First plane

: http://www.4-fs.com/baja/performance.htm

Sounds kinda cool, but requires Internet Exploiter. Unable.

-Cory

--

************************************************** ***********************
* Cory Papenfuss, Ph.D., PPSEL-IA *
* Electrical Engineering *
* Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University *
************************************************** ***********************

wrote:

: http://www.4-fs.com/baja/performance.htm

Sounds kinda cool, but requires Internet Exploiter. Unable.

Works with Netscape.

: : http://www.4-fs.com/baja/performance.htm
:
: Sounds kinda cool, but requires Internet Exploiter. Unable.

: Works with Netscape.

The message I got was something along the lines of Internet Exploiter and
MSOffice 2003 extension or something. Must only require the latter. I have neither
on my firefox under linux. I don't care all that much, but I just figured I'd point
out that it's not Internet friendly... only Microsoft-Internet friendly.

-Cory


--

************************************************** ***********************
* Cory Papenfuss, Ph.D., PPSEL-IA *
* Electrical Engineering *
* Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University *
************************************************** ***********************

wrote:
: : http://www.4-fs.com/baja/performance.htm
:
: Sounds kinda cool, but requires Internet Exploiter. Unable.

: Works with Netscape.

The message I got was something along the lines of Internet
Exploiter and
MSOffice 2003 extension or something. Must only require the latter.
I have neither
on my firefox under linux. I don't care all that much, but I just
figured I'd point
out that it's not Internet friendly... only Microsoft-Internet friendly.

-Cory


That's Bill Gates for you. :-) The pages were built (quite some time
ago) with MS FrontPage which embedded the Excel spreadsheets as a
modified web form of some sort that requires 'Office Web Components'
on the client computer. The idea is that you can plug numbers into the
spreadsheet interactively in the browser rather than having to download
a copy of the .xls file and opening it with Excel (which a suprising
number of people do not have on their computers).

I'll add the actual .xls files tonight when I get home, which you might
be able to use with OpenOffice on linux.

Jim Carter suggested elsewhere in the thread about using a 6 seat plane
with 2 seats removed/empty. Just so happens I have the Excel file -- not
the embedded Web Component version -- for our Lance available online.
This is the Turbo T tail with 6 seats in the club seating layout. So if
you want some real world 6 seat W&B figures to play with, go to the
following link and click on the 'N3000A weight and balance spreadsheet'.

http://www.4-fs.com/lance

I've got one of these for a Cherokee 180 I used to own as well. May have
one for a Cherokee 140 from a ways back. I'll see if I can find those
too and get them online for anyone interseted in playing with the
numbers for those aircraft.

Steve

wrote:
: : http://www.4-fs.com/baja/performance.htm
:
: Sounds kinda cool, but requires Internet Exploiter. Unable.

: Works with Netscape.

The message I got was something along the lines of Internet Exploiter and
MSOffice 2003 extension or something. Must only require the latter. I have neither
on my firefox under linux. I don't care all that much, but I just figured I'd point
out that it's not Internet friendly... only Microsoft-Internet friendly.

I concur. With Mozilla 1.7.12 Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US;
rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050928, I get:

"To use this Web page interactively, you must have Microsoft® Internet
Explorer 5.01 Service Pack 2 (SP2) or later and the Microsoft Office
2003 Web Components. Click here to install the Office 2003 Web
Components. See the Microsoft Office Web site for more information."

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
news:000101c71874$3f10d850$4b01a8c0@omnibook6100.. .


snip

The 182T that I fly on a weekly basis will no more haul 4 adults plus
baggage plus meaningful (4+ hours) fuel than the 172S we just traded out
with another squadron.

snip
I've come to believe that the best 4 place cross country aircraft all
start out with 6 seats installed. Take those last two seats out and
you've got a real nice bird.



So you would suggest the 185 instead?

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

-----Original Message-----
From: Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe [mailto:The Sea Hawk at wow way d0t com]
Posted At: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 4:09 PM
Posted To: rec.aviation.owning
Conversation: First plane
Subject: First plane

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
news:000101c71874$3f10d850$4b01a8c0@omnibook6100.. .


snip

The 182T that I fly on a weekly basis will no more haul 4 adults
plus
baggage plus meaningful (4+ hours) fuel than the 172S we just traded
out
with another squadron.

snip
I've come to believe that the best 4 place cross country aircraft
all
start out with 6 seats installed. Take those last two seats out and
you've got a real nice bird.



So you would suggest the 185 instead?

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

Isn't the gross weight and useful load about the same on the 182 and
185? It has been 30 years since I was in one and then it was on floats
at Kenmore in Seattle, so I honestly don't remember. I would however be
a little concerned about putting a brand new pilot directly into a 185
without first getting quite a bit of experience in a T-craft or Cub or
even a 170.

A 205 or 206 makes a real nice 4 place cross country bird, but man it is
expensive for just a hop over for coffee.

: The message I got was something along the lines of Internet Exploiter and
: MSOffice 2003 extension or something. Must only require the latter. I have neither
: on my firefox under linux. I don't care all that much, but I just figured I'd point
: out that it's not Internet friendly... only Microsoft-Internet friendly.

: I concur. With Mozilla 1.7.12 Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US;
: rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050928, I get:

: "To use this Web page interactively, you must have Microsoft?? Internet
: Explorer 5.01 Service Pack 2 (SP2) or later and the Microsoft Office
: 2003 Web Components. Click here to install the Office 2003 Web
: Components. See the Microsoft Office Web site for more information."

Once upon a time (circa 1999), I ran Internet Explorer on SunOS on a Sun Ultra 2 at the University if Illinois.

-Cory

--

************************************************** ***********************
* Cory Papenfuss, Ph.D., PPSEL-IA *
* Electrical Engineering *
* Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University *
************************************************** ***********************

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
news:000101c71874$3f10d850$4b01a8c0@omnibook6100.. .
Isn't the gross weight and useful load about the same on the 182 and
185? It has been 30 years since I was in one and then it was on floats
at Kenmore in Seattle, so I honestly don't remember. I would however be
a little concerned about putting a brand new pilot directly into a 185
without first getting quite a bit of experience in a T-craft or Cub or
even a 170.


Cessna 182R Gross.......3100
Cessna A185F Gross.....3350



KG

I'm a newbie working on getting a PPL.
People tell me that if I'm serious about flying, I should seriously
look into purchasing a plane - in the long run it'll be cheaper than
renting.

Here is another viewpoint. Disclaimer: The below assumes you don't have
an endless supply of cash to shell out.

First off, you are a student. Most cannot handle the added distraction
of being a new owner while trying to learn how to fly AND taking ground
school (aside from your day job/school/family). Also, you admitted
yourself you are not sure of what to buy. Get your license and fly a
while in other types of birds. Get a feel for where you want to GO first.

Buying an airplane without losing your shirt (and possibly your life)
takes a bit of experience that you likely don't have. What's the hurry?

Why beat up your bird learning how to land? Beat up the school's plane,
then buy your own.

"Cheaper in the long run" can be elusive. You need to fly a certain
number of hours for the math to work out. Properly cared for airplanes
cost money. Many owners simply run planes out and don't properly
maintain or upgrade them. They live on a shoestring budget and roll the
dice that nothing catastrophic will happen. Some win and some lose. The
winners spout off about how "they did it". The losers say nothing and
quietly lick their wounds. I have said it before. There is plenty of
flying junk out there for sale. You likely cannot tell the difference.
This group tells many tales about deals gone bad.

What if you don't stick it out? The drop out rate for student pilots is
not small. If you quit while owning, you have to sell the beast and that
may take a while (unless you can accept a significant financial loss).

Yes, renting has many drawbacks. Dirty, beat up planes that are
unavailable when the weather is nice. But, they are usually maintained
to some minimum level of safety and they have one great advantage that
you might need right now. If anything goes wrong, you simply hand the
keys to the FBO and say "next". And, like I said, you really don't need
a premium airplane and the distractions of ownership at this point in
your flying.

Opinions vary. Good Luck.
Mike