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#1
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Instrument PTS vs. GPS AFM -- who wins?
I just noticed an interesting problem with the Instrument Rating PTS. It
says: Aircraft and Equipment Required for the Practical Test [...] GPS equipment must [...] contain the current database. The problem is that not all GPS units require that the database be current. The CNX-80 AFM Supplement says: 2.3 DATABASE The CNX80 Database Card P/N 138-0329-010 Rev. -- (or later FAA approved version) must be installed. a) IFR enroute and terminal navigation is prohibited unless the pilot verifies the currency of the database or verifies each selected waypoint for accuracy by reference to current approved data. b) Instrument approaches using the CNX80 are prohibited unlessCNX80 approach data is verified by the pilot or crew to be current. Instrument approaches must be accomplished in accordance with approved instrument approach procedures that are loaded from the CNX80 database. So, it's perfectly legal for me to fly with an expired database, as long as I verify that the data is correct (presumably by comparison to a current chart). |
#2
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"Roy Smith" wrote in message =
... I just noticed an interesting problem with the Instrument Rating PTS. = It=20 says: =20 Aircraft and Equipment Required for the Practical Test [...] GPS equipment must [...] contain the current database. =20 The problem is that not all GPS units require that the database be = current. =20 The CNX-80 AFM Supplement says: =20 2.3 DATABASE The CNX80 Database Card P/N 138-0329-010 Rev. -- (or later FAA = approved=20 version) must be installed. a) IFR enroute and terminal navigation is prohibited unless the pilot=20 verifies the currency of the database or verifies each selected = waypoint=20 for accuracy by reference to current approved data. b) Instrument approaches using the CNX80 are prohibited unlessCNX80=20 approach data is verified by the pilot or crew to be current. = Instrument=20 approaches must be accomplished in accordance with approved instrument = approach procedures that are loaded from the CNX80 database. =20 So, it's perfectly legal for me to fly with an expired database, as = long as=20 I verify that the data is correct (presumably by comparison to a = current=20 chart). Roy, I've wrestled with that same idea. I've concluded they are two separate items. That's to say: (a) I may navigate IFR with an expired CNX80 database if I verify its = data, but (b) I may not use an expired database on a flight test. I can live with that dichotomy. |
#3
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On Thu, 07 Apr 2005 20:50:35 -0400, Roy Smith wrote:
The problem is that not all GPS units require that the database be current. The CNX-80 AFM Supplement says: 2.3 DATABASE The CNX80 Database Card P/N 138-0329-010 Rev. -- (or later FAA approved version) must be installed. a) IFR enroute and terminal navigation is prohibited unless the pilot verifies the currency of the database or verifies each selected waypoint for accuracy by reference to current approved data. b) Instrument approaches using the CNX80 are prohibited unlessCNX80 approach data is verified by the pilot or crew to be current. Instrument approaches must be accomplished in accordance with approved instrument approach procedures that are loaded from the CNX80 database. So, it's perfectly legal for me to fly with an expired database, as long as I verify that the data is correct (presumably by comparison to a current chart). I'll play Satan's attorney for a moment, and argue that in this context, the phrase "approach data" does not mean "data for a specific approach" but instead means "ALL the data for ALL approaches," making manual verification somewhat impratical ;-) I could also argue that since the statement does not specify what is an acceptable method of data verification, the only acceptable method is verifying the revision date of the entire data set. Sure, these arguments could be totally bogus, but do you really want to take that chance? |
#4
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"John R. Copeland" wrote in
: I've concluded they are two separate items. That's to say: (a) I may navigate IFR with an expired CNX80 database if I verify its data, but (b) I may not use an expired database on a flight test. I can live with that dichotomy. Any similarity between checkrides and the real world is merely an illusion. For a checkride, do what you have to do to make the examiner happy. In the real world, do what you have to do to remain safe and legal. They aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, but they certainly are not the same. -- Regards, Stan "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." B. Franklin |
#5
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The way I read that says that you can use an expired database for
enroute or terminal navigation (paragraph a), however you must have a current database in order to use it for approaches (paragraph b). That makes a lot of sense to me, and since the PTS now calls for a GPS approach if the aircraft is equipped with one, looks like you should have a current GPS. If, however, you can get the DE to do the approach in VFR conditions, then you're still VFR and he may allow you to use the expired database. On Thu, 07 Apr 2005 20:50:35 -0400, Roy Smith wrote: I just noticed an interesting problem with the Instrument Rating PTS. It says: Aircraft and Equipment Required for the Practical Test [...] GPS equipment must [...] contain the current database. The problem is that not all GPS units require that the database be current. The CNX-80 AFM Supplement says: 2.3 DATABASE The CNX80 Database Card P/N 138-0329-010 Rev. -- (or later FAA approved version) must be installed. a) IFR enroute and terminal navigation is prohibited unless the pilot verifies the currency of the database or verifies each selected waypoint for accuracy by reference to current approved data. b) Instrument approaches using the CNX80 are prohibited unlessCNX80 approach data is verified by the pilot or crew to be current. Instrument approaches must be accomplished in accordance with approved instrument approach procedures that are loaded from the CNX80 database. So, it's perfectly legal for me to fly with an expired database, as long as I verify that the data is correct (presumably by comparison to a current chart). |
#6
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On Thu, 07 Apr 2005 20:50:35 -0400, Roy Smith wrote:
I just noticed an interesting problem with the Instrument Rating PTS. It says: Aircraft and Equipment Required for the Practical Test [...] GPS equipment must [...] contain the current database. The problem is that not all GPS units require that the database be current. The CNX-80 AFM Supplement says: But apparently the I-PTS requires that the database be current "in order to take the Practical Test". Just because something is required for purposes of taking the test, does not necessarily mean that it is required to be legal in other circumstances. Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA) |
#7
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Roy Smith wrote:
I just noticed an interesting problem with the Instrument Rating PTS. It says: Aircraft and Equipment Required for the Practical Test [...] GPS equipment must [...] contain the current database. There are all sorts of little requirements in various PTS's that call for requirements beyond what you'd need for the actual sort of operation you're testing for. (Complex aircraft, full dual controls, that sort of thing.) This of this as just another one. (Or you can just think of it as the FAA being randomly weird. They do that.) |
#8
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If I remember right though the PTS says for something to the effect
that if the aircraft is equipped with an IFR approved GPS that one of the approaches needs to be a GPS approach. If you do not have the current database then you can do another non-gps approach and it is a dead issue. On Thu, 07 Apr 2005 20:50:35 -0400, Roy Smith wrote: I just noticed an interesting problem with the Instrument Rating PTS. It says: Aircraft and Equipment Required for the Practical Test [...] GPS equipment must [...] contain the current database. The problem is that not all GPS units require that the database be current. The CNX-80 AFM Supplement says: 2.3 DATABASE The CNX80 Database Card P/N 138-0329-010 Rev. -- (or later FAA approved version) must be installed. a) IFR enroute and terminal navigation is prohibited unless the pilot verifies the currency of the database or verifies each selected waypoint for accuracy by reference to current approved data. b) Instrument approaches using the CNX80 are prohibited unlessCNX80 approach data is verified by the pilot or crew to be current. Instrument approaches must be accomplished in accordance with approved instrument approach procedures that are loaded from the CNX80 database. So, it's perfectly legal for me to fly with an expired database, as long as I verify that the data is correct (presumably by comparison to a current chart). |
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