Is it easier now?

Subject: Is it easier now?
From: "Ed Majden"
Date: 2/27/04 6:55 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: EqT%b.633877$X%5.197935@pd7tw2no


"ArtKramr" "I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and
well-placed managed to wangle slots in the Army Reserve and National

Why is the ANG being put down by so many? They provide a very usefull
reserve function and in many cases are regular force members that have
returned to civilian life. In Canada we call these units the reserves.
They are now being used by the CF on many peace keeping and peace making
missions. Most of our reserves are Army types but there is also an air and
naval element reserves. I think they do a dammed fine job.
Ed



That was not my quote. It was made by General Colin Powell in his book.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

"ArtKramr" wrote

That was not my quote. It was made by General Colin Powell in his book.

In the narrow context of Vietnam before the lottery system. Before about
1965, no one joined the NG or Reserves out of civilian life, they joined it
after active duty. Most people took their draft, and ended up in Germany
or Korea (and no one asked about a ****ing exit-strategy). Most served,
got the clap, and were home to momma before anyone knew they were
gone.

In article ,
on 27 Feb 2004 14:09:32 GMT,
ArtKramr attempted to say .....



I'll let Colin Powell answer for me:

You arn't Gen Powell





--
When dealing with propaganda terminology one sometimes always speaks in
variable absolutes. This is not to be mistaken for an unbiased slant.

In article vST%b.6195$m4.5226@okepread03,
on Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:25:12 -0600,
D. Strang attempted to say .....

"ArtKramr" wrote

That was not my quote. It was made by General Colin Powell in his book.

In the narrow context of Vietnam before the lottery system. Before about
1965, no one joined the NG or Reserves out of civilian life, they joined it
after active duty.

You are inncorrect, when I came off active duty to the Guard in 1980 there
were many who had joined direct out of high school in the 1950's

Those old guys in many cases spent 40 years in the Guard and many went
from E1 to CW5 or O5 before they were through.


--
When dealing with propaganda terminology one sometimes always speaks in
variable absolutes. This is not to be mistaken for an unbiased slant.

In article ,
on 27 Feb 2004 14:11:00 GMT,
ArtKramr attempted to say .....

Subject: Is it easier now?
From: Tank Fixer
Date: 2/26/04 11:31 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: t

In article ,
on 27 Feb 2004 03:49:51 GMT,
ArtKramr attempted to say .....

Subject: Is it easier now?
From: Tank Fixer
Date: 2/26/04 7:46 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: t

In article ,
on 26 Feb 2004 20:44:20 GMT,
ArtKramr attempted to say .....


"Liberated" ? As I remember it there was no German resistance whatever.
All
the
Germans had left and they just walked in without a shot being fired.
Hardly
the
equivalent of landing on Omaha beach was it?. (sheesh)

Yes, I guess your right.

I mean the 41st Infantry had an easy time in New Guinea during 1942/43.

Or that Provisional Tank battalion that ended up on the Bataan penensula
in 1941 as infantry after they ran out of fuel.

I mean, they were just National Guard troops....
Not real soldiers, right Art ?



At least Bush wasn't hiding in those units right?

No, he was flying a rather unforgiving aircraft.

Or are you saying the USAF had lax standards for pilot training in the
early 70's ?


As Colin Powell said:
"I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and
well-placed managed to wangle slots in the Army Reserve and National
Guard units... Of the many tragedies of Vietnam, this raw class
discrimination strikes me as the most damaging to the ideal that all
Americans are created equal and owe equal allegiance to their country."



OK, so we know what the good general said.

I was asking you however.


--
When dealing with propaganda terminology one sometimes always speaks in
variable absolutes. This is not to be mistaken for an unbiased slant.

"Tank Fixer" wrote
D. Strang attempted to say .....
"ArtKramr" wrote

That was not my quote. It was made by General Colin Powell in his book.

In the narrow context of Vietnam before the lottery system. Before about
1965, no one joined the NG or Reserves out of civilian life, they joined it
after active duty.

You are incorrect, when I came off active duty to the Guard in 1980 there
were many who had joined direct out of high school in the 1950's

Sounds like personal unit experience, rather than national statistics.

If your experience were true, then most of the Guard would have been about
40 years old, and too old for humping 40 lbs in the jungle (i.e., worthless).

In article EOU%b.6211$m4.4819@okepread03,
on Fri, 27 Feb 2004 22:29:21 -0600,
D. Strang attempted to say .....

"Tank Fixer" wrote
D. Strang attempted to say .....
"ArtKramr" wrote

That was not my quote. It was made by General Colin Powell in his book.

In the narrow context of Vietnam before the lottery system. Before about
1965, no one joined the NG or Reserves out of civilian life, they joined it
after active duty.

You are incorrect, when I came off active duty to the Guard in 1980 there
were many who had joined direct out of high school in the 1950's

Sounds like personal unit experience, rather than national statistics.

It is, do you have any ?
You have national statistics then ?


If your experience were true, then most of the Guard would have been about
40 years old, and too old for humping 40 lbs in the jungle (i.e., worthless).

This was a GS maintenance company. Did I say they all had joined in the
1950's ? No, that some had.


--
When dealing with propaganda terminology one sometimes always speaks in
variable absolutes. This is not to be mistaken for an unbiased slant.

Subject: Is it easier now?
From: Tank Fixer
Date: 2/27/04 8:22 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

In article ,
on 27 Feb 2004 14:11:00 GMT,
ArtKramr attempted to say .....

Subject: Is it easier now?
From: Tank Fixer
Date: 2/26/04 11:31 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: t

In article ,
on 27 Feb 2004 03:49:51 GMT,
ArtKramr attempted to say .....

Subject: Is it easier now?
From: Tank Fixer
Date: 2/26/04 7:46 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: t

In article ,
on 26 Feb 2004 20:44:20 GMT,
ArtKramr attempted to say .....


"Liberated" ? As I remember it there was no German resistance
whatever.
All
the
Germans had left and they just walked in without a shot being fired.
Hardly
the
equivalent of landing on Omaha beach was it?. (sheesh)

Yes, I guess your right.

I mean the 41st Infantry had an easy time in New Guinea during 1942/43.

Or that Provisional Tank battalion that ended up on the Bataan
penensula
in 1941 as infantry after they ran out of fuel.

I mean, they were just National Guard troops....
Not real soldiers, right Art ?



At least Bush wasn't hiding in those units right?

No, he was flying a rather unforgiving aircraft.

Or are you saying the USAF had lax standards for pilot training in the
early 70's ?


As Colin Powell said:
"I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and
well-placed managed to wangle slots in the Army Reserve and National
Guard units... Of the many tragedies of Vietnam, this raw class
discrimination strikes me as the most damaging to the ideal that all
Americans are created equal and owe equal allegiance to their country."



OK, so we know what the good general said.

I was asking you however.


I agree with General Powell.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

"Tank Fixer" wrote

Did I say they all had joined in the 1950's ? No, that some had.

Actually, you said "many" had. Now you say "some." We're probably getting
closer to the truth, that "very few" had.

"ArtKramr" wrote

I agree with General Powell.

Powell wrote that over 10 years ago. He was talking about a narrow
window of history. The reason you offer the quote today, is that it is
being pushed by the DNC, and the AARP.

Kerry's welfare promise to AARP membership is the reason you invest
in this quote.

Powell is serving the best candidate for our next President. If Kerry is
nominated by the Democrats, then we have a choice between Capitalism
and Communism. A Central Planning Committee, or a free market.