in public, landing a helicopter in a National
Park, hunting deer without a license, cohabiting without benefit of clergy,
riding a skateboard on the Parkway, disturbing a religious service,
attempting to parachute off the world trade center,
violation of a child support law, failure to pay either state or federal
taxes, violation of the age of consent, disorderly conduct, trespass, or
any number of simple
misdemeanors you may be unfit to fly. Otherwise, why would Big Brother ask
all these nosy questions? Not to mention that any felony you
may have been convicted of could be disqualifying. As to felonies, of
course Big Brother has been frantically busy the last decade figuring out
ingenious new ways to make you into a convicted felon, including converting
traditional misdemeanors into felonies.

Sorry, nolo contendere (no contest) won't help you. Neither will an
expunction. Go
ahead and admit to the disgusting things you have done, even if the record
has been expunged or you
pleaded nolo. If you don't you will face the risk of perjury charges.
See that
little NOTICE of felony fine and imprisonment at the bottom left of the cold
and calculating, but tricky, federal form?

Good luck, boys, getting by the moral character and fitness committee for
that flying ticket. Be ever watchful. Big Brother gives with one hand
and takes abundantly with the other. He has already stolen your 9th
Amendment and is reaching his grimy hands for more amendments. After all,
as an FBI agent caught violating the Bill of Rights once said, "They're just
amendments."

Read the Ninth Amendment and see:

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be
construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.