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#21
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On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 21:00:21 GMT, zatatime
wrote: What is the definition of nearby? Can I file to any VOR or intersection, say, within 20 miles of my departure point? Do I have to actually file starting with a fix, or can I just file from any point on an airway? Given the busy nature of the NY area, what are my odds of getting a clearance using a fix further away? (That last one may just come from experience). A better understanding of this sure will help me pick better routes in the future since I'd always file to the closest, even if I had a crappy route to my destination. I know of no restrictions such as question. If I am flying from, let us say, KEPM to KASH, I will either file (and be cleared), as my initial fix, BRNNS (140 NM) or ENE (178 NM). And I could just as easily file direct to KASH. I don't because of overwater considerations. And those clearances were issued when I was filing /A. In a non-radar environment, though, different considerations apply. So far as the NY area, close to NYC (and I would guess in most busy airspaces), random routes are not commonly approved. I would not expect to depart KFRG cleared direct ETX, for example. There are also altitude restrictions on certain routings. However, you might be able to get something like KBDR direct ACK. And if over water distance were not a consideration, that's how I would file. --ron |
#22
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zatatime wrote in
: What is the definition of nearby? Can I file to any VOR or intersection, say, within 20 miles of my departure point? Do I have to actually file starting with a fix, or can I just file from any point on an airway? Given the busy nature of the NY area, what are my odds of getting a clearance using a fix further away? (That last one may just come from experience). A better understanding of this sure will help me pick better routes in the future since I'd always file to the closest, even if I had a crappy route to my destination. You can file to any fix you can navigate to. I regularly file to and from lat/lon coordinates, far from any airway. It's easier for ATC if you file to a fix they have in the database, but it's not absolutely essential. You do need to be able to navigate to the fix in the event of radar failure. You may not be cleared to the fix you filed to, and perhaps won't get the route you filed. But you can *file* what you like. -- Regards, Stan |
#23
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Reading Don Brown's AvWeb column, filing to lat/lon's is causes problems.
Stan Gosnell wrote: You can file to any fix you can navigate to. I regularly file to and from lat/lon coordinates, far from any airway. It's easier for ATC if you file to a fix they have in the database, but it's not absolutely essential. You do need to be able to navigate to the fix in the event of radar failure. You may not be cleared to the fix you filed to, and perhaps won't get the route you filed. But you can *file* what you like. |
#24
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"john smith" wrote in message ... Reading Don Brown's AvWeb column, filing to lat/lon's is causes problems. He's mistaken. |
#25
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"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message ink.net...
"Andrew Gideon" wrote in message online.com... What had you filed and what was the actual clearance? How do you differentiate a VOR from an airport when filing? What is the difference between SAC and SAC, what is the difference between SMO and SMO, etc. -Robert |
#26
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"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message om... What had you filed and what was the actual clearance? How do you differentiate a VOR from an airport when filing? What is the difference between SAC and SAC, what is the difference between SMO and SMO, etc. On-field VORs usually have the same identifier as the airport, but not always. In this case Lancaster Airport is LNS and Lancaster VORTAC is LRP. It may simply be that the proposal strip had LNS..LRP..ETX... as the route and the controller just read it as written. |
#27
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#28
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"Stan Gosnell" wrote in message ... (Robert M. Gary) wrote in om: How do you differentiate a VOR from an airport when filing? What is the difference between SAC and SAC, what is the difference between SMO and SMO, etc. In the US, put a K in front of the airport identifier. KSAC is the airport. That's fine, but unnecessary. The position in the route indicates whether it's an airport or navaid. If you filed SAC..SAC..SMO..SMO, for example, the first and last fixes are assumed to be airports. Northwest Airlines provides service from Green Bay to Minneapolis. About half their flights are filed GRB..GRB.EAU6.MSP, the rest are filed GRB.EAU6.MSP. GRB VORTAC is about five miles northwest of the airport but the flights are treated exactly the same |
#29
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Stan Gosnell wrote in message ...
(Robert M. Gary) wrote in om: How do you differentiate a VOR from an airport when filing? What is the difference between SAC and SAC, what is the difference between SMO and SMO, etc. -Robert In the US, put a K in front of the airport identifier. KSAC is the airport. Yes, but I want the VOR |
#30
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"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message link.net...
"Stan Gosnell" wrote in message ... (Robert M. Gary) wrote in om: That's fine, but unnecessary. The position in the route indicates whether it's an airport or navaid. If you filed SAC..SAC..SMO..SMO, for example, the first and last fixes are assumed to be airports. Northwest Airlines provides service from Green Bay to Minneapolis. About half their flights are filed GRB..GRB.EAU6.MSP, the rest are filed GRB.EAU6.MSP. GRB VORTAC is about five miles northwest of the airport but the flights are treated exactly the same I guess the situations where I've had it come up are when I want to fly the VFR route over LAX and then pick up my IFR at the SMO VOR. When the controllers see SMO as the first fix, they seem to assume I want to pick it up on the ground. In every case, approach as refused to issue clearance when in the air. -Robert |
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