The State of the Union: Lies about a Dishonest War

Union: Lies about a Dishonest War
From: nt (Krztalizer)


He used chemical weapons against the Kurds (that we, incidentally, taught
him
how to use) years ago during or right after his war with Iran.

Last I saw, the report by the CIA said those gassed Kurds were killed by a
chemical in the IraNian arsenal, not the IraQi arsenal. Convenient that that
CIA report is almost never mentioned. I agree, Saddam was a pig and a
murderer, but in that one famous case that they love to show on the news, he
was apparently not the guilty party.

Gordon


And what about the Iranians who were gassed? Were they done by Iranians? What
about the cheimical munitions found by non American forces in a part of Iraq
the Iranians never went before, during or after the Iran/Iraq war? Reuters
showed them.

Now, about this "CIA report," have you a cite or site to back that up?

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

From: nobody

snip

This is why the UN in early 2003 refused to give the USA a resolution which
would have granted the USA the right to invade.

NO country needs the UN's "permission" to do anything in any area not under the
UN's control. The UN had no controlling presence in Iraq and therefore had no
legal objection to anyone invading.

I sure hope you don't actually believe the UN is a governing body. If you do
you are sadly mistaken.

As an aside the UN has authorized war under its flag exactly twice and they won
neither: Korea and Gulf War.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
"George Z. Bush" wrote in message
...

You don't think Americans being killed and maimed every damned day isn't a
mess? If we turn our backs on it and walk away, then every one of them will
have been for nothing.....so, we have to hang in there until we can get some
sort of democratically elected Iraqi government to take over running the
country.

In the meanwhile, I think I read somewhere that someone said that the entire
country was an arsenal full of guns and ammunition, and that we may have
picked up half or two thirds of them. What's left is still killing our guys.

You can call that whatever you want. I call it a mess, because I don't see
any way out any time soon that isn't going to continue to kill and main
American troops each and every day that we're there.


You expected a war without death?

What war? Remember the words of our President on his arrival on the carrier
deck looking like a warrior? "Mission Accomplished"!!! They even posted a
banner in big letters on the bridge in case anybody missed hearing the President
say it.

I know it's a struggle for you to stay on topic, but we were talking about a
post-war mess. If you want to call that a war, you ought to let the President
know because he thinks it's over.

Dave Smith wrote:
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:


The Iraqi mess.


War is a messy business, what were you expecting?


That is why civilized countries try to avoid it. That is why most
of the civilized world rejected the claims of WMDs and need for a
war in Iraq. David Kay, the guy leading the hunt for WMDs in Iraq
resigned yesterday and said that he did not believe that Iraq had
stockpiles of chemical or biological weapons.

And poor old Secretary of State Colin Powell, who put on his best dog and pony
show for the UN trying to get them to go along with us. If you recall, he even
mentioned the number of tons of this and that they were supposed to have with
which to threaten the world. He's now having to acknowledge that he swallowed
the poop he was fed in believing that SH had all those WMDs, but maybe, in
hindsight, there really were none . Maybe indeed!

Mike1 wrote:
devil wrote:

War is a messy business, what were you expecting?

Wasn't war supposed to be over some time ago?


The "war" in Iraq has an ongoing casualty rate lower than than the
murder rate in Washington DC.

(The Marines took 40,000 casualties in a few days at Tarawa -- *that*
was "war".)

That must surely be a comfort to the families of the 500+ dead American heroes,
as well as to the thousands of American troops now missing one or more arms, or
legs, or the ability to
see or hear.

Krztalizer wrote:
He used chemical weapons against the Kurds (that we, incidentally, taught him
how to use) years ago during or right after his war with Iran.

Last I saw, the report by the CIA said those gassed Kurds were killed by a
chemical in the IraNian arsenal, not the IraQi arsenal. Convenient that that
CIA report is almost never mentioned. I agree, Saddam was a pig and a
murderer, but in that one famous case that they love to show on the news, he
was apparently not the guilty party.

That may or may not be. However, our President and our Secretary of State both
stated in the press that they believed those deaths were caused by Sadaam
Hussein. If they said that, knowing that the deaths were caused by Iran, then
how can we avoid calling our President and Secretary of State liars?

"George Z. Bush" wrote in message
...

That must surely be a comfort to the families of the 500+ dead American
heroes,
as well as to the thousands of American troops now missing one or more
arms, or
legs, or the ability to
see or hear.


So you really did expect a war without casualties.

"George Z. Bush" wrote in message
...

What war? Remember the words of our President on his arrival on the
carrier
deck looking like a warrior? "Mission Accomplished"!!! They even posted
a
banner in big letters on the bridge in case anybody missed hearing the
President
say it.


No, I don't remember the words of our President on his arrival on the
carrier, please provide a verifiable quote of them. I do recall the banner,
but I do not recall Bush saying "Mission accomplished!"



I know it's a struggle for you to stay on topic, but we were talking about
a
post-war mess. If you want to call that a war, you ought to let the
President
know because he thinks it's over.


How do you know the President thinks the war is over? Did he convey this to
you directly? If not, you should be able to provide a verifiable quote to
that effect. Please do so.

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
"George Z. Bush" wrote in message
...

What war? Remember the words of our President on his arrival on the

carrier

deck looking like a warrior? "Mission Accomplished"!!! They even posted

a

banner in big letters on the bridge in case anybody missed hearing the

President

say it.



No, I don't remember the words of our President on his arrival on the
carrier, please provide a verifiable quote of them. I do recall the banner,
but I do not recall Bush saying "Mission accomplished!"



I know it's a struggle for you to stay on topic, but we were talking about

a

post-war mess. If you want to call that a war, you ought to let the

President

know because he thinks it's over.



How do you know the President thinks the war is over? Did he convey this to
you directly? If not, you should be able to provide a verifiable quote to
that effect. Please do so.



You really should get one of the nurses in the rest home to show you how
to use Google some time, Steven.

I know that reading isn't a particular strength of yours, so just read
the first paragraph, will you?

http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/05/01/bus...ipt/index.html

ABOARD THE USS ABRAHAM LINCOLN (CNN) -- The following is an unedited
transcript of President Bush's historic speech from the flight deck of
the USS Lincoln, during which he declared an end to major combat in Iraq:

Thank you. Thank you all very much.

Admiral Kelly, Captain Card, officers and sailors of the USS Abraham
Lincoln, my fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended. In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have
prevailed.

And now our coalition is engaged in securing and reconstructing that
country.

In this battle, we have fought for the cause of liberty and for the
peace of the world. Our nation and our coalition are proud of this
accomplishment, yet it is you, the members of the United States
military, who achieved it. Your courage, your willingness to face danger
for your country and for each other made this day possible.

Because of you our nation is more secure. Because of you the tyrant has
fallen and Iraq is free.

Operation Iraqi Freedom was carried out with a combination of precision
and speed and boldness the enemy did not expect and the world had not
seen before.

From distant bases or ships at sea, we sent planes and missiles that
could destroy an enemy division or strike a single bunker. Marines and
soldiers charged to Baghdad across 350 miles of hostile ground in one of
the swiftest advances of heavy arms in history.

You have shown the world the skill and the might of the American armed
forces.

This nation thanks all of the members of our coalition who joined in a
noble cause. We thank the armed forces of the United Kingdom, Australia
and Poland who shared in the hardships of war. We thank all of the
citizens of Iraq who welcomed our troops and joined in the liberation of
their own country.

And tonight, I have a special word for Secretary Rumsfeld, for General
Franks and for all the men and women who wear the uniform of the United
States: America is grateful for a job well done.

The character of our military through history, the daring of Normandy,
the fierce courage of Iwo Jima, the decency and idealism that turned
enemies into allies is fully present in this generation.

When Iraqi civilians looked into the faces of our service men and women,
they saw strength and kindness and good will. When I look at the members
of the United States military, I see the best of our country and I am
honored to be your commander in chief.

In the images of fallen statues we have witnessed the arrival of a new
era. For a hundred of years of war, culminating in the nuclear age,
military technology was designed and deployed to inflict casualties on
an ever-growing scale.

In defeating Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan, Allied forces destroyed
entire cities, while enemy leaders who started the conflict were safe
until the final days. Military power was used to end a regime by
breaking a nation.

Today we have the greater power to free a nation by breaking a dangerous
and aggressive regime.

With new tactics and precision weapons, we can achieve military
objectives without directing violence against civilians.

No device of man can remove the tragedy from war, yet it is a great
advance when the guilty have far more to fear from war than the innocent.

In the images of celebrating Iraqis we have also seen the ageless appeal
of human freedom. Decades of lies and intimidation could not make the
Iraqi people love their oppressors or desire their own enslavement.

Men and women in every culture need liberty like they need food and
water and air. Everywhere that freedom arrives, humanity rejoices and
everywhere that freedom stirs, let tyrants fear.

We have difficult work to do in Iraq. We're bringing order to parts of
that country that remain dangerous. We're pursuing and finding leaders
of the old regime who will be held to account for their crimes. We've
begun the search for hidden chemical and biological weapons, and already
know of hundreds of sites that will be investigated.

We are helping to rebuild Iraq where the dictator built palaces for
himself instead of hospitals and schools.

And we will stand with the new leaders of Iraq as they establish a
government of, by and for the Iraqi people.

The transition from dictatorship to democracy will take time, but it is
worth every effort. Our coalition will stay until our work is done and
then we will leave and we will leave behind a free Iraq.

The battle of Iraq is one victory in a war on terror that began on
September the 11th, 2001 and still goes on.

That terrible morning, 19 evil men, the shock troops of a hateful
ideology, gave America and the civilized world a glimpse of their
ambitions. They imagined, in the words of one terrorist, that September
the 11th would be the beginning of the end of America.

By seeking to turn our cities into killing fields, terrorists and their
allies believed that they could destroy this nation's resolve and force
our retreat from the world.

They have failed.

In the battle of Afghanistan, we destroyed the Taliban, many terrorists
and the camps where they trained. We continue to help the Afghan people
lay roads, restore hospitals and educate all of their children.

Yet we also have dangerous work to complete. As I speak, a special
operations task force lead by the 82nd Airborne is on the trail of the
terrorists and those who seek to undermine the free government of
Afghanistan.

America and our coalition will finish what we have begun.

From Pakistan to the Philippines to the Horn of Africa, we are hunting
down Al Qaida killers.

Nineteen months ago I pledged that the terrorists would not escape the
patient justice of the United States. And as of tonight nearly one half
of Al Qaida's senior operatives have been captured or killed.

The liberation of Iraq is a crucial advance in the campaign against
terror. We have removed an ally of Al Qaida and cut off a source of
terrorist funding.

And this much is certain: No terrorist network will gain weapons of mass
destruction from the Iraqi regime, because the regime is no more.

In these 19 months that changed the world, our actions have been focused
and deliberate and proportionate to the offense. We have not forgotten
the victims of September the 11th, the last phone calls, the cold murder
of children, the searches in the rubble. With those attacks, the
terrorists and their supporters declared war on the United States, and
war is what they got.

Our war against terror is proceeding according to the principles that I
have made clear to all.

Any person involved in committing or planning terrorist attacks against
the American people becomes an enemy of this country and a target of
American justice.

Any person, organization or government that supports, protects or
harbors terrorists is complicit in the murder of the innocent and
equally guilty of terrorist crimes. Any outlaw regime that has ties to
terrorist groups and seeks or possesses weapons of mass destruction is a
grave danger to the civilized world and will be confronted.

And anyone in the world, including the Arab world, who works and
sacrifices for freedom has a loyal friend in the United States of America.

Our commitment to liberty is America's tradition, declared at our
founding, affirmed in Franklin Roosevelt's Four Freedoms, asserted in
the Truman Doctrine and in Ronald Reagan's challenge to an evil empire.

We are committed to freedom in Afghanistan, Iraq and in a peaceful
Palestine.

The advance of freedom is the surest strategy to undermine the appeal of
terror in the world. Where freedom takes hold, hatred gives way to hope.

When freedom takes hold, men and women turn to the peaceful pursuit of a
better life.

American values and American interests lead in the same direction. We
stand for human liberty.

The United States upholds these principles of security and freedom in
many ways: with all of the tools of diplomacy, law enforcement,
intelligence and finance.

We are working with a broad coalition of nations that understand the
threat and our shared responsibility to meet it.

The use of force has been and remains our last resort. Yet all can know,
friend and foe alike, that our nation has a mission: We will answer
threats to our security, and we will defend the peace.

Our mission continues. Al Qaida is wounded, not destroyed. The scattered
cells of the terrorist network still operate in many nations and we know
from daily intelligence that they continue to plot against free people.
The proliferation of deadly weapons remains a serious danger.

The enemies of freedom are not idle, and neither are we. Our government
has taken unprecedented measures to defend the homeland and we will
continue to hunt down the enemy before he can strike.

The war on terror is not over, yet it is not endless. We do not know the
day of final victory, but we have seen the turning of the tide.

No act of the terrorists will change our purpose, or weaken our resolve,
or alter their fate. Their cause is lost; free nations will press on to
victory.

Other nations in history have fought in foreign lands and remained to
occupy and exploit. Americans, following a battle, want nothing more
than to return home. And that is your direction tonight.

After service in the Afghan and Iraqi theaters of war, after 100,000
miles on the longest carrier deployment in recent history, you are
homeward bound.

Some of you will see new family members for the first time; 150 babies
were born while their fathers were on the Lincoln. Your families are
proud of you, and your nation will welcome you.

We are mindful as well that some good men and women are not making the
journey home. One of those who fell, Corporal Jason Mileo, spoke to his
parents five days before his death. Jason's father said, "He called us
from the center of Baghdad, not to brag but to tell us he loved us. Our
son was a soldier."

Every name, every life is a loss to our military, to our nation and to
the loved ones who grieve. There is no homecoming for these families.
Yet we pray in God's time their reunion will come.

Those we lost were last seen on duty.

Their final act on this Earth was to fight a great evil and bring
liberty to others.

All of you, all in this generation of our military, have taken up the
highest calling of history: You were defending your country and
protecting the innocent from harm.

And wherever you go, you carry a message of hope, a message that is
ancient and ever new. In the words of the prophet Isaiah, "To the
captives, come out; and to those in darkness, be free."

Thank you for serving our country and our cause.

May God bless you all. And may God continue to bless America.

"John Mullen" wrote in message
...

You really should get one of the nurses in the rest home to show you how
to use Google some time, Steven.

I know that reading isn't a particular strength of yours, so just read
the first paragraph, will you?

http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/05/01/bus...ipt/index.html

ABOARD THE USS ABRAHAM LINCOLN (CNN) -- The following is an unedited
transcript of President Bush's historic speech from the flight deck of
the USS Lincoln, during which he declared an end to major combat in Iraq:

Thank you. Thank you all very much.

Admiral Kelly, Captain Card, officers and sailors of the USS Abraham
Lincoln, my fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended. In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have
prevailed.


Ah, I see. You believe "major combat operations in Iraq have ended" means
"the war is over." Obviously I'm not the one due for remedial reading
class.