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Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range



 
 
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  #11  
Old January 24th 20, 08:15 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

In terms of air-mass sensing, I found the Air Glide S to be on par with the ClearNav-Vario. The CNv was easier to install, but the wind calculation did not work well. I also found the Air Glide to be easier to use and of a much better quality of the hardware.

However, an old Zander ZS1 is still an excellent device for air-mass sensing. Wouldn't replace it with any of the two above unless I have to.
  #12  
Old January 24th 20, 06:16 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Jonathan St. Cloud
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:18:22 PM UTC-8, jfitch wrote:
On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 12:53:35 PM UTC-8, wrote:
I have not seen a better airmass vario system than the Butterfly. Most importantly to me, its wind solutions are amazingly good. It has been a game-changer for many in the Tehachapi-Southern Sierra tribe. The location of convergence lines is critical to X-C in the Owens Valley and Great Basin. The accuracy and update rate of Butterfly winds are outstanding and a tremendous asset it "convergence hunting. My only issue is its complexity, i.e., the large number of user-defined parameters available and what exactly their effects are on vario display, sensitivity and response. I have flown a Butterfly for 3 years, incrementally changing some parameters and am still not comfortable with its behaviors, especially when compared to the CAI 302.

It terms of "best" vario for X-C flying, the 302 is also very good and an incredible value.


No just for convergence: I been able to find weak waves on days when it was very difficult by watching the sudden increase in headwind. I will see an increase of 5 - 10 knots and sure enough there it is. Also have found persistent exploitable afternoon Zephyrs in the Minden area. Never have seen these on the more traditional wind calcs.

Paired with iGlide, you will get a wind vector calculated each second and displayed in the lift dot of the thermal assistant. The wind vectors reliably point towards the center of the lift. I've been told this may be unique to rough/strong western thermals, but it works well there in strong but very inconsistent (and therefore hard to center) lift.


The Butterfly coupled with connect stick to feed data to iGlide on an iPhone gives you a great backup or primary computer too.
  #13  
Old January 24th 20, 08:27 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
jfitch
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 5:39:31 AM UTC-8, Jim Hogue wrote:
Any suggestions? Either currently available or coming in the near future (next year or so) would be ok, I am not in a rush. Prefer it would fit in one 57mm hole.

I take care of navigation and tasks with other standalone devices (full on OpenVario with its own vario/STF sensor board, and a Kobo backup) so I don’t really need any nav functions. Above all I want the best total energy and gust compensated technology available, the best to allow me to understand airmass movement while cruising across the full speed range. I want MacReady speed-to-fly function (although I use that as advisory information only, I don’t aggressively dolphin fly...). I also need climb/cruise and airmass awareness audio functionality of course, head-out-of-the-cockpit being best.

I fly an ASH-26E, and I would prefer a system that can work off just pitot and static, avoiding the vertical fin mounted TE probe (which gets hammered during engine runs). This is because thermalling during powered climb can be important to me when flying out of high density altitude airports. But if using the TE probe gets me significantly better airmass awareness in cruise, I would take that.

I am attracted to the FLARM voice warnings that the S8/S10 units give, but I would do without this in order to get the best airmass awareness.

My OpenVario gives me a thermalling assist graphic which seems to work great, but if the new system offers improvement here I would like that also.

Please offer you experiences and knowledge here. Thanks in advance!

Cheers,
Jim J6


A couple of other points for Jim: The Air Avionics has very good voice warnings of Flarm and ADSB targets, spoilers open, gear down, etc. It is possible to thermal with the inertial air mass sensors alone (no pneumatics needed) with the engine boom deployed.

An interesting thing about pneumatic noise from the engine boom is that the signal required is still present, just very noisy. Using the old Winpilot Thermal Maximizer (still the best) or the pretty good copy on the CN vario, you can mind the thermal center correction arrow ignoring the noisy data itself and thermal quite successfully. The software integrates out the noise.. This is true regardless of the vario input - at least I've done it routinely with a 302/Winpilot in the old days and the CN now.
  #14  
Old January 24th 20, 09:48 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

Jim H and Jim, I wonder if this generation of glider guiders could even find or center a thermal using a simple mechanical vario lol How far we have advanced but also how far we have digressed in skills.
  #15  
Old January 24th 20, 10:11 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Jim Hogue
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

On Friday, January 24, 2020 at 2:48:34 PM UTC-6, wrote:
Jim H and Jim, I wonder if this generation of glider guiders could even find or center a thermal using a simple mechanical vario lol How far we have advanced but also how far we have digressed in skills.


Haha! For me, it seems like finding the sweet air is getting more difficult every year! And I don't even have a mechanical vario in my '26, not enough room in the panel, haha. I really ought to fly the other '26 (the club's 1-26) more often, and without a battery, to prove to myself I can still do it "old school"....

One thing I have always found difficult is sorting out what the airmass is doing when I am cruising at speeds above about 80 knots, and in the presence of gusts and turbulence. Enlisting new technology to help me here...

Cheers,
Jim J6
  #16  
Old January 24th 20, 10:14 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

Truth there Jim, even though I have the 302 setup as super netto in cruise mode, I tend to use my behind to tell me if its worth stopping.
  #17  
Old January 24th 20, 10:53 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

On Friday, January 24, 2020 at 3:48:34 PM UTC-5, wrote:
Jim H and Jim, I wonder if this generation of glider guiders could even find or center a thermal using a simple mechanical vario lol How far we have advanced but also how far we have digressed in skills.


I suspect that many have not calibrated their Alpha Sierra Sierra sensors anytime recently. Failure to calibrate these sensors leaves one totally digitally dependent.
Risky and prone to long term failure.
UH
  #19  
Old January 25th 20, 12:42 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
jfitch
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

On Friday, January 24, 2020 at 12:48:34 PM UTC-8, wrote:
Jim H and Jim, I wonder if this generation of glider guiders could even find or center a thermal using a simple mechanical vario lol How far we have advanced but also how far we have digressed in skills.


A simple mechanical vario was new tech when I learned. Real varios have a red pellet and a green pellet as the only moving parts. Those were the days. I don't miss them. My current glider has a full in-flight infotainment system that can even play full length movies - great for those long boring final glides.

It's hard to feel thermals at 90 knots in a carbon glider full of water. At 17 knots in a hang glider (1lb/sq ft) you really get a feel for the structure of the thermal which can be quite exciting at times.
  #20  
Old January 25th 20, 01:13 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default Best vario for airmass awareness across the speed range

I've been flying with a CNv the past few years. I like it a lot. Much better info on airmass and dramatically easier centering the thermal. But there are times I ignore it and rely on an old Winter mechanical. I'm talking about a turn or two, not an extended climb. So I can still fly without the newer gadgets. I just don't feel like it.

Chip Bearden
JB
 




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