A aviation & planes forum. AviationBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AviationBanter forum » rec.aviation newsgroups » Restoration
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Why were almost all of them scrapped?



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old November 18th 05, 02:38 PM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

Didn't ANYBODY after WW2 have the love of airplanes and the foresight
to buy at least one military airplane, especially since they were so
cheap? What were they thinking?! Did they not see the value of these
planes for future generations? Why didn't some civilians simply buy a
B-17 for $700 and park it in their yard? Land is cheap in rural areas.
These airplanes are so precious to me. I have loved the glory of ww2
fighters and bombers since the earliest childhood.

Another question: if someone had the money, would it be possible to use
blueprints to build perfect reproductions of airplanes like the B-17
and P-40?

Ads
  #2  
Old November 19th 05, 01:15 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 09:34:46 -0500, Chuck Harris
wrote:

wrote:
Didn't ANYBODY after WW2 have the love of airplanes and the foresight
to buy at least one military airplane, especially since they were so
cheap? What were they thinking?! Did they not see the value of these
planes for future generations? Why didn't some civilians simply buy a
B-17 for $700 and park it in their yard? Land is cheap in rural areas.
These airplanes are so precious to me. I have loved the glory of ww2
fighters and bombers since the earliest childhood.

Another question: if someone had the money, would it be possible to use
blueprints to build perfect reproductions of airplanes like the B-17
and P-40?


Back in the 70's I had a chance to purchase 5 P-51s down in Texas. for
something like $4,000 or $5,000 each. They even had gas in them. I
had a good paying job, and this would have been about a years wages.
course I had enough skill to fly a Piper Colt and about a half hour in
a tail dragger.

At the behest of the US airplane manufacturers, most were scrapped
to avoid flooding the US market with cheap planes... something that surely
would have forced many manufacturers out of business.

"Boat loads" of new airplanes still in crates on the lend lease
program were pushed overboard into the ocean. Being these were planes
like the F4U Corsair they would have had little impact on the the us
manufacturers as there were few with the ability to fly them and fewer
still who could have afforded to maintain and fly one.


But they weren't all scrapped. Tens of thousands were bought by civilian's
for various reasons. Some became water bombers used by the forest service,
some became shelters and hunting cabins, some were bought by enthusiastic
collecters, and parked in fields until the mice and birds destroyed all
but the hulks, some are flying on poles acting as canapies for gas pumps,
some are posed to look like they crashed into buildings... and some are
in the skies thanks to the efforts of some of the most generous restorers
in the world.

Mustangs have been built almost entirely from scratch, you can buy new
manufactured replica parts for just about any part in the plane. There


And they give new meaning to "expensive parts":-))

is a group that is manufacturing replica German fighters too. Money


If you are referring to the ME262 they are only doing 5 last I heard.
That project has moved around a bit, but I think they have at least 2
flying now.

http://www.rogerhalstead.com/me262.htm Is a photo of the original
loaned to the project to use as a model for the construction of the
new aircraft. It was on static display in front of the Willow Grove
Naval Air Station a ways north of Philadelphia. The photo was shot in
the Fall of 1984 as were the ones of the Orion P-3s.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com


talks, but remember, the effort required to tool up the US manufacturers
to make these planes in the first place was greater in scope than the
NASA moon launches.

It only takes about 10 minutes of research to find this out. I thought
you said WWII planes meant a lot to you?

-Chuck

  #3  
Old November 19th 05, 03:05 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

Being these were planes like the F4U Corsair they would have had little impact on the the us
manufacturers as there were few with the ability to fly them .....


There were thousands if not hundreds of thousands of guys who had
been through military flight training; any of them should have been
able to fly the F4U--perhaps after a few refresher hours in the SNJ
(T-6). After all, the guys who flew them during WW II and Korea got
into them after only a little more than 200 hours of flight training.
Possibly less than that during the early days, when we desperately
needed pilots. (Yes, I realize some managed to kill themselves, but
people do that in cars and Piper Cubs, too.)

and fewer still who could have afforded to maintain and fly one.


Now you've hit the nail on the head! I would have bought a U-bird in
a minute had I been able to afford one.

vince norris







But they weren't all scrapped. Tens of thousands were bought by civilian's
for various reasons. Some became water bombers used by the forest service,
some became shelters and hunting cabins, some were bought by enthusiastic
collecters, and parked in fields until the mice and birds destroyed all
but the hulks, some are flying on poles acting as canapies for gas pumps,
some are posed to look like they crashed into buildings... and some are
in the skies thanks to the efforts of some of the most generous restorers
in the world.

Mustangs have been built almost entirely from scratch, you can buy new
manufactured replica parts for just about any part in the plane. There


And they give new meaning to "expensive parts":-))

is a group that is manufacturing replica German fighters too. Money


If you are referring to the ME262 they are only doing 5 last I heard.
That project has moved around a bit, but I think they have at least 2
flying now.

http://www.rogerhalstead.com/me262.htm Is a photo of the original
loaned to the project to use as a model for the construction of the
new aircraft. It was on static display in front of the Willow Grove
Naval Air Station a ways north of Philadelphia. The photo was shot in
the Fall of 1984 as were the ones of the Orion P-3s.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com


talks, but remember, the effort required to tool up the US manufacturers
to make these planes in the first place was greater in scope than the
NASA moon launches.

It only takes about 10 minutes of research to find this out. I thought
you said WWII planes meant a lot to you?

-Chuck


  #4  
Old November 19th 05, 06:27 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

flugwerk.de also make a new fw-190, and replica P-40s have and are
still being made around the world, but your looking at over $1m usd for
something airworthy, replica or original.

  #5  
Old November 20th 05, 01:10 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

On 18 Nov 2005 21:27:51 -0800, "109" wrote:

flugwerk.de also make a new fw-190, and replica P-40s have and are
still being made around the world, but your looking at over $1m usd for
something airworthy, replica or original.


I think you can still find the occasional airworthy P-51 for a bit
over half a million, but that is because there are so many of them,
relatively speaking. The F4U is very rare and they are up into the
millions.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com
  #6  
Old November 20th 05, 01:15 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 21:05:27 -0500, vincent p. norris
wrote:

Being these were planes like the F4U Corsair they would have had little impact on the the us
manufacturers as there were few with the ability to fly them .....


There were thousands if not hundreds of thousands of guys who had
been through military flight training; any of them should have been
able to fly the F4U--perhaps after a few refresher hours in the SNJ
(T-6). After all, the guys who flew them during WW II and Korea got
into them after only a little more than 200 hours of flight training.


According to a program on the Discovery channel they were putting guys
into Spitfires that would be the equivelant of a low time solo student
now days.

Possibly less than that during the early days, when we desperately
needed pilots. (Yes, I realize some managed to kill themselves, but
people do that in cars and Piper Cubs, too.)


The F4U also is *big*, heavy, and although a carrier bird is not
exactly a short field plane.


and fewer still who could have afforded to maintain and fly one.


Now you've hit the nail on the head! I would have bought a U-bird in
a minute had I been able to afford one.


I don't remember if they hald a larger engine than the "Jug", but I
think they did. The Jug ran a miserly 80 to 90 gallons per hour at
economy cruise as I recall.

I'd like to have one of the tricycle gear Skyraiders. I think most of
those were tail draggers. That thing is huge and had the largest
radial engine we ever used, as far as I know.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com


vince norris







But they weren't all scrapped. Tens of thousands were bought by civilian's
for various reasons. Some became water bombers used by the forest service,
some became shelters and hunting cabins, some were bought by enthusiastic
collecters, and parked in fields until the mice and birds destroyed all
but the hulks, some are flying on poles acting as canapies for gas pumps,
some are posed to look like they crashed into buildings... and some are
in the skies thanks to the efforts of some of the most generous restorers
in the world.

Mustangs have been built almost entirely from scratch, you can buy new
manufactured replica parts for just about any part in the plane. There


And they give new meaning to "expensive parts":-))

is a group that is manufacturing replica German fighters too. Money


If you are referring to the ME262 they are only doing 5 last I heard.
That project has moved around a bit, but I think they have at least 2
flying now.

http://www.rogerhalstead.com/me262.htm Is a photo of the original
loaned to the project to use as a model for the construction of the
new aircraft. It was on static display in front of the Willow Grove
Naval Air Station a ways north of Philadelphia. The photo was shot in
the Fall of 1984 as were the ones of the Orion P-3s.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com


talks, but remember, the effort required to tool up the US manufacturers
to make these planes in the first place was greater in scope than the
NASA moon launches.

It only takes about 10 minutes of research to find this out. I thought
you said WWII planes meant a lot to you?

-Chuck

  #7  
Old November 20th 05, 03:46 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

According to a program on the Discovery channel they were putting guys
into Spitfires that would be the equivelant of a low time solo student
now days.


I wouldn't be surprised if that's true, but I've heard a lot of
"facts" on the Discovery Channel (and the History Channel) that were
NOT true.

I doubt their writers are well-trained in historical research and
evaluation of sources. There's a lot of nonsense in books, too, which
those writers probably draw on as 'gospel."

Did you know, for example, that the top speed of the Vultee BT-13 was
190 miles per hour?

The F4U also is *big*, heavy, and although a carrier bird is not
exactly a short field plane.


There was a recent discussion of that in another newsgroup and I was
surprised at how quickly an F4U can get off. I don't remember the
number, but I think it was around 2,000 feet.

I don't remember if they hald a larger engine than the "Jug", but I
think they did.


Both the P-47 ands the F4U had the PW R-2800 engine. I vaguely recal
that the Goodyear FG-1, based on the F4U, may have had a larger
engine.

The Jug ran a miserly 80 to 90 gallons per hour at
economy cruise as I recall.


That sounds about right.

I'd like to have one of the tricycle gear Skyraiders. I think most of
those were tail draggers.


I've never even HEARD of an AD that was not a tail dragger. Do you
know if there's a picture of a tricycle gear AD on the net?

That thing is huge and had the largest
radial engine we ever used, as far as I know.


I think it was a 3350. I think there was a 43XX radial that was used
on the Connie or the DC7, but my memory is quite vague on that.

vince norris
  #8  
Old November 20th 05, 04:26 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

the average P-51 price is 1.5m usd, ive seen stock p-51's not flown
since ww2 for 500k, and some for 1.1m in need of restorations but
ferriable.

definately not worth the money.

  #9  
Old November 20th 05, 04:28 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

roger, as for the spitfire comment they got it wrong. they were basic
pilots (50 or so hours) then had 9 hours of COMBAT training before
joining the bob

  #10  
Old November 20th 05, 04:31 AM posted to rec.aviation.restoration
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why were almost all of them scrapped?

vincient i think he has the skyraider confused with the T-28, both look
similer, one trike one taildragger, both navy.

 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Australia F111 to be scrapped!! John Cook Military Aviation 35 November 11th 03 12:46 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2017 AviationBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.