Bush flew fighter jets, but never over VIETNAM.

Subject: Bush flew fighter jets, but never over VIETNAM.
From: (BUFDRVR)
Date: 7/12/2004 3:26 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

ArtKramr wrote:

You must be unusually brilliant.

Hardly.

Do you know gat operation Casy Jones was in WW
II?

I plead ignorance on that one. Operation Market Garden and of course Overlord
are the only named operations of WWII I know off the top of my cranium.


BUFDRVR


The day the war ended we fitted our Marauders with 10X10 Fairschild mapping
cameras and started flying mapping missions deep into Russian territory with
the cameras rolling.. That was Operation Casey Jones. In all thse years I have
never heard a single reference to it by any historian or in any text. It was a
secret of the cold war that was never revealed. I piled up the hours, but
couldn't call them combat hours so I stand pat with my 250 out of 1100..For
everyone who thinks they can read a book and all will be revealed, forget it.
There is much that will never be revealed in books. If those who lived it never
reveal it, it will be lost to history forever


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

Ed Rasimus wrote:

On 12 Jul 2004 01:17:58 GMT, (ArtKramr) wrote:

Subject: Bush flew fighter jets, but never over VIETNAM.
From: Ed Rasimus
Date: 7/11/2004 1:41 PM Pac

Art, I recall sending you a copy of When Thunder Rolled. If you read
it, you'll find a clear explanation of what the Route Packages were
and you won't have to ask questions like "what's a Pack 6

snip

And if he wants a (somewhat limited) map before that, here's one online:

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/histo...m/469th/p6.htm

and here's an article from Air force Magazine by Walt Boyne, with an even
more limited map:

www.afa.org/magazine/Nov1999/1199pack6.pdf

Guy

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message ink.net...
"Fred the Red Shirt" wrote in message
om...

As you know, he did not volunteer for deployment in Vietnam.
When he enlisted in the ANG he indicated that he did not want
to be stationsed overseas. Later, when he had only a couple of
years left, he did volunteer for a program that could have
deployed him overseas, but not necessarily in Vietnam. He didn't
have enough expience, and the aircraft for which he was qualified
was being phased out so, one does wonder why he did.


Being phased out, but in USAF service until mid 1973.

Here we a

http://www.warbirdforum.com/bushf102.htm

Bush recalls that toward the end of his training, he
volunteered for the "Palace Alert" program which sent
F-102 pilots to Europe and Asia for six-month tours.
He was turned down, no doubt because he didn't have
the flying time to qualify for the program. In any event,
he couldn't have been sent to Southeast Asia to take
part in the Vietnam War, at least not to fly a Delta
Dagger: the F-102 detachments in Vietnam and Thailand
were shut down in December 1969, before Bush got his wings.

I note that the source for the story that he volunteered is
Bush himself.

--

FF

On Mon, 12 Jul 2004 23:04:03 GMT, Guy Alcala
wrote:

and here's an article from Air force Magazine by Walt Boyne, with an even
more limited map:

www.afa.org/magazine/Nov1999/1199pack6.pdf

From the last page:
"...Robin Olds, an ace from World War II and Korea who also flew
fighters in Vietnam. Olds has said that none of his missions over
Germany in World War II were as bad as any one of his missions over
Hanoi during the Vietnam War..."

"Buzzer" wrote in message
...

From the last page:
"...Robin Olds, an ace from World War II and Korea who also flew
fighters in Vietnam. Olds has said that none of his missions over
Germany in World War II were as bad as any one of his missions over
Hanoi during the Vietnam War..."

The only connection with Korea that Robin Olds had was reading about it in
the newspapers while serving with an ADC unit in Pittsburgh. Not all pilots
in at the time served in Korea as he would be the first to tell you.

Tex

Bush recalls that toward the end of his training, he
volunteered for the "Palace Alert" program

Contemporary proof, please.

Like this:

http://awolbush.com/images/kerr_bush_nam.gif

In February, 1968 Bush asked not to be sent overseas. What he "recalls"
doesn't amount to a hill of beans.

No one, to my knowledge, has come forward to say they saw Bush after Mid- 1972.

Walt

ArtKramr wrote:

Subject: Bush flew fighter jets, but never over VIETNAM.
From: (BUFDRVR)
Date: 7/12/2004 3:26 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

ArtKramr wrote:

You must be unusually brilliant.

Hardly.

Do you know gat operation Casy Jones was in WW
II?

I plead ignorance on that one. Operation Market Garden and of course Overlord
are the only named operations of WWII I know off the top of my cranium.


BUFDRVR


The day the war ended we fitted our Marauders with 10X10 Fairschild mapping
cameras and started flying mapping missions deep into Russian territory with
the cameras rolling.. That was Operation Casey Jones. In all thse years I have
never heard a single reference to it by any historian or in any text. It was a
secret of the cold war that was never revealed. I piled up the hours, but
couldn't call them combat hours so I stand pat with my 250 out of 1100..For
everyone who thinks they can read a book and all will be revealed, forget it.
There is much that will never be revealed in books. If those who lived it never
reveal it, it will be lost to history forever

Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer


Art,

Sounds like you've been reading the discussion on the Army/Airforce
Discussion Board.

Here is an extract from a recent posting:

"Yes, the summer 1945 overflight of Europe was called "Operation Casey
Jones." This mission was a mapping project, the overflight of "Occupied
Germany and territories occupied by Germany" to update maps. Thus the
B-17s were stripped of armament to gain altitude for their 'straight
runs' for mapping.

This is what is said in the released documents in the USAF archives in
1979."

Dave

"D. Strang" wrote in
news:RCDIc.23225$r3.18727@okepread03:

[snip]

The guy was a fricking Governor, for Christ's sakes. You think people
just vote for anyone?

Kinda a real bad example, Slick was, after all, a gubner.
Course he was also a pot smokin, prevaricatin', philanderin',
swindlin', draft-dodgin' sumbitch.

But.... I digress.

IBM

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"Ian MacLure" wrote
"D. Strang" wrote

[snip]

The guy was a fricking Governor, for Christ's sakes. You think people
just vote for anyone?

Kinda a real bad example, Slick was, after all, a gubner.
Course he was also a pot smokin, prevaricatin', philanderin',
swindlin', draft-dodgin' sumbitch.

But.... I digress.

My point was, no one gave a **** (the people who voted) about his military
record, and no one (the people who voted) cared about Bush, or I predict,
anyone else's military records. Unless they were convicted of some crime,
the public could care less what you did in the service. That's the crap for
historians, and TV programs to sell soap.

"B2431" wrote in message
...

Not to be difficult, but the T-39 Sabreliner was made by Rockwell.



North American Aviation, Inc., merged with Rockwell Standard Corporation and
became North American Rockwell Corporation in September 1967. I believe
North American had completed production of the T-39 series by that time.