medical question: childhood heart murmur

Okay, here's an odd situation.

30-something pilot, been flying a few years, have had a couple of class
III medical examinations; no problems.

On a recent visit home, pilot's family remind him that as infant he had
a heart murmur. There were checkups for a few years, but no
restrictions, meds, problems, etc of any sort.

Pilot vaguely remembers some of this on being reminded, but also knows
he's never mentioned it to an AME. (As far as he knows, there's no
murmur today; at least no doctor or AME has mentioned it during an exam
in the last 20 years.)

Pilot has a one year old medical good for two more years.

1. does the pilot divulge to FAA said childhood murmur?
2. if so, to whom? AME? Oklahoma City?
3. does he wait until next exam (couple of years) or do so now?
4. If going to divulge, should he go get fancy/expensive tests *first*
or let FAA or AME ask for said tests?

Some seriously Googling about murmurs shows the protocol for murmurs to
be that they are FAA disqualifying until shown to be benign, and the
FAA has a list of stuff they want a cardiologist to provide to make the
decision. It's not clear if the AME or OKC needs to do that. The list
of stuff is long: stress test, ekg, family history, etc.


this unnamed flyer is a little freaked out right now. he doesn't want
to break the law, but doesn't want to give up his one true love,
flying!

thanks,
unnamedflyer

TROLL! shame on you...

Any AME worth his salt can detect a "detectable" heart murmer on
listening to the chest of an applicant.

If the murmer is no longer present, then your outgrew the condition. If
as a child you didn't require treatment, then likely as an adult you
dont either. If its not causing you symptoms, its a "non issue". As a
child a murmer is not uncommon, and many outgrow it as the heart grows

Would I disclose a transient childhood condition that is no longer
pertinent? Nope.

My take on it is, if its no longer present then its CLEARLY benign

If a new murmer develops it is likely because of a newly developed
structural problem: cardiomegaly, infarction, etc.. and those new
structural problems need to be evaluated properly with the million
dollar workup decribed below (echo, stress test, possible cardiac cath).

Keep in mind I am not an AME nor a cardiologist, just an ICU and ER
nurse who deals with lots of cardiac patients.

Dave

wrote:
Okay, here's an odd situation.

30-something pilot, been flying a few years, have had a couple of class
III medical examinations; no problems.

On a recent visit home, pilot's family remind him that as infant he had
a heart murmur. There were checkups for a few years, but no
restrictions, meds, problems, etc of any sort.

Pilot vaguely remembers some of this on being reminded, but also knows
he's never mentioned it to an AME. (As far as he knows, there's no
murmur today; at least no doctor or AME has mentioned it during an exam
in the last 20 years.)

Pilot has a one year old medical good for two more years.

1. does the pilot divulge to FAA said childhood murmur?
2. if so, to whom? AME? Oklahoma City?
3. does he wait until next exam (couple of years) or do so now?
4. If going to divulge, should he go get fancy/expensive tests *first*
or let FAA or AME ask for said tests?

Some seriously Googling about murmurs shows the protocol for murmurs to
be that they are FAA disqualifying until shown to be benign, and the
FAA has a list of stuff they want a cardiologist to provide to make the
decision. It's not clear if the AME or OKC needs to do that. The list
of stuff is long: stress test, ekg, family history, etc.


this unnamed flyer is a little freaked out right now. he doesn't want
to break the law, but doesn't want to give up his one true love,
flying!

thanks,
unnamedflyer

Dave S wrote:
Keep in mind I am not an AME nor a cardiologist, just an ICU and ER
nurse who deals with lots of cardiac patients.


Then you should look at the subject line to see how the word is spelled. I hope
you don't write "murmer" on charts.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

VE

wrote in message
oups.com...
1. does the pilot divulge to FAA said childhood murmur?
2. if so, to whom? AME? Oklahoma City?

There's no obligation to do so before the next AME exam.

3. does he wait until next exam (couple of years) or do so now?
4. If going to divulge, should he go get fancy/expensive tests *first*
or let FAA or AME ask for said tests?

If the condition only occurred during infancy, the pilot might well forget
about it again by the time of his next exam. You're only required to report
what you remember.

--Gary

Congrats Mort... thats my first mispelling someone has kicked back on me
in over a year.


Thanks for playing.
Dave

Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
Dave S wrote:

Keep in mind I am not an AME nor a cardiologist, just an ICU and ER
nurse who deals with lots of cardiac patients.



Then you should look at the subject line to see how the word is spelled. I hope
you don't write "murmer" on charts.

Dave S wrote:
Congrats Mort... thats my first mispelling someone has kicked back on me
in over a year.


Thanks for playing.


We ame to pleeze.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

VE

"Gary Drescher" wrote in message
...
If the condition only occurred during infancy, the pilot might well forget
about it again by the time of his next exam. You're only required to
report what you remember.

That's an interesting take on the regulations. Where'd you get that from?

As far as I know, you're required to report everything. If you can't
remember, you'd better keep records. As I get older the "have you ever..."
checkboxes are getting filled up, with a lot of them being "previously
reported". I keep my copy of the previous application so I don't miss
anything (thankfully the medical form includes a carbon copy for the
application now).

If you can cite the rule that says you only have to report what you
remember, sure would save me a lot of trouble.

Pete

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...
"Gary Drescher" wrote in message
...
If the condition only occurred during infancy, the pilot might well
forget about it again by the time of his next exam. You're only required
to report what you remember.

That's an interesting take on the regulations. Where'd you get that from?

As far as I know, you're required to report everything. If you can't
remember, you'd better keep records. As I get older the "have you
ever..." checkboxes are getting filled up, with a lot of them being
"previously reported". I keep my copy of the previous application so I
don't miss anything (thankfully the medical form includes a carbon copy
for the application now).

If you can cite the rule that says you only have to report what you
remember, sure would save me a lot of trouble.

Pete

The bottom of the form says, "... are true to the best of my knowledge..."
so he was OK until he was reminded of the problem.

I think I have an idea for a T-Shirt for pilots to where to family
gatherings.

"Feel free to tell me how cute I was as a baby just not how sick I was."

wrote:

1. does the pilot divulge to FAA said childhood murmur?

I would not do so.

The first time your friend filled out the form, there were a bunch of questions
that he answered. Truthfully, as far as he knew. He signed a statement to the
effect that they were true as far as he knew. From this point on, the AME asks
about changes to existing conditions or new conditions that have come up. You
friend can truthfully report those. The fact that he's now been told of an old
condition that seems to have disappeared doesn't change any existing conditions
or change the fact that he told the truth as far as he knew at the time.

In addition, there is one case of which I've read in which a pilot had his
certificate suspended for "falsifying an entry" in his logbook. He was up for
examination for a new rating, the examiner told him that he couldn't record the
time detailed in the entry for some reason, so he changed the entry in the
presence of the examiner. It was stated at the hearing that he would not have
been violated if he had refused to change the entry.

This situation might or might not get handled similarly, but I think it is
indicative of the way the FAA thinks on these matters. Saying "whoops! I forgot
about this one" might get your friend prosecuted for perjury on the original form.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.