Just Bought A Plane? STAY OUT OF FLORIDA !

On Mar 27, 9:13*am, Jay Maynard
wrote:
On 2008-03-27, BobR wrote:

I don't think anybody has a problem with ANN reporting the issue.
That is not a problem at all and it rightfully should be reported.
The issue that many of us have is that instead of just reporting the
problem and trying to promote a solution, ANN used it as yet another
excuse to try and destroy the Sun-N-Fun flyin. *Instead of encouraging
all involved to contact Florida and others who might be able to
promote a solution, Campbell instead decided to encourage people to
stay away from Sun-N-Fun with that as an added threat.

If you knew that you were going to get slapped with a five-figure tax bill
you otherwise wouldn't owe just for flying to Sun n Fun, would you go?

I don't care about Zoom's motives. I don't care that it was Zoom who broke
the story. I don't care about his choice of timing. I do care that there's a
problem that's real enough to get AOPA and EAA involved. If they find it's
groundless, I'll stop worrying, no matter what Zoom has to say about it.

A.N.N. and Campbell are like a stopped clock, it is 100% correct twice
a day but otherwise good for nothing.

Perhaps. Even so, you can't ignore this one just because Zoom reported it
because others who actually have credibility are also reporting it. If it
was just Zoom, things might well be different.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC * * * * * * * * *http://www.conmicro.comhttp://jmaynard.livejournal.com* * *http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) * * * * * * * * * * * *(Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)

You continue to argue that it needed to be reported and we all agree.
Nobody is ignoring the issue.

What you don't seem to understand or I suspect you just don't give a
damn (based on your own motives statement) is that the way the story
was presented, it was a direct attempt to do harm to both Sun-N-Fun
and indirectly everyone who attends in order to display their products
and services. Motives do matter and factual presentation along with
credibility also matter.

On 2008-03-27, BobR wrote:
What you don't seem to understand or I suspect you just don't give a
damn (based on your own motives statement) is that the way the story
was presented, it was a direct attempt to do harm to both Sun-N-Fun
and indirectly everyone who attends in order to display their products
and services. Motives do matter and factual presentation along with
credibility also matter.

I don't care what Zoom's motives are. The story is what matters.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)

On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:37:39 GMT, Jay Maynard wrote:

On 2008-03-27, BobR wrote:
What you don't seem to understand or I suspect you just don't give a
damn (based on your own motives statement) is that the way the story
was presented, it was a direct attempt to do harm to both Sun-N-Fun
and indirectly everyone who attends in order to display their products
and services. Motives do matter and factual presentation along with
credibility also matter.

I don't care what Zoom's motives are. The story is what matters.

Welcome to the World Of BobR, the monotract-minded, blindered,
self-absorbed Debate King.

On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 08:39:24 GMT, Jay Maynard wrote:

On 2008-03-27, WJRFlyBoy wrote:
I was at Naples air this morning, an airport that flies in/out serious
hi $$$ aircraft. Their revenue base is mainly hangar, land and other
rentals. Their nervous about the possibilities and the negative press.

Good. They should be leaning on FDOR to back off. Since they live and work
there, that means they're voters, and can't be brushed off quite as easily
(in theory).

They got a problem. They are looking at $50M in runway/tarmac
replacements over the next few years and FloridaDOT needs to pick up $3M
+ of it where, in the past, they would only ask for $200K max. Thru
2012, $13M from FDOT for Cap Improvements. Ouch, see the problem?

On Mar 27, 12:32*pm, WJRFlyBoy wrote:
On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:37:39 GMT, Jay Maynard wrote:
On 2008-03-27, BobR wrote:
What you don't seem to understand or I suspect you just don't give a
damn (based on your own motives statement) is that the way the story
was presented, it was a direct attempt to do harm to both Sun-N-Fun
and indirectly everyone who attends in order to display their products
and services. *Motives do matter and factual presentation along with
credibility also matter.

I don't care what Zoom's motives are. The story is what matters.

Welcome to the World Of BobR, the monotract-minded, blindered,
self-absorbed Debate King.

Go learn how to fly so that you can at least appear to know what you
are talking about.

...and why do you think he waited until a couple weeks before Sun-N-
Fun to bring this up? After all, he DOES own a Glasair, registered in
a state other than Florida (look up N411AN on the FAA database) and
has operated it in Florida nearly continuously, including during the
crucial six month period after he bought it. It would be interesting
to know if HE was billed by the Florida DOR, and if so, when. (Mr.
Wanttaja, are you listening?)

As for your not caring what his motives are, allow me to give you a
little background. I worked for Campbell trying to sell advertising,
a fact of which I am deeply ashamed. What I can tell you is that for
Campbell, motive is everything. In his case there are only two
motives that count. Money and personal aggrandizement. Money from
advertisers (sometimes unwilling advertisers) who are, in many cases,
given nearly continuously good coverage on his little website for as
long as they are advertisers. (Case in point: Cirrus Design. 80
accidents, including 33 fatals, in five years. Look at where they
advertise on his page, and look at how much negative coverage they
get.) Cancel those ads and watch out.

Case in point: In the late 90s, everyone was worried (to say the
least) about the quality of design and the components supplied with
the Revolution 500 helicopter. Despite nearly universal condemnation,
Campbell's little rag, US Aviator, had nothing but good things to say
about the kit. When the owner finally turned down repeated attempts
by both Campbell and myself to sell him an ad in the magazine,
Revolution Helicopters got slammed, repeatedly, in both the magazine
and on this very forum by Mr. Campbell. Coincidence? You might think
so, but I know better. Was the criticism warranted? Yes. Was his
presentation of those criticisms timely? No. He waited until there
was no chance to get money from them, and THEN took them on.

Chuck Slusarczyk is another case in point. Campbell and his pet rat,
Juan Jimenez, have made a hobby of borderline libel of both Chuck and
his line of ultralights for literally decades. When did THAT start?
When Chuck decided not to advertise in Campbell's rag and, worst of
all, when he called Campbell's credibility into question.

In the case of his hatred of Sun-N-Fun, he likes to say that the fly-
in has been banning him from attending and therefore trying to muzzle
him because of his criticisms. The reality is far from what he
"reports." The actual reasons he has been banned (although reporters
and photographers working for him are, indeed, welcome) include
printing up fake press and parking passes for the event (of which I
have two, provided to me by Campbell, for the 1997 SNF) as well as
attempting to serve legal papers on people and companies attending and
exhibiting at the show after being told, repeatedly, not to do so. He
has also bragged (during his "terrorists are out to kill me" period)
of needing to carry a Berretta 9mm hand cannon to the show to protect
himself. I HEARD that brag, firsthand, outside the Rose Motel (where
Campbell put his staff, including me, up) on the second night of the
1997 SNF. Do I think he actually carried? Well, when I asked him to
show me the weapon (supposedly in an ankle holster) his reply was "the
only reason it comes out of the holster is if I have to use it,"
which, upon reflection, most likely means that the whole story was
just that. A story. Bottom line, it is not a matter of his
"journalistic" rights being trampled upon by the City of Lakeland and
SNF officials. THAT is just a convenient story.

Yes, the story is indeed what matters. No doubt about it. But in
Campbell's case you ALWAYS have to consider whether you are getting a
fair, objective and representative telling. In the case of anything
Sun-N-Fun related, the chances of reading something fair and objective
on ANN are somewhere between microscopically slim and none.

Al "Escalator Tag" Staats


I don't care what Zoom's motives are. The story is what matters.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC * * * * * * * * *http://www.conmicro.comhttp://jmaynard.livejournal.com* * *http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) * * * * * * * * * * * *(Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)

On 2008-03-27, olympusE1 wrote:
...and why do you think he waited until a couple weeks before Sun-N-
Fun to bring this up? After all, he DOES own a Glasair, registered in
a state other than Florida (look up N411AN on the FAA database) and
has operated it in Florida nearly continuously, including during the
crucial six month period after he bought it. It would be interesting
to know if HE was billed by the Florida DOR, and if so, when. (Mr.
Wanttaja, are you listening?)

It would be. That does not change the basic story, which is about much more
than Zoom Campbell.

As for your not caring what his motives are, allow me to give you a
little background.

I'm sorry that so many people have had so much trouble with the guy, and
glad that our paths have never crossed.

That does not change the basic story, which is about much more than Zoom
Campbell.

(BTW, the Beretta 92, while a fine pistol, is far from a "hand cannon".)

Yes, the story is indeed what matters. No doubt about it. But in
Campbell's case you ALWAYS have to consider whether you are getting a
fair, objective and representative telling. In the case of anything
Sun-N-Fun related, the chances of reading something fair and objective
on ANN are somewhere between microscopically slim and none.

I'm not reading it on ANN. I've never visited ANN. For that matter, I never
read US Aviator. I'm reading it from AOPA and EAA, and hearing about it in
person from Phil Boyer. ANN's credibility, while quite possibly an issue in
general (I'm not commenting one way or the other, as I don't have enough
facts to make a decision, although I can certainly see why lots of folks
find Zoom's credibility lacking), is not relevant to this story. AOPA's and
EAA's are, and they have sufficient credibility for me. The minute AOPA and
EAA picked it up, Zoom Campbell's credibility became irrelevant.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)

On 27 Mar 2008 05:52:27 -0700, ChuckSlusarczyk
wrote:

In article , Jay Maynard says...

This is overstating the case a bit. I'm not saying that aircraft owners must
be getting hit right and left; what I am saying is that there's fire beneath
all of the smoke, and dismissing it entirely because Zoom is raising the
issue is wrong. Not even Zoom is wrong 100% of the time.

The overstating is being done by zoom. There is a lot of smoke and that's where
zoom operates , in the smoky grey area where he can create his own perception
out of a different reality. zoom put his own spin on this bit of reality in an
effort to harm Sun n Fun. No one said he was totally wrong ,there might be a tax
problem in Florida, it's just that his take on it was tainted by his vendetta
for Sun n Fun. You say even zoom isn't wrong 100% of the time well neither are
the zoom bashers.And we all have good reason not to trust zoom even if he seems
right. It has to do with his credibility as a journalist but that's for another
day.

Chuck S RAH-14/1 ret

"credibility it was always about credibility"
************************************************** ********

Chuck

Looks like TRON Guy is replacing Juam.

Big John

On Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:29:16 -0700 (PDT), olympusE1 wrote:

snipped humongous rant on Campbell/Zoom/life

Al "Escalator Tag" Staats

So the OP Subject is a lie, all is safe and well in Florida right?

On 2008-03-27, Big John wrote:
Looks like TRON Guy is replacing Juam.

Wrong. I'm no supporter of Zoom Campbell. All I'm doing is saying the
Florida tax story's correctness is independent of his credibility, or lack
thereof.

BTW, if you're the John I'm thinking of, I used to say that I'd listen with
respect to anything you said about flying based on your long Air Force
career and ignore anything else. Now, I'm not so sure.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (ordered 17 March, delivery 2 June)