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#31
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
"Ray O'Hara" wrote in message
... excellent Thanks Ray -- Andrew "Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible." (Lord Kelvin, president, Royal Society, 1895.) |
#32
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
Paul Elliot wrote:
Steven P. McNicoll wrote: "Enzo Matrix" wrote in message ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Emperor_(D98) http://www.navsource.org/archives/03/034.htm One of the photographs here clearly shows a Hellcat with invasion stripes, although the carrier was engaged on Operation DRAGOON at the time. The presence of invasion stripes does not indicate an aircraft participated in the D-Day landings, it just indicates it operated over western Europe on June 6 1944 or later. http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avf6f.html#m4 From http://www.navsource.org/archives/03/034.htm comes this quote: HMS Emperor was outfitted as a strike/CAP carrier. Provided fighter cover for a strike on German battleship Tirpitz; served as an ASW patrol ship at Normandy and supported invasion of southern France before transferring to the Pacific. which does support Enzo's statement that the ship was at Normandy on D-Day. Steven's link http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avf6f.html#m4 states "The Hellcat Is did not participate in the Normandy invasion in June 1944". It seems most unlikely that a valuable resource such as a squadron of very potent fighters would have sat out the biggest operation of the war. It may be splitting hairs, but there is a way that we can *both* be right. It is possible that Emperor's Hellcats were directly involved in fighter cover for the ASW screen, either in the Western Approaches or in the English Channel itself, and so did not actually make an appearance over the Normandy beach head. Therefore, they didn't actually *participate* in the invasion, but they did *support* it. -- Enzo I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. |
#33
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
"Enzo Matrix" skrev i en meddelelse ... http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avf6f.html#m4 From http://www.navsource.org/archives/03/034.htm comes this quote: HMS Emperor was outfitted as a strike/CAP carrier. Provided fighter cover for a strike on German battleship Tirpitz; served as an ASW patrol ship at Normandy and supported invasion of southern France before transferring to the Pacific. which does support Enzo's statement that the ship was at Normandy on D-Day. Steven's link http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avf6f.html#m4 states "The Hellcat Is did not participate in the Normandy invasion in June 1944". It seems most unlikely that a valuable resource such as a squadron of very potent fighters would have sat out the biggest operation of the war. It may be splitting hairs, but there is a way that we can *both* be right. It is possible that Emperor's Hellcats were directly involved in fighter cover for the ASW screen, either in the Western Approaches or in the English Channel itself, and so did not actually make an appearance over the Normandy beach head. Therefore, they didn't actually *participate* in the invasion, but they did *support* it. Grasping at straws now? ;-) It did participate, as did all other that served on that day in any capacity; and the original question was whether the paintscheme was correct - It was! |
#34
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
Blume, Alf wrote:
"Enzo Matrix" skrev i en meddelelse ... http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avf6f.html#m4 From http://www.navsource.org/archives/03/034.htm comes this quote: HMS Emperor was outfitted as a strike/CAP carrier. Provided fighter cover for a strike on German battleship Tirpitz; served as an ASW patrol ship at Normandy and supported invasion of southern France before transferring to the Pacific. which does support Enzo's statement that the ship was at Normandy on D-Day. Steven's link http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avf6f.html#m4 states "The Hellcat Is did not participate in the Normandy invasion in June 1944". It seems most unlikely that a valuable resource such as a squadron of very potent fighters would have sat out the biggest operation of the war. It may be splitting hairs, but there is a way that we can *both* be right. It is possible that Emperor's Hellcats were directly involved in fighter cover for the ASW screen, either in the Western Approaches or in the English Channel itself, and so did not actually make an appearance over the Normandy beach head. Therefore, they didn't actually *participate* in the invasion, but they did *support* it. Grasping at straws now? ;-) LOL As always. -- Enzo I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. |
#35
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
Andrew B wrote:
wrote in message ng.com... Maybe it's "OK" as a Franklin Mint diecast, but it doesn't hold a candle to a properly built plastic kit. Brian Would this be anywhere near qualifying as what you mean Brian? I've been waiting for an excuse to post the pic for a while now, it was taken while the model was suspended in front of a white-ish wall having given the prop a quick spin. I'm just a little disappointed by the under wing light/reflection. A standard plastic kit completed by my brother. My first reaction was "He's cheating! That's not a model - that's real!" :-) However, when you look closely - and it has to be really closely - you can just about tell it's a model. Excellent work! -- Enzo I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. |
#36
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
"Enzo Matrix" wrote in message
... My first reaction was "He's cheating! That's not a model - that's real!" :-) However, when you look closely - and it has to be really closely - you can just about tell it's a model. Excellent work! -- Enzo I wear the cheese. It does not wear me. Thanks Enzo, I'll make sure my brother gets to see your remarks and everyone else's when he next visits. -- Andrew "Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible." (Lord Kelvin, president, Royal Society, 1895.) |
#37
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
"Enzo Matrix" wrote in message ... Agreed. However we have two documents that mention Ermperor's service during the D-Day landings. One document states that Emperor "served on anti-submarine detail during Operation Overlord". The other states she "served as an ASW patrol ship at Normandy". I have no problem with the first one, I believe the second document is in error. HMS Emperor does not appear among the list of ships participating in Operation NEPTUNE, the naval side of OVERLORD. HMS Emperor may very well have been engaged in ASW operations during the invasion, but if those operations aren't considered direct support of NEPTUNE they can't be considered direct support of the Normandy invasion. The Royal Navy archive site does not mention Normandy or OVERLORD in it's history of HMS Emperor. http://www.royalnavyresearcharchive....RT/EMPEROR.htm The same two documents also claim that Emperor took part in Operations TUNGSTEN and DRAGOON. TUNGSTEN preceded OVERLORD, DRAGOON was after it. Both TUNGSTEN and DRAGOON involved the use of Hellcats from Emperor. It doesn't seem likely that the Hellcats were removed from Emperor before D-Day and replaced with some other naval fighter, only to be returned to the ship immediately afterwards. Agreed, and since there's no mention of participation in the Normandy invasion in the history of 800 Squadron it seems likely that HMS Emperor did not participate in that action. http://www.fleetairarmarchive.net/Squadrons/800.htm My statement, which you questioned, was "Emperor provided aircraft for the anti-submarine screen during the D-Day landings, again with Hellcats as fighter cover", which seems pretty much supported by those two documents. Only by one of them, which appears to be in error. |
#38
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
"Paul Elliot" wrote in message ... From http://www.navsource.org/archives/03/034.htm comes this quote: HMS Emperor was outfitted as a strike/CAP carrier. Provided fighter cover for a strike on German battleship Tirpitz; served as an ASW patrol ship at Normandy and supported invasion of southern France before transferring to the Pacific. which does support Enzo's statement that the ship was at Normandy on D-Day. Yes, but that appears to be an error. |
#39
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
"Enzo Matrix" wrote in message ... Steven's link http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avf6f.html#m4 states "The Hellcat Is did not participate in the Normandy invasion in June 1944". It seems most unlikely that a valuable resource such as a squadron of very potent fighters would have sat out the biggest operation of the war. It may be splitting hairs, but there is a way that we can *both* be right. It is possible that Emperor's Hellcats were directly involved in fighter cover for the ASW screen, either in the Western Approaches or in the English Channel itself, and so did not actually make an appearance over the Normandy beach head. Therefore, they didn't actually *participate* in the invasion, but they did *support* it. Then why isn't HMS Emperor listed among the participating ships of Operation NEPTUNE, and why isn't the Normandy invasion mentioned in the history of 800 Squadron? |
#40
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Hellcat Mk I - NICE ! ! !
"Blume, Alf" AlfBlume(a)hotmaildotcom wrote in message k... Grasping at straws now? ;-) It did participate, as did all other that served on that day in any capacity; and the original question was whether the paintscheme was correct - It was! The paint scheme is correct for the invasion of southern France. |
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