Why no Cannons on Police Helicopters?

"Paul F Austin" wrote in
news

"Ragnar" wrote

"Mutts" wrote ...

Wouldnt a cannon on a police helicopter solve a lot of
problems for law enforcement?

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least an
M-60
on
the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases real quick.

That sounds about right. If the police are going to use armed helos,
they need sufficient firepower. I would want at_least_an M60 turret
welded on the bottom of each one. Maybe an M1 turret would be better.
Or two. Can't have enough firepower.



Are you suggesting an AC-130 gunship??? 8-)

Maybe they could make a V-22 into a civilian AC-130.(Airwolf???)
Hover and shoot the crap out of fleeing autos,no more hi-speed chases.
They would only have to do it once or twice and televise the gun camera
video,the crooks would get the idea.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 14:55:05 +0000 (UTC), Jim Yanik
wrote:

"Paul F Austin" wrote in
news

"Ragnar" wrote

"Mutts" wrote ...

Wouldnt a cannon on a police helicopter solve a lot of
problems for law enforcement?

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least an
M-60
on
the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases real quick.

That sounds about right. If the police are going to use armed helos,
they need sufficient firepower. I would want at_least_an M60 turret
welded on the bottom of each one. Maybe an M1 turret would be better.
Or two. Can't have enough firepower.



Are you suggesting an AC-130 gunship??? 8-)

Maybe they could make a V-22 into a civilian AC-130.(Airwolf???)
Hover and shoot the crap out of fleeing autos,no more hi-speed chases.
They would only have to do it once or twice and televise the gun camera
video,the crooks would get the idea.


Now yer talkin' Blue Thunder

"Jim Yanik" wrote in message
.. .
"Paul F Austin" wrote in
news

"Ragnar" wrote

"Mutts" wrote ...

Wouldnt a cannon on a police helicopter solve a lot of
problems for law enforcement?

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least an
M-60
on
the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases real quick.

That sounds about right. If the police are going to use armed helos,
they need sufficient firepower. I would want at_least_an M60 turret
welded on the bottom of each one. Maybe an M1 turret would be better.
Or two. Can't have enough firepower.



Are you suggesting an AC-130 gunship??? 8-)

No, I'm suggesting that armed police helos should be "armed" to the point
that they can't get wheels up. I don't trust police with automatic weapons
much less anything heavier.

"Paul F Austin" wrote in
:


"Jim Yanik" wrote in message
.. .
"Paul F Austin" wrote in
news

"Ragnar" wrote

"Mutts" wrote ...

Wouldnt a cannon on a police helicopter solve a lot of
problems for law enforcement?

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least
an M-60
on
the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases real
quick.

That sounds about right. If the police are going to use armed
helos, they need sufficient firepower. I would want at_least_an M60
turret welded on the bottom of each one. Maybe an M1 turret would
be better. Or two. Can't have enough firepower.



Are you suggesting an AC-130 gunship??? 8-)

No, I'm suggesting that armed police helos should be "armed" to the
point that they can't get wheels up. I don't trust police with
automatic weapons much less anything heavier.




Why,has there been any significant number of wrongful shootings involving
automatic weapons fire from police?
(and Waco was not police,it was ATF-troop)
ISTR that many non-US countries police are armed with automatic
weapons,too.Maybe they have more problems in that area?

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

In article ,
on Sun, 18 Apr 2004 08:12:51 -0400,
Paul F Austin attempted to say .....


"Ragnar" wrote

"Mutts" wrote ...

Wouldnt a cannon on a police helicopter solve a lot of
problems for law enforcement?

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least an M-60
on
the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases real quick.

That sounds about right. If the police are going to use armed helos, they
need sufficient firepower. I would want at_least_an M60 turret welded on the
bottom of each one. Maybe an M1 turret would be better. Or two. Can't have
enough firepower.


This concept will require much study and then a good number of prototypes.

I estimate we could field helicopters suitably modified in 8 to 12 years if
I had a budget of 32M a year.....
That's purely for R&D, production costs not included...

--
When dealing with propaganda terminology one sometimes always speaks in
variable absolutes. This is not to be mistaken for an unbiased slant.

"Ragnar" wrote in
:


"Mutts" wrote in message
...

Wouldnt a cannon on a police helicopter solve a lot of
problems for law enforcement?

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least an
M-60 on the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases real
quick.




Or they could use a Barrett light 50 M82A1 .50BMG rifle.
If they can't get a car with 10 rounds....

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

Let's thezm use Apache, and everything will be clear...

Jim Yanik wrote:
"Ragnar" wrote in
:

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least an
M-60 on the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases real
quick.

Or they could use a Barrett light 50 M82A1 .50BMG rifle.
If they can't get a car with 10 rounds....

The US Coast Guard--which occupies a grey zone between law enforcement and
military--has begun arming some helicopters to stop fleeing high-speed
boats. Their approach has been to use a machinegun for warning shots,
followed by a hand-held .50-cal rifle to shoot to disable the engines.

However, this does not translate well to regular police use. The USCG is
dealing with isolated targets on the high seas, with no chance of stray
shots hitting civilians. The rules for stopping smugglers at sea are also
less restrictive than the use of force rules for domestic police forces.
This is one area where the Coasties benefit from their semi-military status.

For comparison, civilian law enforcement offficers are usually *forbidden*
to fire warning shots because of the risk to bystanders. They are also
forbidden to use lethal force unless necessary to protect themselves or a
bystander. "He was getting away" is generally not sufficient justification
for shooting at someone, unless you have reason to believe he's going to
threaten another person once he's out of sight.

--
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be kept right, when
wrong to be put right." - Senator Carl Schurz, 1872

"Thomas Schoene" wrote in
hlink.net:

Jim Yanik wrote:
"Ragnar" wrote in
:

Excellent question! I've always thought they should put at least an
M-60 on the police choppers. Would put a stop to the car chases
real quick.

Or they could use a Barrett light 50 M82A1 .50BMG rifle.
If they can't get a car with 10 rounds....

The US Coast Guard--which occupies a grey zone between law enforcement
and military--has begun arming some helicopters to stop fleeing
high-speed boats. Their approach has been to use a machinegun for
warning shots, followed by a hand-held .50-cal rifle to shoot to
disable the engines.

However, this does not translate well to regular police use. The USCG
is dealing with isolated targets on the high seas, with no chance of
stray shots hitting civilians. The rules for stopping smugglers at
sea are also less restrictive than the use of force rules for domestic
police forces. This is one area where the Coasties benefit from their
semi-military status.

For comparison, civilian law enforcement offficers are usually
*forbidden* to fire warning shots because of the risk to bystanders.
They are also forbidden to use lethal force unless necessary to
protect themselves or a bystander. "He was getting away" is generally
not sufficient justification for shooting at someone, unless you have
reason to believe he's going to threaten another person once he's out
of sight.

--
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be kept right, when
wrong to be put right." - Senator Carl Schurz, 1872



Shooting into an auto's engine would not be use of deadly force against the
occupants. I read an article about the CG,that they use a BOLT-action
..50cal against the hi-speed boats,so,they only get ONE shot at the
boat,unless they reload,which takes a relatively large amount of time.
I suspect they are accurate with that first single shot.

Besides,a hi-speed vehicle chase certainly IS a threat to other citizens
lives;frequently people die or get severely injured because of collisions
with fleeing vehicles.And that doens't consider property damage,either.

Also,the shot fired from a helicopter would be headed sharply DOWNwards,and
would most likely penetrate pavement if it missed the vehicle.I doubt it
would ricochet.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

"Mutts" wrote in message
...

Wouldnt a cannon on a police helicopter solve a lot of
problems for law enforcement?

Is it possible to put a round right through the engine block
of a suspect fleeing and stop them from killing innocents?
Seems like that kind of accuracy is possible now isnt it?

When those guys were robbing the bank in LA, seems like
it would have been an easy shot to make from a helicopter
even without a cannon.

Whats up? public outcry or something?

Discharging a firearm toward another is considered deadly force. The use of
deadly force is very restricted, and understandably so. Simple traffic
violations have never been considered to justify the use of deadly force.

Regarding the bank robbery, the use of deadly force from a helicopter might
have been justified, but the circumstances might not have been conducive to
its use. Too great a chance of injuring a bystander, for example. I
certainly don't have enough knowledge of that particular event, but I have a
feeling that just about every alternative was being considered.

The use of a cannon by police would be entirely too risky.

On the other hand, there were times when I would have welcomed a chance to
call in an air strike. grin

Don H.