Testing your glide. Are people doing this?

"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...
Actually, I did not ask the question about owners. That was a reply to a
post that I made that did not talk about owners specifically.

You're right...sorry for putting words in your mouth.

On balance, do you see any difference between owners and renters?

My observation is that by far the greatest factor in proficiency is
frequency of flight, regardless of whether the plane is owned or
rented.

You may be right but there's something about having some power to work with.
I think that's why I enjoy the Pitts so much.

To get back to my original post, which I hadn't realized was causing so much
followon conversation, my point was that most of the activity I see at our
local airport involves people taking off, going away to land somewhere else,
and then coming back. Two flights, two landings, lots of cruise in the
middle. And they usually take the longest and widest runway unless the wind
is dramatically favoring one of the other shorter ones (onto which a local
pilot regularly puts a KingAir!). It's not the same qualified statement
that CJ can make as an instructor, but it's my observation and, based on my
experience, I didn't really learn how to fly properly until I spent hours in
the same plane just practicing various kinds of maneuvers to see how it
performed. I hadn't really been talking about the difference between
renters and owners and my comments could only be speculative about other
pilots, but are based on my observations.

Shawn
"William W. Plummer" wrote in message
newskFmb.24669$9E1.77470@attbi_s52...
If you really like stick-and-rudder flying, look into gliders. I'll bet
you
really like it.


"ShawnD2112" wrote in message
...
My experience is that most people don't actually know how to fly their
airplanes. They know how to get them off the ground, from Point A to
Point
B, but they never do touch and gos, they never go out and do stalls, and
they really don't know how their airplane performs in anything other
than
the cruise. Personally, I enjoy simply controlling the machine. Kind
of
like racing drivers - they enjoy being in control of the machine, not
using
it go to anywhere. Therefore, I get a hell of a kick out of touch and
goes,
I stall the airplane all the time simply because it's fun, I do all
kinds
of
turns and maneuvers just for the hell of it. What this all means is
that
I
know how my airplane performs at all edges of it's envelope and with the
engine off more than I do in the cruise. Possibly all for fun, but
really,
in the back of my mind, it's so I know how to get out of trouble faster
than
I got into it.

Shawn
"Montblack" wrote in message
...
("MLenoch" wrote)
Folks should go out and practice this a bunch. Early in the morning
high
above
the airport, they should simulate a glide onto the runway, to get a
feel
for
the descent rate, speed, angle, etc. etc.


Talking to folks at airports, do you get the sense that people are, in
fact,
doing what you suggested? Or is it just a good idea ...."I should do
that,
one-of-these-days"...kind of thing?

Just curious.

--
Montblack

"Styled by the laws of nature.............Concorde"

G.R. Patterson III wrote:

Jay Honeck wrote:

Now that we monitor Unicom at all hours, I can tell you that it is VERY rare
to hear someone practicing any "engine out" procedures over our airport.


Nearly every "engine out" practice I've been handed was off-airport.

George Patterson
You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the mud.

When I was training for my private, I had the same experience as George.
Every "engine out" was off-airport. Additionally, the procedure was
always the same -- CFI pulled the throttle, said, "you've lost your
engine," and I went through the memorized engine out procedures.

Got to my checkride, and the DPE threw me for a loop (not literally),
first by by pulling the throttle *slightly* back and saying, "suddenly
you can only make 2000 rpm. What are you going to do?" It wasn't how I
trained, and I had to actually stop and think, and I nearly blew it.
Then he said, pulling the throttle back a little more, "you can only
make 1500 rpm."

By this time I had determined the nearest airport, and was heading for
it. He planned it that way, which was the second thing that was
different from my training. He liked to do engine outs where your best
bet was heading for an airport, and let you take it all the way down.

In my case, I was too high and fast. I would have made the runway, but
probably would have run off the end, so we went around. It would have
been a messy but survivable landing.

I passed the checkride, but a big hole in my training had been pointed
out to me. Later, I went to that same airport, which has almost no
traffic, and practiced all sorts of power off approaches to landing,
pulling the power off at various altitudes directly over the runway, at
various points in the pattern, and at various points and altitudes away
from the airport.

I learned a lot from that, but as a renter, not all of it carried over
to the other planes I flew.

--
David Hill
david at hillREMOVETHISfamily.org
Sautee-Nacoochee, GA, USA

BTW: I'm sorry I didn't reply to your last message on our Newspaper
Memories thread... I was out of town (installing stacker controls,
actually) and when I came back, it got archived off by my news server,
which definitely doesn't keep messages long enough!

No problem! I had actually forgotten all about it. That's why I call
Usenet "Short Attention Span Theater"...

(Uh, what were we talking about again?? ;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

My observation is that by far the greatest factor in proficiency is
frequency of flight, regardless of whether the plane is owned or
rented.

Amen, brother. The worst pilot I know owns several planes.

Not surprisingly, he rarely flies. When he does -- look out below (and
above!)...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

I had a partial power failure during cruise climb once. It happens.

Here's another - complete power loss upon initial power reduction.
Insidious because you may not recognize it. This also happened
to me.

Here's another - partial power loss during initial climb. This also
happened. Three times.

Here's another - complete loss of oil on takeoff roll. This also
happened. Tower saved our can.

All different aircraft. All different reasons. One was a brand new
aircraft.

One resulted in landing off field - guess which one. Answer - where
the power failure was not recognized. Had to tow the plane back to
the airport with a car. You ever taxi a taildragger down a road on a rope
behind a car? Kind of fun.




In article , David Hill
wrote:
G.R. Patterson III wrote:

Jay Honeck wrote:

Now that we monitor Unicom at all hours, I can tell you that it is VERY rare
to hear someone practicing any "engine out" procedures over our airport.


Nearly every "engine out" practice I've been handed was off-airport.

George Patterson
You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the mud.

When I was training for my private, I had the same experience as George.
Every "engine out" was off-airport. Additionally, the procedure was
always the same -- CFI pulled the throttle, said, "you've lost your
engine," and I went through the memorized engine out procedures.

Got to my checkride, and the DPE threw me for a loop (not literally),
first by by pulling the throttle *slightly* back and saying, "suddenly
you can only make 2000 rpm. What are you going to do?" It wasn't how I
trained, and I had to actually stop and think, and I nearly blew it.
Then he said, pulling the throttle back a little more, "you can only
make 1500 rpm."

By this time I had determined the nearest airport, and was heading for
it. He planned it that way, which was the second thing that was
different from my training. He liked to do engine outs where your best
bet was heading for an airport, and let you take it all the way down.

In my case, I was too high and fast. I would have made the runway, but
probably would have run off the end, so we went around. It would have
been a messy but survivable landing.

I passed the checkride, but a big hole in my training had been pointed
out to me. Later, I went to that same airport, which has almost no
traffic, and practiced all sorts of power off approaches to landing,
pulling the power off at various altitudes directly over the runway, at
various points in the pattern, and at various points and altitudes away
from the airport.

I learned a lot from that, but as a renter, not all of it carried over
to the other planes I flew.

All different aircraft. All different reasons. One was a brand new
aircraft.

You've experienced engine failures (partial or complete) SIX times?

You're either the unluckiest person alive, or you fly jillions of hours.
(Or you need to talk to your A&P...)

Either way, good job walking away from all of 'em...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

In article ,
ShawnD2112 wrote:

You may be right but there's something about having some power to work with.
I think that's why I enjoy the Pitts so much. It's not the same qualified statement
that CJ can make as an instructor, but it's my observation and, based on my
experience, I didn't really learn how to fly properly until I spent hours in
the same plane just practicing various kinds of maneuvers to see how it
performed. I hadn't really been talking about the difference between
renters and owners and my comments could only be speculative about other
pilots, but are based on my observations.

Now, you are talking a completely different animal.
Flying a Pitts is not the same as flying a spam can.
Flying unusual attitudes (aerobatics) is not the same as flying
standard Private Pilot maneuvers.
What you have learned is finess and coordination because your aircraft
demands it. The control sesitivity of a Pitts is multiple times, if not
an order of magnitude, greater than that of the average spam can.

"The airshow begins when the Pitts flairs to land." - Norm Crabtree,
Director, Division of Aviation, Ohio Department of Transportation
(retired)

"Jay Honeck" wrote in news:VUOmb.33298$Tr4.61576
@attbi_s03:
No problem! I had actually forgotten all about it. That's why I call
Usenet "Short Attention Span Theater"...

(Uh, what were we talking about again?? ;-)

Hahaha!

I forgot! Something about work!