Apology to rec.aviation...

Sometimes I forget that this is a rec.aviation group and not for pros
like AvSig on CompuServe used to be when it was sponsored by ASI and
John G. ran it.

Still there are some here who have been there and done that and care to
share with each other and others.

But there are also those who think that playing with their Goggle all
day is a real world experience.

So I'm going to self-moderate by the simple mechanism of putting anyone
who asks for "cite" into the kill file.

I don't mung my email address or bother to reply to emails from those
who do. My reasoning is simple, I believe in quality like Boeing and
Macintosh.

I'll try to keep in mind that not all are professionals here.

Thanks to all,

--
Ron

"Ron Parsons" wrote in message
...
But there are also those who think that playing with their Goggle all
day is a real world experience.

Thanks to all,

--
Ron

I Googled Goggle and didn't get much.

Tex

Ron Parsons wrote:

Sometimes I forget that this is a rec.aviation group and not for pros
like AvSig on CompuServe used to be when it was sponsored by ASI and
John G. ran it.

Still there are some here who have been there and done that and care to
share with each other and others.

But there are also those who think that playing with their Goggle all
day is a real world experience.

So I'm going to self-moderate by the simple mechanism of putting anyone
who asks for "cite" into the kill file.

I don't mung my email address or bother to reply to emails from those
who do. My reasoning is simple, I believe in quality like Boeing and
Macintosh.

I'll try to keep in mind that not all are professionals here.

Thanks to all,

Sounds very noble and forthright Ron...I used to think like that
a short few years ago when I first started out on here. I used to
have my email address in the open. The spam increased slowly till
it was about 40/50 spams a day...then it increased drastically
till at one time, in a 12 hour period, I counted 950 spam msgs.

This shut my email down completely, who can sift through a couple
thousand email chaff for the odd grain of wheat? I had to change
my address (which I had had for quite a few years). Quite
disgusting. I now munge. YMMV. Good luck in any case.
--

-Gord.

" wrote:

Ron Parsons wrote:

Sometimes I forget that this is a rec.aviation group and not for pros
like AvSig on CompuServe used to be when it was sponsored by ASI and
John G. ran it.

Still there are some here who have been there and done that and care to
share with each other and others.

But there are also those who think that playing with their Goggle all
day is a real world experience.

So I'm going to self-moderate by the simple mechanism of putting anyone
who asks for "cite" into the kill file.

I don't mung my email address or bother to reply to emails from those
who do. My reasoning is simple, I believe in quality like Boeing and
Macintosh.

I'll try to keep in mind that not all are professionals here.

Thanks to all,

Sounds very noble and forthright Ron...I used to think like that
a short few years ago when I first started out on here. I used to
have my email address in the open. The spam increased slowly till
it was about 40/50 spams a day...then it increased drastically
till at one time, in a 12 hour period, I counted 950 spam msgs.

This shut my email down completely, who can sift through a couple
thousand email chaff for the odd grain of wheat? I had to change
my address (which I had had for quite a few years). Quite
disgusting. I now munge. YMMV. Good luck in any case.
--

-Gord.

I was well over 100 spams a day, due to having multiple email addresses,
posting to the news groups a lot, and having a web site with hundreds of
individual pages, each with my email on it.

Changing the email addresses would have inconvenienced my
contributors/customers/suppliers/relatives/friends.

However, after some work and about $20 in expense, all but about 50 to 100
spams a day are flushed away and I never see them.

Of the ones I still get, the funniest are the ones supposedly from the
people who manage the email services for my domain. Since "I" am the only
one who manages my domain, I tend to be a bit suspicious!

Bob McKellar, posting in the clear

"Bob McKellar" wrote

I was well over 100 spams a day, due to having multiple email addresses,
posting to the news groups a lot, and having a web site with hundreds of
individual pages, each with my email on it.

Changing the email addresses would have inconvenienced my
contributors/customers/suppliers/relatives/friends.

However, after some work and about $20 in expense, all but about 50 to 100
spams a day are flushed away and I never see them.

Of the ones I still get, the funniest are the ones supposedly from the
people who manage the email services for my domain. Since "I" am the only
one who manages my domain, I tend to be a bit suspicious!

I get about 60 a day.

I use Spam Pal to kill them. Works like a champ. I'm seeing maybe 1 or 2
a day that get through the filter, but my in-box is back in control.

http://www.spampal.org/

I use a Barracuda Box at the office: http://www.barracudanetworks.com/

I also include this page on all my web pages (hidden from users of course):

http://www.detritus.org/cgi-bin/spidersmack.cgi

What it does, is cause the spammers to spam themselves. I get about
four robot hits a day, so they are really killing themselves.

"Bob McKellar" wrote in message
...


" wrote:

Ron Parsons wrote:

Sometimes I forget that this is a rec.aviation group and not for pros
like AvSig on CompuServe used to be when it was sponsored by ASI and
John G. ran it.

Still there are some here who have been there and done that and care to
share with each other and others.

But there are also those who think that playing with their Goggle all
day is a real world experience.

So I'm going to self-moderate by the simple mechanism of putting anyone
who asks for "cite" into the kill file.

I don't mung my email address or bother to reply to emails from those
who do. My reasoning is simple, I believe in quality like Boeing and
Macintosh.

I'll try to keep in mind that not all are professionals here.

Thanks to all,

Sounds very noble and forthright Ron...I used to think like that
a short few years ago when I first started out on here. I used to
have my email address in the open. The spam increased slowly till
it was about 40/50 spams a day...then it increased drastically
till at one time, in a 12 hour period, I counted 950 spam msgs.

This shut my email down completely, who can sift through a couple
thousand email chaff for the odd grain of wheat? I had to change
my address (which I had had for quite a few years). Quite
disgusting. I now munge. YMMV. Good luck in any case.
--

-Gord.

I was well over 100 spams a day, due to having multiple email addresses,
posting to the news groups a lot, and having a web site with hundreds of
individual pages, each with my email on it.

Changing the email addresses would have inconvenienced my
contributors/customers/suppliers/relatives/friends.

However, after some work and about $20 in expense, all but about 50 to 100
spams a day are flushed away and I never see them.

Of the ones I still get, the funniest are the ones supposedly from the
people who manage the email services for my domain. Since "I" am the only
one who manages my domain, I tend to be a bit suspicious!

Bob McKellar, posting in the clear

After the Swen virus hit, I was getting over a hundred a day. I finally got
Mailwasher and bounced them all. The robots pick up continious bounces
apparently. I'm back to normal again now, but I'll never use my un munged
email address on Usenet again.
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/ CFI Retired
For personal email, please replace
the z's with e's.
dhenriquesATzarthlinkDOTnzt

"D. Strang" wrote:


What it does, is cause the spammers to spam themselves. I get about
four robot hits a day, so they are really killing themselves.


With all these things that increase the traffic load I'm afraid
that it'll put a crimp in the flow and choke off good email
traffic exchange...then where'll we be?...I think it'll
eventually get so that email will be useless...hope they can get
a grip on it soon.
--

-Gord.

In article et,
"Dudley Henriques" wrote:

...
I was well over 100 spams a day, due to having multiple email addresses,
posting to the news groups a lot, and having a web site with hundreds of
individual pages, each with my email on it.

Changing the email addresses would have inconvenienced my
contributors/customers/suppliers/relatives/friends.

However, after some work and about $20 in expense, all but about 50 to 100
spams a day are flushed away and I never see them.

Of the ones I still get, the funniest are the ones supposedly from the
people who manage the email services for my domain. Since "I" am the only
one who manages my domain, I tend to be a bit suspicious!


After the Swen virus hit, I was getting over a hundred a day. I finally got
Mailwasher and bounced them all. The robots pick up continious bounces
apparently...

Not really. The way most of these sorts of viruses operate these days is
by turning the infected person's computer into a mail relay without
their knowledge. The term for this sort of thing is "owning" a machine.
They then scan the Outlook and Outlook Express data files as well as web
cache and mine out all email addresses. The infected machine's new
stealth mail relay mechanism is then used to send copies of the virus to
every mined address...and it uses a return address of any one of the
mined addresses. Any of the targeted addresses which actually result in
another infection are in turn going to do the same process. This is why
these viruses spread so rapidly.


Why should virus writers want to turn peoples' home and business
computers into stealth mail relays? Easy, they are paid to do so by
professional spam gangs who will then turn around and use all these new
mail relays to spew out their spam. Some 80% is relayed through "owned"
MS Windows PC's on home cable and dsl networks (some 10,000 "owned
machines)...and some 90% spamvertises Western sites hosted in China.

It never ceases to amaze me how many people using Microsoft operating
systems either don't care or are just to damn ignorant to secure their
machines (with anti-virus software they keep current).

That said, there's a lot ISP's and companies could be doing to stop or
majorly contain such quick and penetrating viral outbreaks. Blocking
this sort of stuff at the mail server or network border are not that
difficult to implement....and should be required of every ISP and it
should be free. I have such protection on all my clients' email servers,
and it has caught and blocked 100% of attempted virus relays before they
can make into my customers' mail boxes.


It's only so many sysadmins at large ISP's are too lazy and/or
incompetent, that consumers are left thinking Mailwasher and products
like it are necessary. They are only necessary to make up for their
provider's incompetence.


So what happens when you're using a product like Mailwasher and it tags
and rejects a virus-infected email? Not much, these sorts of emails have
forged return addresses 99.9% of the time...and will either go to
somebody who scratches their head wondering why they're being accused of
sending a virus...or to a bogus address. The same goes for spam. The
only way to tell the real source (well at least the last hop) of spam is
by looking at the IP which relayed it to your smtp server (either by
looking at your message headers or your mail server's logs).


With that IP address, you have enough info to root out who is
responsible for abuse from that net block and make complaints
accordingly. The user-level anti-spam software is largely worthless in
actually having an effect on stopping that spam from spamming you again
or rejecting to the right people. It is reasonably effective of keeping
the garbage out of your mail box...which I guess is as much as most
end-users care about. The fact remains, if the provider did its job at
the server level, you wouldn't need such programs. I know that's a big
"if", but there are plenty of IPS's (as well as email hosters) to choose
from who actually know a thing or two about blocking spam and viruses.


Of course, you could always get a Mac and never have to worry about
these sorts of viruses. ; )

--Mike

"Michael Wise" wrote in message
...
In article et,
"Dudley Henriques" wrote:

So what happens when you're using a product like Mailwasher and it tags
and rejects a virus-infected email? Not much,

Plenty happens, Dudley is now spamming people for no good reason.

In article ,
"Gord Beaman" ) wrote:

What it does, is cause the spammers to spam themselves. I get about
four robot hits a day, so they are really killing themselves.


With all these things that increase the traffic load I'm afraid
that it'll put a crimp in the flow and choke off good email
traffic exchange...then where'll we be?...I think it'll
eventually get so that email will be useless...hope they can get
a grip on it soon.


The tools necessary for getting a grip on it are already widely
available.

The problem is twofold: 1) ISPs and companies which are two lazy or
incompetent to use those tools and 2) a system which does not adequately
prosecute some of these scum using existing laws...not to mention those
of the weak,ineffective and drafted by mainsleaze spammers, CAN-Spam act.


--Mike