Cross Country the main focus of soaring?

Ah, Politics! It takes patience and lobbying to make a change. First you
need to form a supportive base that will aid in promoting your view of what
the club should be - with reasoned arguments. Try to get like minded
members into officer positions. Most clubs, I believe are run in a fairly
democratic manner, so you need votes. Know your clubs by-laws and rules of
conduct regarding voting and decision making. It can get personal so be
prepared. It is a shame the club does not promote the SSA badge program for
non owners.

Mike

"mat Redsell" wrote in message
news:0LE6d.36$lf2.15@trnddc09...
I have been very concerned about our club, which discourages cross country
in club gliders. My thought is that purpose of soaring is cross country
and
if one just concentrates on flying above the airport then ones member ship
tends to end when you have your license.

We have many airports withing a 15 miles radius and many flat fields with
always an option of landing in cut hay fields, harvested bean and corn
fields etc. There is no lack of good landing fields or airports.

Our board is composed of pilots who do not go cross country and
surprisingly
none of the instructors have flown cross country ( there may be an
exception.... but none I know of have gone recently). And I am not allowed
to teach since I insist on wearing a parachute for both student and
instructor. ( I have in the past provided a chute for the student).

The thought at our club is that if you want to go cross country you buy
your own ship... a rasther harsh reality for many pilots.

I have found surprisingly ( tonque in cheek here) that if there is lift at
the airport we fly from there is usually lift 10 to 50 miles away but I
have
no way of convincing our board members.

Can anyone give me some ideas.... and do other clubs let their ships for
short cross country runs?

-mat
--
Marske Flying Wings
http://www.continuo.com/marske

Some time ago X-C requirements for instructors in France were even more
stringent : 1000 km XC including at least 1 300-km flight.

Asbjorn Hojmark a écrit:
On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 08:01:57 +0200, Bruce Greeff
wrote:


It is a requirement in South Africa - no silver C (at least one
50km XC) - no instructor brevet. Very simple.


It's the same in Denmark: At least one Silver C distance for HI
(sort of a 'helping hand' instructur, who can't sign anything
important) and at least two flights over 100 km for the FI.

-A

In France there is a specific qualification for XC instructor, in addition
to basic instructor qualification. Pre-requisite is in-flight skills
assessment + theoretical exam + 1000 XC experience in last 12 months + 2
week course.

For XC pilots an XC qualification delivered by an XC instructor is required,
with mandatory 8-hours, 3 flights, 1 outlanding etc.

However XC is strongly promoted by the federation via a yearly pilots/club
country-wide ranking based on your 5 longest flights. This helps because
number of clubs are frightened by XC activity ...

Jean

"Marc Till" ] a écrit dans le
message de ...
Some time ago X-C requirements for instructors in France were even more
stringent : 1000 km XC including at least 1 300-km flight.

"For Example John Smith" wrote
We are in the flat coastal plains and the club doesn't have a history of
promoting XC--our instructor staff and club management attitude are much the
same as you describe.

What might be interesting to you is how we are CHANGING.

And at what speed.

When I joined that club, nobody had gone XC in a club ship in years -
but things were changing. Club ships were going to go XC that season.
There was a program being put in place. I even remember attending
one of the meetings.

Eventually I got tired of waiting for the club to change. I bought my
own ship (an inexpensive metal one) and started teaching myself XC
flying. I flew some XC, got my commercial glider, eventually got my
CFIG, did some teaching, and even trained a CFIG myself. But I also
bought a twin, got heavily involved in instrument flying, got my CFII,
got heavily involved in instrument instruction, and sort of drifted
out of soaring.

As you might imagine, this is a process that took years.

The club is still changing. Club ships will go XC next season.

Michael

I am amazed that some clubs dont actively encourage XC! In our club virtually
everybody flies XC as soon as they are qualified to do so. OK some people
only do their 50km and never venture out of gliding range ever again.
The single seater club aircraft fly cross country on every possible occasion
and this year we have had 4 entered in regional competitions, 3 in national
competitions and one competing in the European Championships.
Note I said that these are club aircraft not private.
We do get occasional damage from field landings (stone chips etc) but this is
small price to pay.
Everyone who is flying XC on a particular day either arranges their own
retrieves or puts their name on the board for a mutual retrieve.
Nigel

I can only speak for the USA but here there is a minority with the idea that
gliding exists solely to support tow planes. The rag and tube taildragger
tug drivers want glider pilots to support their hobby by falling out of the
sky ASAP so they can fly another tow and log another takeoff and landing.
This idea goes hand in hand with the preference for Schweizer 2-33 trainers.

XC takes a glider away for the day with only one tow - no fun in that for
the tug drivers. Really good XC pilots release at less than 1500 feet AGL
which is even worse. No XC means more tows.

Bill Daniels

"OscarCVox" wrote in message
...
I am amazed that some clubs dont actively encourage XC! In our club
virtually
everybody flies XC as soon as they are qualified to do so. OK some
people
only do their 50km and never venture out of gliding range ever again.
The single seater club aircraft fly cross country on every possible
occasion
and this year we have had 4 entered in regional competitions, 3 in
national
competitions and one competing in the European Championships.
Note I said that these are club aircraft not private.
We do get occasional damage from field landings (stone chips etc) but this
is
small price to pay.
Everyone who is flying XC on a particular day either arranges their own
retrieves or puts their name on the board for a mutual retrieve.
Nigel

It's a real pleasure to have a good tuggie up front, usually a glider pilot
with some hours to his name. He'll know right away just how good you are and
will crank the tug around into a thermal if a good one presents itself.

This season I had 3 aerotows tows where I released at or just below 1000'
AGL, one of which was at no more than about 500' AGL. During a right hand
turnout from the initial liftoff in Spain we flew into a real stonker. The
tug climbed high as it flew into the core and I simply could not catch him.
I held on just long enough for the vario to confirm that it was 'off the
clock' pulled the plug and left the tug to complete a right hand circuit and
land. I got charged a cable break price for that one, it probably lasted
only about 1min 30 secs start to off tow.

Ian

"Bill Daniels" wrote in message
news:1Bg7d.150967$MQ5.46505@attbi_s52...
I can only speak for the USA but here there is a minority with the idea
that
gliding exists solely to support tow planes. The rag and tube taildragger
tug drivers want glider pilots to support their hobby by falling out of
the
sky ASAP so they can fly another tow and log another takeoff and landing.
This idea goes hand in hand with the preference for Schweizer 2-33
trainers.

XC takes a glider away for the day with only one tow - no fun in that for
the tug drivers. Really good XC pilots release at less than 1500 feet AGL
which is even worse. No XC means more tows.

Bill Daniels

"OscarCVox" wrote in message
...
I am amazed that some clubs dont actively encourage XC! In our club
virtually
everybody flies XC as soon as they are qualified to do so. OK some
people
only do their 50km and never venture out of gliding range ever again.
The single seater club aircraft fly cross country on every possible
occasion
and this year we have had 4 entered in regional competitions, 3 in
national
competitions and one competing in the European Championships.
Note I said that these are club aircraft not private.
We do get occasional damage from field landings (stone chips etc) but
this
is
small price to pay.
Everyone who is flying XC on a particular day either arranges their own
retrieves or puts their name on the board for a mutual retrieve.
Nigel

"MK" wrote in message ...
Ah, Politics! It takes patience and lobbying to make a change. First you
need to form a supportive base that will aid in promoting your view of what
the club should be - with reasoned arguments. Try to get like minded
members into officer positions. Most clubs, I believe are run in a fairly
democratic manner, so you need votes. Know your clubs by-laws and rules of
conduct regarding voting and decision making. It can get personal so be
prepared. It is a shame the club does not promote the SSA badge program for
non owners.

Mike

"mat Redsell" wrote in message
news:0LE6d.36$lf2.15@trnddc09...
I have been very concerned about our club, which discourages cross country
in club gliders. My thought is that purpose of soaring is cross country
and
if one just concentrates on flying above the airport then ones member ship
tends to end when you have your license.

We have many airports withing a 15 miles radius and many flat fields with
always an option of landing in cut hay fields, harvested bean and corn
fields etc. There is no lack of good landing fields or airports.

Our board is composed of pilots who do not go cross country and
surprisingly
none of the instructors have flown cross country ( there may be an
exception.... but none I know of have gone recently). And I am not allowed
to teach since I insist on wearing a parachute for both student and
instructor. ( I have in the past provided a chute for the student).

The thought at our club is that if you want to go cross country you buy
your own ship... a rasther harsh reality for many pilots.

I have found surprisingly ( tonque in cheek here) that if there is lift at
the airport we fly from there is usually lift 10 to 50 miles away but I
have
no way of convincing our board members.

Can anyone give me some ideas.... and do other clubs let their ships for
short cross country runs?

-mat
--
Marske Flying Wings
http://www.continuo.com/marske




Parachutes- don't fly without them. They seem to be just an expensive
piece of fabric to sit on, but when you need it....is there for you.
And only for you.
And if someone calls you "sissy", well...I'd rather be a "sissy" then
dead. Plain and simple. In addition, if you fly with parachute on your
back, you are more comfortable in flight. And that opens whole
different perspective for you as a pilot of a sailplane....
Now, if your club board members are not permitting XC, get rid of
them...if you can't, change clubs. Not permitting XC is the most
stupid thing...it teaches the pilot art of navigation, decision
making, much better weather analysis and interpretation, your skills
are becoming sharper, etc. When you fly around your airport don't you
know where the lift is? So, if you going low you fly to known to
everybody spot, you go up and wander around the neighborhood....sounds
familiar? All power to you for trying to change the club (stupid)
rules. Promote XC, it is good for every pilot...and then comes the
contest.

"MK" wrote in message ...
Ah, Politics! It takes patience and lobbying to make a change. First you
need to form a supportive base that will aid in promoting your view of what
the club should be - with reasoned arguments. Try to get like minded
members into officer positions. Most clubs, I believe are run in a fairly
democratic manner, so you need votes. Know your clubs by-laws and rules of
conduct regarding voting and decision making. It can get personal so be
prepared. It is a shame the club does not promote the SSA badge program for
non owners.

Mike

"mat Redsell" wrote in message
news:0LE6d.36$lf2.15@trnddc09...
I have been very concerned about our club, which discourages cross country
in club gliders. My thought is that purpose of soaring is cross country
and
if one just concentrates on flying above the airport then ones member ship
tends to end when you have your license.

We have many airports withing a 15 miles radius and many flat fields with
always an option of landing in cut hay fields, harvested bean and corn
fields etc. There is no lack of good landing fields or airports.

Our board is composed of pilots who do not go cross country and
surprisingly
none of the instructors have flown cross country ( there may be an
exception.... but none I know of have gone recently). And I am not allowed
to teach since I insist on wearing a parachute for both student and
instructor. ( I have in the past provided a chute for the student).

The thought at our club is that if you want to go cross country you buy
your own ship... a rasther harsh reality for many pilots.

I have found surprisingly ( tonque in cheek here) that if there is lift at
the airport we fly from there is usually lift 10 to 50 miles away but I
have
no way of convincing our board members.

Can anyone give me some ideas.... and do other clubs let their ships for
short cross country runs?

-mat
--
Marske Flying Wings
http://www.continuo.com/marske




Parachutes- don't fly without them. They seem to be just an expensive
piece of fabric to sit on, but when you need it....is there for you.
And only for you.
And if someone calls you "sissy", well...I'd rather be a "sissy" then
dead. Plain and simple. In addition, if you fly with parachute on your
back, you are more comfortable in flight. And that opens whole
different perspective for you as a pilot of a sailplane....
Now, if your club board members are not permitting XC, get rid of
them...if you can't, change clubs. Not permitting XC is the most
stupid thing...it teaches the pilot art of navigation, decision
making, much better weather analysis and interpretation, your skills
are becoming sharper, etc. When you fly around your airport don't you
know where the lift is? So, if you going low you fly to known to
everybody spot, you go up and wander around the neighborhood....sounds
familiar? All power to you for trying to change the club (stupid)
rules. Promote XC, it is good for every pilot...and then comes the
contest.

Bill Daniels wrote:

...here [in the USA] there is a minority with the idea that
gliding exists solely to support tow planes.

[....]


Really good XC pilots release at less than 1500 feet AGL
which is even worse. No XC means more tows.

Au Contraire, Buttercup. There is nothing more boring than dragging some
poor schmuck to 3500' agl so he can stay up for an extra 5 minutes.

In reality, we tow pilots can hardly wait to get back down for the next
pattern-tow so we can maximize our exposure to the more dangerous phase
of the sport. It's the self-sacrficial aspect that draws us to those
beloved "rag and tube" tugs. And if someone builds a better tug, you'll
probably complain that the tows have become too expensive.

Your nemeses are no doubt substantially in the minority, and not very
good at accounting, either.


Jack