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How were Have Blue and Tacit Blue codenames chosen?
Hobo wrote:
Were the Have Blue and Tacit Blue codenames arbitrary constructions or was there some sort of logic behind them? The names (officially called "nicknames") are essentially arbitrary. However, the first words ("Have" and "Tacit") are not completely random, because the first two letters must come from a defined subset allocated to the DOD component or agency, which supervises the program. The second word can essentially be chosen at will, and in the case of classified programs is selected to have no connection to the nature of the program (which is definitely the case for "Blue"). The second word of open programs is often related to the program, e.g. the conversion of F-106s to QF-106 drones was made under the name "Pacer Six". Andreas |
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re the Have Blue and Tacit Blue codenames arbitrary constructions or
was there some sort of logic behind them? Arbitrary. I believe they were thrown up by a computer. It finally dawned on someone that code names tend to be self-breaking (Overlord!). all the best -- Dan Ford email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9 see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com |
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Subject: How were Have Blue and Tacit Blue codenames chosen?
From: Cub Driver Date: 9/27/2003 6:01 AM Eastern Daylight Time Message-id: Arbitrary. I believe they were thrown up by a computer. It finally dawned on someone that code names tend to be self-breaking (Overlord!). Well, OK. Then, how do they pick exercise/operational codenames? And how do they name planes? Since we're on the subject, how do other countries do all this? |
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And how do they name planes? It seems to be a collaborative effort between the manufacturer and the air force. Then, after the uniformly awful names are applied, the pilots and crews name it something else entirely. This was always true to a certain extent. Famously, the P-47 Thunderbolt was the Jug. But it has accelerated as the official names have become worse and worse. Should we have a contest on worst plane name and best replacement? Surely the worse plane name was the B-36 Peacemaker, intended to drop two or more hydrogen bombs upon the Russians. And the best replacement of course is the Warthog for the A-10 Thunderbolt II. Another question: how long has it been since the pilots of a USAF warplane called it by the name assigned to it by the bureaucracy? all the best -- Dan Ford email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9 see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com |
#5
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On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 05:42:27 -0400, Cub Driver
wrote: And how do they name planes? It seems to be a collaborative effort between the manufacturer and the air force. Then, after the uniformly awful names are applied, the pilots and crews name it something else entirely. This was always true to a certain extent. Famously, the P-47 Thunderbolt was the Jug. But it has accelerated as the official names have become worse and worse. Should we have a contest on worst plane name and best replacement? Hands down winner, "Fighting Falcon" replaced by "Viper." Surely the worse plane name was the B-36 Peacemaker, intended to drop two or more hydrogen bombs upon the Russians. Not that bad, since the earlier "Peacemaker" was the .45 Colt Single Action Army. Might really consider the name vindicated when it is noted that the B-36 never fired a shot in anger over its entire service life. And the best replacement of course is the Warthog for the A-10 Thunderbolt II. Another question: how long has it been since the pilots of a USAF warplane called it by the name assigned to it by the bureaucracy? Not that long at all. F-15 Eagle. There are always going to be "official" names and nicknames. Some nicknames are going to be affectionately bestowed while others are going to be a result of envy, dislike or disaffection. Some will be commonly adopted and some will start as pejoratives and grow into respect. I personally seldom/never use "Thud" to describe the F-105. Lots of folks do and for most it has become a respected name. Same thing is true of individual nicknames or "tactical call-signs." When I was a squadron ops officer I told my guys that they couldn't determine what they would be called. It would be a name given them, not one they chose. We had a guy come into the squadron, a former FAIP, newly qualified in the F-4. He had name tags made up reading: "Jim Teak Fighter Pilot". I told him that he wasn't a fighter pilot until other folks told him he was. He couldn't unilaterally make the declaration. What he really had was a misspelled name tag. It was supposed to read: "Jim, Weak Fighter Pilot". From that day on, his nickname was "Weak". He wasn't, but the name stuck and he bore it proudly. |
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"Ed Rasimus" wrote in message ... On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 05:42:27 -0400, Cub Driver snip Surely the worse plane name was the B-36 Peacemaker, intended to drop two or more hydrogen bombs upon the Russians. Not that bad, since the earlier "Peacemaker" was the .45 Colt Single Action Army. Might really consider the name vindicated when it is noted that the B-36 never fired a shot in anger over its entire service life. "God created man, Colt made them equal". |
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Ed Rasimus wrote:
From that day on, his nickname was "Weak". He wasn't, but the name stuck and he bore it proudly. I'll bet he earned a lot of respect for bearing that name 'proudly'. I'll also bet that he figured any reticence in that regard would not look good.. . Good on him. -- -Gord. |
#8
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"Ed Rasimus" wrote in message
We had a guy come into the squadron, a former FAIP, newly qualified in the F-4. He had name tags made up reading: "Jim Teak Fighter Pilot". I told him that he wasn't a fighter pilot until other folks told him he was. He couldn't unilaterally make the declaration. What he really had was a misspelled name tag. It was supposed to read: "Jim, Weak Fighter Pilot". From that day on, his nickname was "Weak". He wasn't, but the name stuck and he bore it proudly. Ed, I've got a question about fighter pilot callnames, nicknames or whatever you want to call them...I used to work with a Navy pilot at the datacenter I was employed at a few years back, and he and I had a lot of time to kill on our shift as it was from 7:00 PM to 7:00 AM (not a lot happening on the east coast in terms of electronic finance at those hours). Anyway, he'd regale me with tall tales about his various comings and goings (and seemed pleasantly surprised that I, a mere civilian, had knowledge of garden spots like Subic Bay, some rudimentary aircraft knowledge, etc.). AT ANY RATE...one evening I asked him, jokingly, "So, did you have some ultra-cool fighter pilot name like "Shark" or "Killer" or "Maverick" or "Iceman"." and he just sort of frosted a bit and said, "No, my 'handle' was Sparks." Later that evening (morning) as the shift ended I was packing up* and bade him goodbye, I'll see you tomorrow** "sparks". Anyway, he frosted again and shook his head and said "Don't call me that. You don't get to." He never mentioned it again, didn't act any different than the friendly guy he was the next day, etc. Now I realize you're not a Navy pilot nor do you know the circumstances but is there a particular reason a pilot might get reeeeeeeealy sensitive about a handle? (For the record I never brought it up again, nor did he, and life was good.) *A 12 hour night shift is about a decade long; you tend to bring books (as in many in a night), CDs, newspaper, magazines, etc. so leaving at the end of your shift is like moving out of town. ** as in 12 hours from 7:00AM, being 7:00pm that night -- http://www.delversdungeon.dragonsfoot.org Remove the X's in my email address to respond. "Damn you Silvey, and your endless fortunes." - Stephen Weir I hate furries. |
#9
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On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 15:31:07 GMT, Ed Rasimus wrote:
Hands down winner, "Fighting Falcon" replaced by "Viper." I'm of the opinion that if they'd just left the redundant "Fighting" off the name it would've had a chance. -Jeff B. yeff at erols dot com |
#10
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In article , Cub Driver
wrote: And how do they name planes? It seems to be a collaborative effort between the manufacturer and the air force. Then, after the uniformly awful names are applied, the pilots and crews name it something else entirely. It used to be something that the manufacturer did. For example, North American used the "thunder" series names (Thunderbolt, Thunderchief, etc); Lockheed used astronomy names (Constellation); Boeing used terms from the atmosphere (Flying Fortress, Super Fortress, Strato Fortress, etc). During WWII, some airplanes were first bought by the Brits, and the Brits gave them their name. This included the Mustang and the Lightning. In the early 50's, there was a scandal about the name of the XP-56. This was a rear engine airplane that made it to prototype stage in the late 40's as a fast non-jet airplane to cope with the fast planes coming out of Germany. The plane was named the Ascender. It came out that this was a word play on the "ass end engine", or the Ass-ender. From that point on, the Department of Defense took over the official naming duty. Prior to Fighting Bob McNemara taking over the DOD in the early 60's, the DOD pretty much used the names that manufactures suggested. Starting with Fighting Bob, airplane projects became far more political, and the names became part of the political game. Some planes since them remained without names for a long period of time, such as the F-111, F-117, and B-1. The F-111 was given its official name only shortly before it was retired. Other programs are given patriotic names, such as Fighting Falcon and Eagle. The F-22/23 program started as a flyoff between the YF prototypes before the winner was awarded contracts for full scale development aircraft. During the flyoff, the planes used manufactures names, the Thunderchief II and the Lighting II--designed to bring back memories of great WWII aircraft. Once a winner was selected, the USAF assigned the name Raptor to the F-22. Another unique modern name is the F-14 Tomcat. Grumman has a long history of building "cat" planes for the US Navy. This includes the F4F Wildcat, F6F Hellcat, F7F Tigercat, F8F Bearcat, F9F Panther and Cougar (Panther was straight wing, the Cougar was sweptwing), F10F Jaguar, and the F11F Tiger. When the F-14 project began, the Deputy Cheif of Naval Operations of Air, Tom Conolly, was responsible for the project from the Navy. The F-14 project became known internally as Tom's Cat. The name stuck, and the official name became the Tomcat. -john- -- ================================================== ================== John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708 Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com ================================================== ================== |
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