China to buy Eurofighters?

In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

On Thu, 04 Dec 2003 07:19:16 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:
Furthermore, the euro has been appreciating against the dollar (by
20% this year) so if we count GDP at current exchange rates (the
other way being PPP) the EU may already be ahead.

You should remember that the Euro/Dollar ratio has been manipulated very
hard by some of the European countries,

Actually, European countries don't have the power to control
exchange rates. If you don't agree, ask George Soros or Norman
Lamont, who will no doubt put you right.

Since you mention two of the people who helped manipulate those currency
values, you've supported my position...

Of course, some of that value difference came from this side of the
pond, since a low dollar value versus the Euro gives some trade
advantages.

But trying to pretend that governments don't manipulate exchange rates?

That's just silly.

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Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

In message , Chad Irby
writes
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:
Actually, European countries don't have the power to control
exchange rates. If you don't agree, ask George Soros or Norman
Lamont, who will no doubt put you right.

Since you mention two of the people who helped manipulate those currency
values, you've supported my position...

Not quite... Lamont was the Chancellor of the Exchequer and tried to
hold sterling's exchange rate in place.

Soros was one of the currency speculators who demonstrated the folly of
this action, at considerable financial cost to the Treasury and
political loss to the Government.

Final score; speculators won, Government lost.

But trying to pretend that governments don't manipulate exchange rates?

Manipulate, sure. but with limited effect. Control? That's when
speculators get rich, foreign reserves get depleted, and treasurers end
up looking stupid.

--
When you have to kill a man, it costs nothing to be polite.
W S Churchill

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

On Sun, 07 Dec 2003 07:52:06 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

On Thu, 04 Dec 2003 07:22:20 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:


Prediction: in 2004 the EU's economy wil grow by more than the USA's
economy.

Evidence of that prediction?

75 million people will join the EU in 2004, boosting its GDP by 10%.

6% at best.

Cite?


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people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
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the last two letters).

On Sun, 07 Dec 2003 08:07:11 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

On Thu, 04 Dec 2003 07:19:16 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

On Wed, 3 Dec 2003 10:36:29 -0800, Tarver Engineering
wrote:


Nope: http://www.eurolegal.org/uspoleur.shtml

Doesm't disagree with me. It shows thje EU's GDP as about 10% less
than the USA's, which difference will be made up next year when 10
new countries join.

Not really. The additional countries all have economies that are pretty
much in the basket right now, and adding a bunch of new poor people
won't make much difference,

It'll make about 10% of difference. If you disagree, come up with
exact figures to refute this.

Right after you come up with the ones that support it...

Certainly:
http://en2.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlargement_of_the_European_Union

Now, let's see if Chad Irby is going to keep his word...

--
"It's easier to find people online who openly support the KKK than
people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
(Email: , but first subtract 275 and reverse
the last two letters).

On Sun, 7 Dec 2003 16:28:52 +0100, Gerd Koegler wrote:
Keith Willshaw wrote:
"phil hunt" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 3 Dec 2003 18:44:55 -0000, Keith Willshaw
wrote:

"phil hunt" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 3 Dec 2003 13:11:12 -0000, Keith Willshaw
wrote:

In fact there is no prospect of the ban being lifted anytime soon.
While the French Government and some corporate bodies
have pressed for it

And the German govmt.

Cite please.

http://www.cabalamat.org/weblog/art_97.html


Hearsay at best

I'd rather prefer a record of a statement by a member of the German
government.

Its true:
http://de.news.yahoo.com/031201/3/3s8f5.html
http://www.sueddeutsche.de/deutschla...kel/752/22730/

Or you could search Google news for "China EU arms embargo".
Produces 23 results when I do it:

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&scoring=d&q=China+EU+arms+embargo

--
"It's easier to find people online who openly support the KKK than
people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
(Email: , but first subtract 275 and reverse
the last two letters).

In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

On Sun, 07 Dec 2003 08:07:11 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

It'll make about 10% of difference. If you disagree, come up with
exact figures to refute this.

Right after you come up with the ones that support it...

Certainly:
http://en2.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlargement_of_the_European_Union

Now, let's see if Chad Irby is going to keep his word...

Here you go...

The 2002 EU GDP was about 8,623 billion dollars.
The 2002 US GDP was about 10,303 billion dollars.

Adding in the 841 billion dollars from the 2004 potential additions
(which might not happen), you get:

EU: 9,464 billion
US: 10,303 billion

Note that these are 2002 numbers, and with the mild growth in the US
economy versus the stagnant to depressed EU economy, it's actually more
in favor of the US right now.

The EU would need a 10% economic increase by this time next year
(seriously *not* happening), while the US would have to stay stagnant
(also seriously *not* happening).

So, you're just wrong. Again.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

On Sun, 07 Dec 2003 07:52:06 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

75 million people will join the EU in 2004, boosting its GDP by 10%.

6% at best.

Cite?

I was wrong, because I overestimated the EU economy. It's about 10%,
but it's not enough to even manage a tie... they're still about 10%
short.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

phil hunt wrote:

On Sun, 07 Dec 2003 08:07:11 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:

In article ,
(phil hunt) wrote:


On Thu, 04 Dec 2003 07:19:16 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:

In article ,
(phil hunt) wrote:


On Wed, 3 Dec 2003 10:36:29 -0800, Tarver Engineering
wrote:

Nope: http://www.eurolegal.org/uspoleur.shtml

Doesm't disagree with me. It shows thje EU's GDP as about 10% less
than the USA's, which difference will be made up next year when 10
new countries join.

Not really. The additional countries all have economies that are pretty
much in the basket right now, and adding a bunch of new poor people
won't make much difference,

It'll make about 10% of difference. If you disagree, come up with
exact figures to refute this.

Right after you come up with the ones that support it...


Certainly:
http://en2.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlargement_of_the_European_Union

Now, let's see if Chad Irby is going to keep his word...

Would be the first time...

John

On Sun, 07 Dec 2003 18:58:48 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

On Sun, 07 Dec 2003 08:07:11 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:
In article ,
ess (phil hunt) wrote:

It'll make about 10% of difference. If you disagree, come up with
exact figures to refute this.

Right after you come up with the ones that support it...

Certainly:
http://en2.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlargement_of_the_European_Union

Now, let's see if Chad Irby is going to keep his word...

Here you go...

The 2002 EU GDP was about 8,623 billion dollars.
The 2002 US GDP was about 10,303 billion dollars.

What's your source? Are these at market exchange rates or PPP?

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"It's easier to find people online who openly support the KKK than
people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
(Email: , but first subtract 275 and reverse
the last two letters).

John Mullen wrote:

phil hunt wrote:

Now, let's see if Chad Irby is going to keep his word...

Would be the first time...

John is obviously still upset that Iraq isn't a quagmire yet.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.