How to get IFR Clearance enroute?

(Stimbo) wrote in message . com...
I, of course, know that I can simply FILE IFR from the get-go and just
not activate it until I need it.

Well, let's clarify a bit here what you can and can't readily do.

Suppose you're flying from NJ to FL and you expect to hit poor
weather about VA.

You *can* file an IFR flight plan originating from an airport,
navaid, or intersection in N. Va. Just give an estimated departure
time of approximately when you think you'll get there (+ 1/2 hr).

You *can't* file an IFR flight plan originating from NJ, and expect
to activate it in N. Va. Your flight plan will not be accessible
to controllers in N. Va until it is activated ("departed") by ATC
in NJ.

However NJ to FL is a 9-hour flight
in a Cessna 172 plus 2 stops totalling 10 to 12 hours. I don't
remember how long the IFR plan stays active in the system (3 hours?)

It varies depending upon how busy the area is. It's usually something
like 1/2 hr before to 1 hr after the estimated departure time. It might
be as long as 3 hrs in some places, or even shorter than 1 1/2 hrs if
the system is busy.

I guess this procedure makes me file every time I make a
fuel/potty stop.

Well, not necessarily. You could file all your legs at home, using
the estimated departure times you calculate from your ETEs. Just file
several flight plans.

OTOH, I get a weather briefing every time I make a fuel stop -- the
airports with the best fuel prices don't necessarily have the best
computerized wx. Once you're on the phone talking to FSS, filing
a new flight plan only adds a minute.

Thanks to SNOWBIRD (Sydney) for such great detail and your anecdotes.

You're welcome

My eventual goal is to the Bahamas.

Been there, loved it. Chicken to fly back SE since our child was
born. If you fly over 10k you can typically minimize the time
you're out of glide to a few minutes. We did the "out islands"
(Eleuthera, Harbor Island among others) and flew back from Marsh
Harbor (the busiest non-towered airport I ever encountered -- made
me want to kiss the next 10 ATCS I talked to). AOPA has a pretty
good package on it, and Pilot's Guide was pretty helpful.

Cheers,
Sydney

(Snowbird) wrote:
IMHO, that's one of the big "gotchas" for an IFR GA pilot. It's
all too easy to fly along over a nice little layer, with a few fleecy
clouds above and around, beautiful blue sky and brilliant sunshine,
and have no clue at all that the wx is deteriorating below ILS minimums
down below (and gosh, that excellent preflight wx briefing said there'd
be 1500-2000 ft ceilings).

That's why I always call Flight Watch once I'm up in the air to see how
things are going at my destination. If everything is as expected, I can
relax and enjoy the flight. If things have unexpectedly gone south,
I've still got plenty of time to make a new plan (brief an approach,
divert, whatever).

Stimbo
in your case, filing on the ground will not work for you. the problem is
that when you leave the sector of your FSS then the flight plan you filed
is gone. After you enter the new sector, you either have to call the FSS
and file again, or if you had done a composite then it will be available
at where you wanted to pick it up. In this case, you would need to use an
intersection or some type of navaid as the place to pick it up. to
activate it, when your near th espot you chose, you just call center and
tell them you have a IFR flight plan you would like to open.

but if your expecting good weather, it may be easier to file in the air if
you find you need to do it.

Stimbo wrote:

Thanks to EVERYONE for such great suggestions!

You provided me some new ideas, and some that were just plain common
sense, I must admit.

I, of course, know that I can simply FILE IFR from the get-go and just
not activate it until I need it. However NJ to FL is a 9-hour flight
in a Cessna 172 plus 2 stops totalling 10 to 12 hours. I don't
remember how long the IFR plan stays active in the system (3 hours?)
before it's dropped. I guess this procedure makes me file every time
I make a fuel/potty stop.

I like the COMPOSITE flight plan idea. I had sorta forgotten about
it. I need to read more about it. Is this easy to
implement/activate?

Thanks to SNOWBIRD (Sydney) for such great detail and your anecdotes.

Yes - I should have originally stated that if VFR it would be with
Flight Following. That's too long of a flight without help of some
kind - especially these days (TFR's etc.)

My eventual goal is to the Bahamas. I may start a new thread for some
tips.

Thanks again!

Stimbo
Medford, NJ

Around here, especially in SoCal, this is what I always do, I file at home, when
I get near the HEC VOR (the start of ziggy3) and if it looks like its below VFR
I call and tell them I have a ifr flight plan I would like to activate, they get
my N number, then come back with my clearance. Painless.

Maule Driver wrote:

"Stimbo" wrote in message
om...
I, of course, know that I can simply FILE IFR from the get-go and just
not activate it until I need it.

Well, not really. If you file, you need to open at departure. Otherwise,
down the line they won't know who you are and may not go look.

Roy Smith wrote in message ...
(Snowbird) wrote:
IMHO, that's one of the big "gotchas" for an IFR GA pilot. It's
all too easy to fly along over a nice little layer, with a few fleecy
clouds above and around, beautiful blue sky and brilliant sunshine,
and have no clue at all that the wx is deteriorating below ILS minimums
down below (and gosh, that excellent preflight wx briefing said there'd
be 1500-2000 ft ceilings).

That's why I always call Flight Watch once I'm up in the air to see how
things are going at my destination. If everything is as expected, I can
relax and enjoy the flight. If things have unexpectedly gone south,
I've still got plenty of time to make a new plan (brief an approach,
divert, whatever).

Yes, exactly. And I imagine if it's a fairly long flight, you may
call Flight Watch more than once and maybe get some NEXRAD or metars
with CBAV (that's what we do, anyway, given the trace of a clue that
things aren't as predicted).

My point was to the chap who seemed to imply, if you have to file
enroute, you didn't brief properly preflight...t'aint true. Mommy
Nature doesn't seem to read the TAFs.

Best,
Sydney

Roy Smith wrote:



Of course, it's utterly absurd that we should have to go to these
contortions to get flight plans in the system when we want them. We've
passed the point where desktop PC's have more memory than the FAA
computers. We're now at the point where iPods have more.

The FAA is out of money for modernization. They can barely keep up with
maintenance and their GIANT payroll.

They couch their failures in obtuse concepts of "performance or customer
based programs."

Meanwhile the STARS TRACON system is slowing down, the Data-Link "promise"
(first made in the early 1970s) is once again slowing down, and WAAS seems
to be going nowhere.

In that scheme of events, the processing of G/A flight plans isn't exactly
on the top of the pile. Keep in mind that the airlines and biz jets don't
have flight plan issues.~

On Thu, 20 May 2004 11:46:33 GMT, Nathan Young
wrote:

On 19 May 2004 21:04:44 -0700, (Snowbird)
wrote:

(Stimbo) wrote in message . com...
What are the recommended procedures in obtaining an IFR clearance
enroute?

Ask .

More specifically: it helps ATC if your info is in the system. The
more info in the system, the more it helps.

Officially, the way to obtain an IFR clearance enroute is to contact
FSS in the air, file an IFR flight plan with them from some point
your route will cross (navaid, intersection, airport) to your
destination, request the correct facility and freq. to contact ATC
if you don't know.

When filing en route, what do you use as the departure airport? I
always give the actual departure airport even though I left there some
time ago. For my route of flight, I just use the closest VORs
remaining on the flightplan.

Seems like there has to be a better way.

Thanks for your answers everyone.

-Nathan

wrote in message ...

In that scheme of events, the processing of G/A flight plans isn't exactly
on the top of the pile. Keep in mind that the airlines and biz jets don't
have flight plan issues.~


I can't recall ever having a bizjet file enroute. I'm certain I've never
had an airliner do it.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:


I can't recall ever having a bizjet file enroute. I'm certain I've never
had an airliner do it.

Exactly. Airline flight plans are filed by dispatchers directly into the
system. Biz jets are ground filers as well.

wrote in message ...

Exactly. Airline flight plans are filed by dispatchers directly into the
system. Biz jets are ground filers as well.


So what were you trying to make with your comparison? Private pilots that
file on the ground don't have any more flight plan issues than bizjets and
airliners.