Enola Gay: Burnt flesh and other magnificent technological

On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 03:06:38 GMT, "Gord Beaman" ) wrote:

"Tarver Engineering" wrote:


"Gord Beaman" wrote in message
. ..


snip of idiot gibbering

Of course...and for Christ's sake don't add "...and it was a very
bad thing"...

It was a very bad thing. Pandora's box can never be closed again.

Well John, it's quite likely that someone said exactly that when
the very first charge of gunpowder was ignited. And likely again
when the first arrow left it's bowstring...the first club
connected with someone's skull...etc...

-Gord.

"I'm trying to get as old as I can,
and it must be working 'cause I'm
the oldest now that I've ever been"

Heck, the Pope tried to ban crossbows because they
would "destroy civilization".

Al Minyard

Alan Minyard wrote:

On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 03:06:38 GMT, "Gord Beaman" ) wrote:

"Tarver Engineering" wrote:

"Gord Beaman" wrote in message
...

snip of idiot gibbering

Of course...and for Christ's sake don't add "...and it was a very
bad thing"...

It was a very bad thing. Pandora's box can never be closed again.

Well John, it's quite likely that someone said exactly that when
the very first charge of gunpowder was ignited. And likely again
when the first arrow left it's bowstring...the first club
connected with someone's skull...etc...

Heck, the Pope tried to ban crossbows because they
would "destroy civilization".

Never knew the cross bow was considered to be such a terrible
weapon.

I know the long bow was for a time though.

The armored cavalry types didn't like the idea of being knocked
off their horses on to their tin cans from 80 yards out by mere
peasant folk.

What was the world coming to?


SMH

"Gord Beaman" wrote in message
...
"Tarver Engineering" wrote:


"Gord Beaman" wrote in message
.. .


snip of idiot gibbering

Of course...and for Christ's sake don't add "...and it was a very
bad thing"...

It was a very bad thing. Pandora's box can never be closed again.

Well John, it's quite likely that someone said exactly that when
the very first charge of gunpowder was ignited. And likely again
when the first arrow left it's bowstring...the first club
connected with someone's skull...etc...

So true, but life has taught me to be a gracious winner. I believe America
can set about the same policy in foreign relations. I do not say that we
"apologise" to the Japanese, as "bad things" can happen to those who come to
our house and blow up our stuff. My friend George's father still hates the
Japanese and another friend, an Arizona survivor, went to his grave the same
way. Hate is also a bad thing.

From: "Tarver Engineering"

So true, but life has taught me to be a gracious winner.

No comment.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

Mary Shafer wrote:

I turned that up using "crossbow Pope" in Google, to confirm my
memory.


Mary

A tiny bit of useful trivia...you get exactly the same effect in
Google when you omit the second quotation mark as you do when you
use it. (all those quarter seconds add up!)

-Gord.

"I'm trying to get as old as I can,
and it must be working 'cause I'm
the oldest now that I've ever been"

Mary Shafer wrote:

On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 13:12:34 -0500, Stephen Harding
wrote:


Never knew the cross bow was considered to be such a terrible
weapon.


The cross bow was such a terrible weapon that a Pope forbade its use
against fellow Christians. Using it on pagans and unbelievers was OK,
though. Needless to say, this ban didn't last.

"William the Conqueror brought skilled crossbow men with him when he
invaded England in A.D. 1066.

"The crossbow was powerful in battle because its bolts (a shorter
version of arrows) could penetrate the chain mail of opponents.
Leaders of the Catholic Church, outraged by the lethal weapon, deemed
the crossbow "unfit to be used among Christians" and tried to ban it
from warfare in 1139—without success. Richard I ("the Lionheart") died
of a crossbow wound on the battlefield in 1199." from
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n..._crossbow.html

I turned that up using "crossbow Pope" in Google, to confirm my
memory.

I do recall the devastating effects the English longbow had on the
battlefield, and it's superiority over the crossbow. It had greater
range, higher rate of fire, and more hitting/penetrating power.

But it took a lot of practice and strength to operate competently,
whereas the crossbow did not. It did not really come into its own
until after all the hubbub over the crossbow, I guess.

Thanks for the "archery lesson" Mary!


SMH

On Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:47:38 -0500, Stephen Harding
wrote:

The cross bow was such a terrible weapon that a Pope forbade its use
against fellow Christians. Using it on pagans and unbelievers was OK,
though. Needless to say, this ban didn't last.

Actually, the provisions of the second Lateran council in 1139 seem to
be directed at all archers, not crossbowmen in isolation:

"29. We prohibit under anathema that murderous art of crossbowmen and
archers, which is hateful to God, to be employed against Christians
and Catholics from now on."

IIRC, crossbowmen were beginning to become largely drawn from a
developing professional mercenary class at this point.

I do recall the devastating effects the English longbow had on the
battlefield, and it's superiority over the crossbow. It had greater
range, higher rate of fire, and more hitting/penetrating power.

The longbow as it appeared in the 100 Years War wasn't a feature of
12th century warfare. The actual measure concerned took part against
a background of the relevant pope attempting to restore papal
authority after a schism and continue the general policy of attempting
to limit warfare within Christendom and constrain it under papal
religious theory.

Gavin Bailey

Subject: Enola Gay: Burnt flesh and other magnificent technological
From: The Wolf
Date: 12/18/03 5:52 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

On 12/17/2003 11:09 PM, in article ,
"Jack G" opined:

Pretty catchy retort there John, unfortunately there is nothing you can say
that will in the least offend me - all you can do by publishing such
rudeness is diminish your own image in the eyes of others.

As far as bias in the press, none of the papers mentioned by you provide
what can in any way be called balanced coverage of the situation in Iraq.

Jack


*The* Situation in Iraq is infinitely better than is was a year ago and will
improve exponentially over the next year.

**** You Liberal Bush Bashing Cocksucker!



PLONK
Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

"The Revolution Will Not Be Televised"
wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Dec 2003 17:47:38 -0500, Stephen Harding
wrote:

The cross bow was such a terrible weapon that a Pope forbade its use
against fellow Christians. Using it on pagans and unbelievers was OK,
though. Needless to say, this ban didn't last.

Actually, the provisions of the second Lateran council in 1139 seem to
be directed at all archers, not crossbowmen in isolation:

"29. We prohibit under anathema that murderous art of crossbowmen and
archers, which is hateful to God, to be employed against Christians
and Catholics from now on."

My goodness, the Pope dissing my family's coat of arms.

IIRC, crossbowmen were beginning to become largely drawn from a
developing professional mercenary class at this point.

And very profitable.

I do recall the devastating effects the English longbow had on the
battlefield, and it's superiority over the crossbow. It had greater
range, higher rate of fire, and more hitting/penetrating power.

The longbow as it appeared in the 100 Years War wasn't a feature of
12th century warfare. The actual measure concerned took part against
a background of the relevant pope attempting to restore papal
authority after a schism and continue the general policy of attempting
to limit warfare within Christendom and constrain it under papal
religious theory.

Let us all stand in a line and kill one another, until a political solution
can be reached.

From: RogerM

Are we beheading prisoners? Starving them?

You're mistreating those in Cuba.


Prove it.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired