possible FAA action... flight or fight?

"Matt Whiting" wrote:

What did he possibly say that could be used against him? He never
admitted
to doing anything wrong or unlawful.

Not yet, but the thread could easily develop into details that might
not
be helpful.

That would require an FAA employee, deciding to "take a shot" and spend
hours browsing all the discussion groups on the net to try and connect
facts posed under a pseudonym to their violation case. If they have
proposed a sanction, that means they feel they have the facts to meet
their burden of proof. Why would they spend such time? All orig poster
has to do is change the date and location of the violation, and the type
aircraft. This denies the FAA any ability to prove the poster is the
violator, as if such evidence to be potentially introduced in litigation
were not rather bizarre and all that important.

Fred F.

"TaxSrv" wrote in message
...
"Matt Whiting" wrote:

What did he possibly say that could be used against him? He never
admitted
to doing anything wrong or unlawful.

Not yet, but the thread could easily develop into details that might
not
be helpful.

That would require an FAA employee, deciding to "take a shot" and spend
hours browsing all the discussion groups on the net to try and connect
facts posed under a pseudonym to their violation case. If they have
proposed a sanction, that means they feel they have the facts to meet
their burden of proof. Why would they spend such time? All orig poster
has to do is change the date and location of the violation, and the type
aircraft. This denies the FAA any ability to prove the poster is the
violator, as if such evidence to be potentially introduced in litigation
were not rather bizarre and all that important.

Fred F.


Yes, a voice of reason. The questions and discussion can be posed
anonymously and as hypotheticals. Therefore, no admissions against penal
or civil interest.

Personally, I wouldn't be bothered too much by a six-month suspension. I
think when they pull your certificate, you need to re-test for everything
again. Depending on what ratings you have, that may get expensive. I know
for the private you'll need three hours in the past 60 days in preparation
for the test.

What I wonder about is what having that on your 'record' may do in the
future. What comes to mind is the guy who pleaded to indecent exposure for
taking a leak in public. The $50 fine was much easier than hiring a lawyer.
Many years later he finds out that he must now register as a sex offender.

What happens when they decide that your certificate is no longer good for
life (like they did with the Firearms ID)? You need to re-apply, and they
deny you or hold you up because you once lost it?

wrote in message
oups.com...
I got in a little trouble with the FAA and they want to take my license
for 6 months. Now their case isn't too strong (and based very much on
the subjectivity of "safe" and not on any clear cut violation of a
FAR). I'm trying to decide whether to fight it (expensive attorney
fees) or just suck it up and take some time off flying (which I
desperately don't want to do since I fly a lot and use my plane for
business).

1. Will this follow me the rest of my life or is it like speeding
where after so many years (3, etc) it's off your record?

2. What are the implications of having a violation on my record if I
decide to get a flying job in the future? How seriously do employers
look at violations? Is it a thing where I won't even get called in
for an interview if I have one on my application or will they normally
call me in so I can explain things in an interview?

3. Any rough idea how it affects insurance rates if there's a
violation (like XX% or something)?

4. Is it worth fighting the FAA- how often do folks actually win?
I've only heard horror stories and it seems like a GA pilot really
doesn't have much of a chance.

5. How negotiable is the FAA regarding the 6-month suspension- have
any of you been able to talk them into something else like a shorter
time (30 days or 60 days) or maybe community service?

I would appreciate any comments from folks that have been through this
before (vs just speculation).

Frank

Things to use against you in your original statement:
1: "based very much on the subjectivity of "safe" and not on any clear
cut violation"
If saftey is just subjective to you, then maybe you where in
violation.
2: "since I fly a lot and use my plane for business"
Sounds like your not a commercial pilot but being paid to fly.
CFI maybe? What unsafe things are you teaching?
3: "violation on my record if I decide to get a flying job in the
future?"
Quite possibly you've already applied for a job and this has come
up before.

What did they accuse you of and what promted it? Kind of hard to offer much
advice without knowing what the deal is.


wrote in message
oups.com...
I got in a little trouble with the FAA and they want to take my license
for 6 months. Now their case isn't too strong (and based very much on
the subjectivity of "safe" and not on any clear cut violation of a
FAR). I'm trying to decide whether to fight it (expensive attorney
fees) or just suck it up and take some time off flying (which I
desperately don't want to do since I fly a lot and use my plane for
business).

1. Will this follow me the rest of my life or is it like speeding
where after so many years (3, etc) it's off your record?

2. What are the implications of having a violation on my record if I
decide to get a flying job in the future? How seriously do employers
look at violations? Is it a thing where I won't even get called in
for an interview if I have one on my application or will they normally
call me in so I can explain things in an interview?

3. Any rough idea how it affects insurance rates if there's a
violation (like XX% or something)?

4. Is it worth fighting the FAA- how often do folks actually win?
I've only heard horror stories and it seems like a GA pilot really
doesn't have much of a chance.

5. How negotiable is the FAA regarding the 6-month suspension- have
any of you been able to talk them into something else like a shorter
time (30 days or 60 days) or maybe community service?

I would appreciate any comments from folks that have been through this
before (vs just speculation).

Frank

Frank
I'd suggest you give Glenn McGoverin (sp) in New Orleans a call. He
specializes in aviation matters such as this and helped me out ten
years ago at a very modest cost. At least a chat with him is worth the
call. He is an experienced pilot, has his own Cessna 206 and produces
documentaries in addition to practicing law there in New Orleans.
Please tell him I said hello and I'm still spraying.
Best Regards
Rocky Kemp

You may want to see a doctor about that.

{;-)


Jim

wrote in message
oups.com...

Please tell him I said hello and I'm still spraying.

Unfortunately I'm not an AOPA member though of course right now I'm
wishing I was.

I've purposely kept the description of my situation vague for the
reasons several of you have mentioned. I appreciate all the response
and help.

I was most interested in real-world experiences ("this happened to me
once...") so I could get a flavor of what to expect with the FAA.

So far I believe they're open to plea bargaining though I'm still
trying to decide what my position needs to be when I go in to the
"informal" interview with their attorney.

I'm contacting an attorney though my purpose in bringing up this
subject with all of you was to get a broader perspective.

Thanks again for the advice and concern.

Frank

wrote:
So far I believe they're open to plea bargaining though I'm still
trying to decide what my position needs to be when I go in to the
"informal" interview with their attorney.

I'm contacting an attorney though my purpose in bringing up this
subject with all of you was to get a broader perspective.


I don't have experience with FAA, but many years with other fed civil
enforcement. If similar, they don't have to "bargain" with you,
unrepresented, if they don't wish to. An attorney experienced with FAA,
however, can assess any weaknesses in their case and bargain along those
lines. He/she also can judge whether their proposed sanction is harsher
than typical for the violation and argue that. To the contrary, as you
suggest, if they will bargain with you alone to satisfactory result,
then you save on attorney fees.

Fred F.

I was most interested in real-world experiences ("this happened to me
once...") so I could get a flavor of what to expect with the FAA.

Unfortunately, given my experience it's too late to do anything but get
an attorney and hope for the best. Once they've gone as far as setting
the penalty, it's pretty much too late to do anything else. They're
not going to back off now, and your chances of prevailing in
administrative court are low.

Remember, you are considered an interested party. Despite all the
experience we have with FAA inspectors out to get people, the inspector
is considered impartial. Therefore, if it's your word against his,
you're not going to win.

Michael