President of our local EAA chapter killed in inaugural flight

Yesterday (Saturday) the president of our local EAA chapter here in Central
NY (USA) and a passenger were killed during the first takeoff of their
just-completed Lancair Legacy aircraft. Sadly they had invited family and
friends to witness this first flight.

According to the news article, the pilot/president was a former B-52 pilot
during the Vietnam war and had spent the last two years building the Lancair
Legacy.

From initial witness accounts speculation suggests engine failure on takeoff
followed by a turning stall.

http://tinyurl.com/2p9csw

--
Peter

Peter,

Sad. My condolences.

I'll speculatively ask the obvious, though, with the usual caveats of
not knowing the full story:

1.Passenger? On the first flight? Even if it's the guy you built it
with...
2. Turn back to the runway? I can sympathize, if you have spent years
building the plane, but still...

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

"Peter R." wrote

Yesterday (Saturday) the president of our local EAA chapter here in
Central
NY (USA) and a passenger were killed during the first takeoff of their
just-completed Lancair Legacy aircraft. Sadly they had invited family and
friends to witness this first flight.

According to the news article, the pilot/president was a former B-52 pilot
during the Vietnam war and had spent the last two years building the
Lancair
Legacy.

From initial witness accounts speculation suggests engine failure on
takeoff
followed by a turning stall.

http://tinyurl.com/2p9csw

Condolences, and prayers for the family.

Not to be unfeeling, but it sounds like someone who should know better
violated two rules, generally accepted by the homebuilt community.

First, why was there family at the airport? It is said that this makes a
person have extra pressure to take off, ready or not, and is hard on the
family if things go badly.

Two, why the HELL where there two people on board? Regulations do not allow
a passenger on the first 25 or 50 hours, depending on the assigned test
period. One more person and his family experienced tragedy, needlessly.

Do you know if he did a full power test, (for what is it, that is
recommended - 2 or 5 minutes?) with the nose up as high as takeoff and climb
attitude would be?

It seems as though this is an often skipped test, that is probably the most
important pre-flight test that exists. I hope that is not the case.
--
Jim in NC

On Sun, 15 Apr 2007 13:21:47 -0400, "Morgans" wrote:

Two, why the HELL where there two people on board? Regulations do not allow
a passenger on the first 25 or 50 hours, depending on the assigned test
period.

Regulations state that no one but required crew be aboard. Some people put a
second person aboard to "monitor the engine and other systems to allow the pilot
to concentrate on controlling the aircraft" and thus claim the second person is
"required crew." I personally don't agree with it, and IIRC, the FAA has
specifically come out denying it, but it does happen.

Ron Wanttaja

In article ,
"Morgans" wrote:

"Peter R." wrote

Yesterday (Saturday) the president of our local EAA chapter here in
Central
NY (USA) and a passenger were killed during the first takeoff of their
just-completed Lancair Legacy aircraft. Sadly they had invited family and
friends to witness this first flight.

According to the news article, the pilot/president was a former B-52 pilot
during the Vietnam war and had spent the last two years building the
Lancair
Legacy.

From initial witness accounts speculation suggests engine failure on
takeoff
followed by a turning stall.

http://tinyurl.com/2p9csw

Condolences, and prayers for the family.

Not to be unfeeling, but it sounds like someone who should know better
violated two rules, generally accepted by the homebuilt community.

First, why was there family at the airport? It is said that this makes a
person have extra pressure to take off, ready or not, and is hard on the
family if things go badly.

Two, why the HELL where there two people on board? Regulations do not allow
a passenger on the first 25 or 50 hours, depending on the assigned test
period. One more person and his family experienced tragedy, needlessly.

Do you know if he did a full power test, (for what is it, that is
recommended - 2 or 5 minutes?) with the nose up as high as takeoff and climb
attitude would be?

It seems as though this is an often skipped test, that is probably the most
important pre-flight test that exists. I hope that is not the case.

I echo the condolences to all involved.

That said, I was in a chapter in CA that had three fatalities two on the
respective first flights. In both of those the builders/pilots were
secretive about their planes and did not invite other chapter members to
view the planes before the first flight. Both planes had fatal flaws.

The third had an engine problem and attempted flight anyway.

Another man here did an auto conversion in a Mustang II (both very
crude) and had an engine failure, despite other's warnings not to fly.
He apparently had a V-belt fail, which flailed about the engine
compartment and took out the ignition wiring. The forced landing in a
golf course was fatal.

Better results occurred with a friend who built an RV-4. He was doing
taxi tests and reported control/response anomalies to a friend and
myself. We recognized the anomalies and asked to see the plane before it
flew. Between us, we spotted 60 discrepancies -- some minor -- some
major and safety threatening, such as a fuel line too near an exhaust
pipe and throttle/mixture controls mounted on am aluminum plate subject
to vibration/fatigue failure. He corrected all and went on to many happy
hours in the plane.

PLEASE, GUYS! Before you fly (or even taxi test) get as many sets of
eyeballs as you can to inspect, critique, improve your handiwork!

It is not a reflection on you if something is wrong!

It is a reflection on your friends that they care enough to try to keep
you around to enjoy your company!

On 2007-04-15 09:09:09 -0700, "Peter R." said:

Yesterday (Saturday) the president of our local EAA chapter here in Central
NY (USA) and a passenger were killed during the first takeoff of their
just-completed Lancair Legacy aircraft. Sadly they had invited family and
friends to witness this first flight.

According to the news article, the pilot/president was a former B-52 pilot
during the Vietnam war and had spent the last two years building the Lancair
Legacy.

From initial witness accounts speculation suggests engine failure on takeoff
followed by a turning stall.

http://tinyurl.com/2p9csw

That is terrible, very sad.
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

"Ron Wanttaja" wrote

Regulations state that no one but required crew be aboard. Some people
put a
second person aboard to "monitor the engine and other systems to allow the
pilot
to concentrate on controlling the aircraft" and thus claim the second
person is
"required crew." I personally don't agree with it, and IIRC, the FAA has
specifically come out denying it, but it does happen.

But how does it happen? I'll bet if they told the FAA that they were going
to have a two person required crew, the FAA would say, "The hell you are!"

I recall the same thing about the FAA ruling, that there was no
justification to having two people aboard in the testing phase.

To say two people are required in the plane, would be to say that it would
require two to fly the plane, always, as in some of the older biz jets.

Most of the newer biz jets do not have to have a two person flight crew, I
believe. If you can fly a .8 mach jet with one person, you surely do not
need two pilots to fly a Lancair.
--
Jim in NC

In article ,
Orval Fairbairn wrote:

PLEASE, GUYS! Before you fly (or even taxi test) get as many sets of
eyeballs as you can to inspect, critique, improve your handiwork!

It is not a reflection on you if something is wrong!

It is a reflection on your friends that they care enough to try to keep
you around to enjoy your company!

Good comments.

For those of you who remember Burt Rutan's proof-of-concept ground
attack aircraft, he mounted a Sony video camera so that it gave an
over-the-shoulder view of the cockpit controls and instrument panel.
Two crossed strings provided an x- and y-axis displacement reference of
the control stick in the cameras field of view.

On Sun, 15 Apr 2007 17:12:57 -0400, "Morgans" wrote:


"Ron Wanttaja" wrote

Regulations state that no one but required crew be aboard. Some people
put a second person aboard to "monitor the engine and other systems
to allow the pilot to concentrate on controlling the aircraft" and
thus claim the second person is "required crew." I personally don't
agree with it, and IIRC, the FAA has specifically come out denying it,
but it does happen.

But how does it happen? I'll bet if they told the FAA that they were going
to have a two person required crew, the FAA would say, "The hell you are!"

Simple: They just don't tell the FAA. There's no requirement for an FAA
representative to be there for the first flight. What they don't know, they
can't stop.

I looked at my accident database for the years 1998-2004. During that time
period, there were about 75 accidents on the first flight of a homebuilt. Four
of them had multiple persons aboard. About one in ten accidents that occurred
during the first 40 flight hours had more than one person aboard (although some
aircraft do have shorter test periods).

Ron Wanttaja

On 4/15/2007 1:21:47 PM, "Morgans" wrote:

Do you know if he did a full power test, (for what is it, that is
recommended - 2 or 5 minutes?) with the nose up as high as takeoff and
climb attitude would be?

No idea. Coincidentally I was at that airport a couple of hours earlier
partaking in my BFR, but I was not there when this accident occurred. Given
the number of ground-based witnesses including at least one very experienced
pilot, I suspect that the answer to your question is known and will come out
in the accident investigation.

--
Peter