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Ground 350 run without blades?



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 12th 04, 09:24 PM
Sla#s
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Default Ground 350 run without blades?

Has anyone ever run a AS 350 or 355 without the Main rotor blades fitted?
We do it all the time with our 315 but I've never heard of it with a
Squirrel / A Star.
It would make tail rotor balancing a lot easier for a start - i.e. no pilot
needed. That's what we do with our Lama and use to do with our Alouettes.
No one here wants to risk it - "The engines will overspeed" - " It will over
speed the gearbox" - " It will over speed/torque the tail rotor" etc. etc.

Anyone any real info as opposed to opinions?


Slatts



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  #2  
Old February 13th 04, 04:14 AM
Stan Gosnell
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Default

"Sla#s" wrote in
:

Has anyone ever run a AS 350 or 355 without the Main rotor blades
fitted? We do it all the time with our 315 but I've never heard of it
with a Squirrel / A Star.
It would make tail rotor balancing a lot easier for a start - i.e. no
pilot needed. That's what we do with our Lama and use to do with our
Alouettes. No one here wants to risk it - "The engines will overspeed"
- " It will over speed the gearbox" - " It will over speed/torque the
tail rotor" etc. etc.


Why don't you go ahead and try it and let us know?

Why do you need a pilot? Our mechanics (engineers) are trained to do
groundruns in skid-mounted helicopters, up to and including Bell 412s.
They do all the tail rotor balancing, etc themselves.

--
Regards,

Stan

  #3  
Old February 13th 04, 08:56 PM
Sla#s
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Default


"Stan Gosnell" wrote in message
...
"Sla#s" wrote in
:

Has anyone ever run a AS 350 or 355 without the Main rotor blades
fitted? We do it all the time with our 315 but I've never heard of it
with a Squirrel / A Star.
It would make tail rotor balancing a lot easier for a start - i.e. no
pilot needed. That's what we do with our Lama and use to do with our
Alouettes. No one here wants to risk it - "The engines will overspeed"
- " It will over speed the gearbox" - " It will over speed/torque the
tail rotor" etc. etc.


Why don't you go ahead and try it and let us know?


:-) But that's the problem "The Management" will not let us. I have been
doing it to 3180s & 315s since the 60s but the doom mongers say we can't
with the newer ships. However they have never produced any evidence against.
On the other hand I can't find any for! That's why I'm asking :-)

Why do you need a pilot? Our mechanics (engineers) are trained to do
groundruns in skid-mounted helicopters, up to and including Bell 412s.
They do all the tail rotor balancing, etc themselves.


Yes again in the 60s we did but there was one accident when an engineer
wrecked a machine. So since then the insurance companies will not let us.

Slatts


  #4  
Old February 13th 04, 11:05 PM
Stan Gosnell
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Default

"Sla#s" wrote in
:


:-) But that's the problem "The Management" will not let us. I have
:been
doing it to 3180s & 315s since the 60s but the doom mongers say we
can't with the newer ships. However they have never produced any
evidence against. On the other hand I can't find any for! That's why
I'm asking :-)


If management says don't do it, why do you want to? They know you can't do
it, so they can't blame you if the work doesn't get done. OTOH, if
something bad happens, you'll get the blame. Accept the fact that you're
required to do less work, with less responsibility for damage and/or lack
of productivity. Don't look gift horses in the mouth.

Yes again in the 60s we did but there was one accident when an
engineer wrecked a machine. So since then the insurance companies
will not let us.


We've wrecked a few, too, but the mechs still run them up. If you can't,
then don't fight it. See above advice about gift horses.

--
Regards,

Stan

  #5  
Old February 13th 04, 11:20 PM
Bob
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Default

That is real info. What does balancing a tail rotor have to do with Main
Rotor Blades? I'm a maintenance guy who has bee ground running helicopters
for almost 20 years. By the way Main Rotor Blades is what helps to make it
a HELICOPTER. Which bunch of Yahoos are WE? Any PROFESSIONAL ORGANIZATION
that the PROFESSIONAL avaition community might be familiar with???


  #6  
Old February 13th 04, 11:30 PM
Ash Wyllie
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Posts: n/a
Default

Sla#s opined

"Stan Gosnell" wrote in message
...
"Sla#s" wrote in
:

Has anyone ever run a AS 350 or 355 without the Main rotor blades
fitted? We do it all the time with our 315 but I've never heard of it
with a Squirrel / A Star.
It would make tail rotor balancing a lot easier for a start - i.e. no
pilot needed. That's what we do with our Lama and use to do with our
Alouettes. No one here wants to risk it - "The engines will overspeed"
- " It will over speed the gearbox" - " It will over speed/torque the
tail rotor" etc. etc.


Why don't you go ahead and try it and let us know?


:-) But that's the problem "The Management" will not let us. I have been
doing it to 3180s & 315s since the 60s but the doom mongers say we can't
with the newer ships. However they have never produced any evidence against.
On the other hand I can't find any for! That's why I'm asking :-)


Why do you need a pilot? Our mechanics (engineers) are trained to do
groundruns in skid-mounted helicopters, up to and including Bell 412s.
They do all the tail rotor balancing, etc themselves.


Yes again in the 60s we did but there was one accident when an engineer
wrecked a machine. So since then the insurance companies will not let us.


So, I guess that it OK for pilots to wreck a machine.



-ash
Cthulhu for President!
Why vote for a lesser evil?

  #7  
Old February 14th 04, 03:07 PM
Sla#s
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Posts: n/a
Default


"Bob" wrote in message
...
That is real info. What does balancing a tail rotor have to do with Main
Rotor Blades? I'm a maintenance guy who has bee ground running

helicopters
for almost 20 years. By the way Main Rotor Blades is what helps to make

it
a HELICOPTER. Which bunch of Yahoos are WE? Any PROFESSIONAL ORGANIZATION
that the PROFESSIONAL avaition community might be familiar with???


You are missing the point. On 3180s & 315s one runs the machine without the
blades to centre a new servo. (If you don't have a hydraulic rig on site)
That is a standard practice. So one might as well do the tail rotor whilst
you are at it. AND Its a hell of a lot quicker than when the MRBs are
fitted. OK those machines have a clutch but I still say it would also be
quicker - and safer - to do maintenance runs on 350/355s, that did not
involve needing the MRBs, without them.

Slatts


  #8  
Old February 14th 04, 11:07 PM
me
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Posts: n/a
Default



Sla#s wrote:

"Bob" wrote in message
...

That is real info. What does balancing a tail rotor have to do with Main
Rotor Blades? I'm a maintenance guy who has bee ground running


helicopters

for almost 20 years. By the way Main Rotor Blades is what helps to make


it

a HELICOPTER. Which bunch of Yahoos are WE? Any PROFESSIONAL ORGANIZATION
that the PROFESSIONAL avaition community might be familiar with???



You are missing the point. On 3180s & 315s one runs the machine without the
blades to centre a new servo. (If you don't have a hydraulic rig on site)
That is a standard practice. So one might as well do the tail rotor whilst
you are at it. AND Its a hell of a lot quicker than when the MRBs are
fitted. OK those machines have a clutch but I still say it would also be
quicker - and safer - to do maintenance runs on 350/355s, that did not
involve needing the MRBs, without them.

Slatts




What does the manufacture have to say on this matter. They write the
maintenance manual.

rm


  #9  
Old February 16th 04, 06:54 PM
Sla#s
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Posts: n/a
Default


"me" wrote in message
om.au...


What does the manufacture have to say on this matter. They write the
maintenance manual.


I'm checking the 350 manuals but nothing so far.

The running 315/3180 without blades was shown to us by the factory rep when
we first bought it.

Slatts


  #10  
Old February 17th 04, 12:14 AM
Eric D
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Default

What does the manufacture have to say on this matter. They write the
maintenance manual.


I'm checking the 350 manuals but nothing so far.

The running 315/3180 without blades was shown to us by the factory rep when
we first bought it.

Slatts


Factory rep or not, if it isn't in one of the maintenance manuals as
one of the proceedures, you would be wise not to do it. One of the
concerns I would have is the affect on other components without the
inertia of the main rotors in the system. Could you unknowingly
damage something in the driveline? The manufacture is the best source
for figuring this type of thing out.

Eric D
 




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