Evils of crossposting to rec.avionation NGs

Please understand, I'm NOT trying to begin/continue any kind of arguement.
This is a serious attempt to gain understanding.



As I've only been lurking around aviation newsgroups for a little more than
a year, I'll readily admit a lack of understanding of the finer points of
R.A.O "netiquette". It seems there are some members of this group who are
1.) Adamantly opposed to Jay Honeck and anything he does; 2.) Unequivocal
supporters of Jay, and 3.) Occasionally some appear to be both.



I mention this first part only because it is the kernel of my question.
Quite a few of the posts complaining about Jay also refer to the "vile"
practice of crossposting. I understand what crossposting is- I don't
understand how it causes such ire.



First, allow me to be forthright and admit that recently I utilized
crossposting when asking for help to identify a photo of an airport. I felt
that by posting to four aviation newsgroups at once I'd reach a larger
audience. I didn't see how this caused any harm. What would be the
difference if I listed four groups in the header, or I posted the same
request in four different groups? Is a poster limited to only one NG?



In fact, I considered crossposting preferable. Why? Because my newsreader,
(MS IE 6.0) will mark a cossposted article as read, in all groups, once I
read it in one. Thus, SAVING, not (as several have decried) wasting time.
In an attempt at humor, I even apologized for the crosspost, and offered to
come to the homes of those offended by the practice and personally delete
the offending posts. Apparently, my attempt at humor fell somewhat flat.



I've searched the rec.aviation FAQS and couldn't find anything pertinent to
the evils of crossposting. Am I missing something important here, or is
this just a lot of smoke by people who just don't like Jay?



Thanks,



Gary (promising to crosspost ONLY when necessary) Kasten

"VideoGuy" gkasten at brick dot net wrote in message
...
|
| I mention this first part only because it is the kernel of my question.
| Quite a few of the posts complaining about Jay also refer to the "vile"
| practice of crossposting. I understand what crossposting is- I don't
| understand how it causes such ire.

I think many of the complaints are more vile and waste more bandwidth than
the things they are complaining about. There seems to be a certain core
group of users that are adamantly opposed to anything that has to do with:

Windows
AOL
Outlook or Outlook Express
Anything invented in the last 20 years.

Most of them act as if they are still using 150 baud Teletypes and that
anything that imposes a hint of technological progress beyond that
constitutes a mortal threat to world civilization.

It makes a body want to post in HTML just so you can listen to them shriek.

(Flame suit on, long sharp stick at the ready.)

Please understand, I'm NOT trying to begin/continue any kind of arguement.
This is a serious attempt to gain understanding.

What a great post! I, too, have wondered why so many people actually
care -- or even *notice* -- when something has been "cross-posted" to
several newsgroups. Why this practice is a "problem," or even worth
commenting on, has been an eternal source of chagrin and wonder for me.

Some pilots hang out in ".piloting." Others prefer ".owning." Folks
building airplanes tend to hang out in ".homebuilt." If you want to make
an announcement to ALL of them -- or if you wish to query ALL of them, why
wouldn't you cross-post your message?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"VideoGuy" gkasten at brick dot net wrote in message
...



As I've only been lurking around aviation newsgroups for a little more
than
a year, I'll readily admit a lack of understanding of the finer points of
R.A.O "netiquette". It seems there are some members of this group who are
1.) Adamantly opposed to Jay Honeck and anything he does; 2.) Unequivocal
supporters of Jay, and 3.) Occasionally some appear to be both.



I mention this first part only because it is the kernel of my question.
Quite a few of the posts complaining about Jay also refer to the "vile"
practice of crossposting. I understand what crossposting is- I don't
understand how it causes such ire.



First, allow me to be forthright and admit that recently I utilized
crossposting when asking for help to identify a photo of an airport. I
felt
that by posting to four aviation newsgroups at once I'd reach a larger
audience. I didn't see how this caused any harm. What would be the
difference if I listed four groups in the header, or I posted the same
request in four different groups? Is a poster limited to only one NG?



In fact, I considered crossposting preferable. Why? Because my
newsreader,
(MS IE 6.0) will mark a cossposted article as read, in all groups, once I
read it in one. Thus, SAVING, not (as several have decried) wasting time.
In an attempt at humor, I even apologized for the crosspost, and offered
to
come to the homes of those offended by the practice and personally delete
the offending posts. Apparently, my attempt at humor fell somewhat flat.



I've searched the rec.aviation FAQS and couldn't find anything pertinent
to
the evils of crossposting. Am I missing something important here, or is
this just a lot of smoke by people who just don't like Jay?



Thanks,



Gary (promising to crosspost ONLY when necessary) Kasten

On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 22:31:04 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
wrote:

Some pilots hang out in ".piloting." Others prefer ".owning." Folks
building airplanes tend to hang out in ".homebuilt." If you want to make
an announcement to ALL of them -- or if you wish to query ALL of them, why
wouldn't you cross-post your message?

The dislike of cross-posting may be mostly a holdover from the old days...
the early news-reading programs even gave you a warning if you listed more
than one newsgroup as a destination. The early programs didn't "weed out"
the messages from subsequent newsgroups...heck, I still see them all when I
use Forte Agent. I've probably got a setting wrong, but it doesn't bother
me to the extent that I'll spend time chasing it down.

Crossposting probably got its bad rep back in the days when there weren't a
wide expanse of sub-groups... it was obviously bad form to post the same
message to net.aviation and net.autos. Yet even then, there were those who
were able to rationalize it.

Back when the sub-groups popped up, the general philosophy seemed be that
every group hierarchy would include a "*.misc" newsgroup that would be used
for items of general interest. Nominally, then, a general question should
be posted only to rec.aviation.misc. But there's nothing that forces
people to subscribe to that group, hence a "to everyone" posting done in
r.a.misc doesn't get the widest readership.

Being one who grew up feeding the line eater, I crosspost extremely rarely.
When I reply, I almost always reply only in the newsgroup in which I first
saw the message. So if you *do* crosspost to multiple groups, do readers
the courtesy of at least posting only to groups that you subscribe to.
Otherwise, you might be missing answers to your question.

Ron Wanttaja

VideoGuy wrote:

I've searched the rec.aviation FAQS and couldn't find anything pertinent to
the evils of crossposting. Am I missing something important here, or is
this just a lot of smoke by people who just don't like Jay?

Gary,

There is nothing evil about crossposting so long as the topic is
appropriate for all groups you post to. It may be subjective to some,
but just common sense prevails.

If you are posting what GPS should you get for your airplane, posting
this would not be appropriate for rec.aviation.students.

However, if you are learning how to do a particular flight manuever in
your airplane and are looking for CFI advise, to me, posting to
rec.aviation.owning and .students would be appropriate since you are
solicitating information from a owner who may have your make and model
of plane or a CFI who has flown that type of airplane. Bottom line,
common sense should prevail when you cross post.

I saw your post, though didn't notice what groups you posted in. I
didn't find anything objectional, but I am only one electron in the
community of megabits.

Allen

Crosspost at will, as long as it's on topic.

VideoGuy wrote:

Please understand, I'm NOT trying to begin/continue any kind of arguement.
This is a serious attempt to gain understanding.



As I've only been lurking around aviation newsgroups for a little more than
a year, I'll readily admit a lack of understanding of the finer points of
R.A.O "netiquette". It seems there are some members of this group who are
1.) Adamantly opposed to Jay Honeck and anything he does; 2.) Unequivocal
supporters of Jay, and 3.) Occasionally some appear to be both.



I mention this first part only because it is the kernel of my question.
Quite a few of the posts complaining about Jay also refer to the "vile"
practice of crossposting. I understand what crossposting is- I don't
understand how it causes such ire.



First, allow me to be forthright and admit that recently I utilized
crossposting when asking for help to identify a photo of an airport. I felt
that by posting to four aviation newsgroups at once I'd reach a larger
audience. I didn't see how this caused any harm. What would be the
difference if I listed four groups in the header, or I posted the same
request in four different groups? Is a poster limited to only one NG?



In fact, I considered crossposting preferable. Why? Because my newsreader,
(MS IE 6.0) will mark a cossposted article as read, in all groups, once I
read it in one. Thus, SAVING, not (as several have decried) wasting time.
In an attempt at humor, I even apologized for the crosspost, and offered to
come to the homes of those offended by the practice and personally delete
the offending posts. Apparently, my attempt at humor fell somewhat flat.



I've searched the rec.aviation FAQS and couldn't find anything pertinent to
the evils of crossposting. Am I missing something important here, or is
this just a lot of smoke by people who just don't like Jay?



Thanks,



Gary (promising to crosspost ONLY when necessary) Kasten

"VideoGuy" gkasten at brick dot net wrote in message
...

I've searched the rec.aviation FAQS and couldn't find anything pertinent
to
the evils of crossposting. Am I missing something important here, or is
this just a lot of smoke by people who just don't like Jay?

Like some drugs, crossposting is a useful idea that is far too often
misused. I frankly have no idea who Jay is, but many (perhaps most) people
would be happier if you kept the crossposting to those rare cases where it
seems to make special sense. If you do crosspost, I suggest that you
occasionally check the responses in all of the groups you have posted to
because some people take the trouble to trim the extraneous groups before
they respond.

Vaughn



Thanks,



Gary (promising to crosspost ONLY when necessary) Kasten

"VideoGuy" gkasten at brick dot net writes:

First, allow me to be forthright and admit that recently I utilized
crossposting when asking for help to identify a photo of an airport. I felt
that by posting to four aviation newsgroups at once I'd reach a larger
audience. I didn't see how this caused any harm.

If lots of people followed your lead (and lots do), then the purpose
of separate sub-newsgroups becomes meaningless. Why not just have a
single rec.aviation?

The reason is obvious, people don't want to read about items for sale
in the .piloting subgroup, and so on. So I don't like even "proper"
cross-posting (where the multiple newsgroups are listed on a single
Newsgroups line). For instance this thread doesn't make sense under
r.a.owning. What the hell does a crossposting discussion have to do
with owning an airplane?

"Bob Fry" wrote in message
...
So I don't like even "proper" cross-posting (where the multiple
newsgroups are listed on a single Newsgroups line). For instance this
thread doesn't make sense under
r.a.owning. What the hell does a crossposting discussion have to do with
owning an
airplane?

SOOOORRRRRY MAN!

Didn't mean to get you so upset. I THOUGHT it made sense to this group
because so many in the group were involved in the discussion, and a fair
amount of them mentioned crossposting. I guess the topic is more emotional
that I suspected.

Thanks anyway for your comment.

Gary (feeling bad now that I even brought it up) Kasten

Who cares

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