Airplane prices are ridiculous, Pt.2

Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

A private pilot by definition is flying for fun.

He can fly for business purposes, within narrow limits. But if he flies for
business, he'll need an instrument rating, or he'll have to accept that he may
not be able to profit from the airplane as often as he'd like.

Very narrow limits or he needs a commercial certificate.

And as far as an instrument rating goes, it depends heavily on where you
are.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

wrote in message
news
sambodidley wrote:

wrote in message
...
lucky lindy wrote:

wrote
I guess it's okay for people flying for fun, particularly if they
cannot
pass
a medical.


Exactly! That's what I'd be doing too, if I could afford it. Isn't
that
the whole idea of the Sport Pilot certificate. Why else would someone
with
a PPL want to restrict himself with a LSA? The good old days when
almost
any airport had a couple of stick-and-rudder tail draggers around for
rental
are long gone. Recreation flying has become out of reach for many.
But
what the hell, I can't afford a Beemer, either. grin

How would a private pilot be restricted by flying a LSA?


Jim Pennino

A private pilot without a medical or the hopes of ever having another one
would be restricted to the Sport Pilot limits in a LSA. But that is all
moot anyhow if he can't afford the LSA.

And those limits would be?

Keep in mind if you have a private, you already have all the Sport Pilot
optional training.


--
Jim Pennino

Jim,
See my reply to Mxsmanic. The limits are explained in Part 61
concerning using a drivers license for a medical. If you have a private
pilot certificate AND a current medical certificate then there are no
restrictions on you for flying a LSA with the same ratings covered by the
ratings on your private pilot certificate. (Mine are Single Engine Land) If
you have no current medical certificate and are using your drivers license
then you are restricted to the same limits as a Sport Pilot while flying a
LSA.

On Sep 11, 9:45*pm, wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

A private pilot by definition is flying for fun.

He can fly for business purposes, within narrow limits. But if he flies for
business, he'll need an instrument rating, or he'll have to accept that he may
not be able to profit from the airplane as often as he'd like.

Very narrow limits or he needs a commercial certificate.

And as far as an instrument rating goes, it depends heavily on where you
are.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

Do tell me about your perception of narrow limits. Use of a general
aviation airplane for business purposes is pretty much like the use of
a car for business purposes. If your point is, I may not use the
airplane as a for pay taxi, you're quite right. I can't use my car for
that purpose either, I don't have a commercial driving license, nor a
commercial pilot's license, but use both my airplane and my car to
advance my interests. I don't consider those to be 'narrow'
limitations. I suspect most complex singles you see at tower
controlled airports with decent instrument approaches are used as I
use mine. Airplanes based at other airports may conform to your idea
of recreational flying, they bore holes in the sky in in non-
instrument meteorological conditions and don't need the ability to go
somewhere when conditions fall below VFR criteria but are above our
own minimums for IFR.

writes:

Very narrow limits or he needs a commercial certificate.

If he's just flying to, say, go to meetings or visit clients, that shouldn't
be a problem. It's like driving a car, only somewhat faster and dramatically
more costly and awkward.

It is true, though, that the FAA has a really broad definition of commercial
flying. And I shudder to think what the IRS rules say.

And as far as an instrument rating goes, it depends heavily on where you
are.

Mmm, yes. I like to fly in SoCal and Arizona, where the weather is usually
good--although just moments ago I almost ended a VFR flight in tragedy when
the weather at LAX turned out to be terrible. (This was in my sim, of course,
which I'm sure you'll dismiss without any thought.) I have a (virtual)
instrument rating and my (virtual) Baron is well equipped for IFR, but I
couldn't land under those conditions. After fumbling around a bit while ATC
patiently waited for me to get a grip, I diverted to Van Nuys, where the
weather was fine. When the weather improves I'll reposition that Baron to LAX.

sambodidley wrote:

wrote in message
news
sambodidley wrote:

wrote in message
...
lucky lindy wrote:

wrote
I guess it's okay for people flying for fun, particularly if they
cannot
pass
a medical.


Exactly! That's what I'd be doing too, if I could afford it. Isn't
that
the whole idea of the Sport Pilot certificate. Why else would someone
with
a PPL want to restrict himself with a LSA? The good old days when
almost
any airport had a couple of stick-and-rudder tail draggers around for
rental
are long gone. Recreation flying has become out of reach for many.
But
what the hell, I can't afford a Beemer, either. grin

How would a private pilot be restricted by flying a LSA?


Jim Pennino

A private pilot without a medical or the hopes of ever having another one
would be restricted to the Sport Pilot limits in a LSA. But that is all
moot anyhow if he can't afford the LSA.

And those limits would be?

Keep in mind if you have a private, you already have all the Sport Pilot
optional training.


--
Jim Pennino

Jim,
See my reply to Mxsmanic. The limits are explained in Part 61
concerning using a drivers license for a medical. If you have a private
pilot certificate AND a current medical certificate then there are no
restrictions on you for flying a LSA with the same ratings covered by the
ratings on your private pilot certificate. (Mine are Single Engine Land) If
you have no current medical certificate and are using your drivers license
then you are restricted to the same limits as a Sport Pilot while flying a
LSA.

Almost correct; you are restricted to the same limits as a sport pilot who
has all the additional optional training.

The net result if you do not have a current medical:

You can not fly at night, above 10,000 feet, tow, fly IFR, or fly outside of
the USA.




--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

a wrote:
On Sep 11, 9:45Â*pm, wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

A private pilot by definition is flying for fun.

He can fly for business purposes, within narrow limits. But if he flies for
business, he'll need an instrument rating, or he'll have to accept that he may
not be able to profit from the airplane as often as he'd like.

Very narrow limits or he needs a commercial certificate.

And as far as an instrument rating goes, it depends heavily on where you
are.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

Do tell me about your perception of narrow limits. Use of a general
aviation airplane for business purposes is pretty much like the use of
a car for business purposes.

Nope.

I used to think that.

There is a long series of articles on the subject on the AOPA web site by
the resident AOPA lawyer.

I would suggest you read them.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

"sambodidley" wrote:
Affordable rentals are no longer available and haven't been in
decades.

What is your definition of affordable rental?

Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

Very narrow limits or he needs a commercial certificate.

If he's just flying to, say, go to meetings or visit clients, that shouldn't
be a problem. It's like driving a car, only somewhat faster and dramatically
more costly and awkward.

Nope, not with a private cerificate.

One would think it would be like driving a car, but it is not.


It is true, though, that the FAA has a really broad definition of commercial
flying. And I shudder to think what the IRS rules say.

And therein lies the rub.



--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

"Jim Logajan" wrote in message
.. .
"sambodidley" wrote:
Affordable rentals are no longer available and haven't been in
decades.

What is your definition of affordable rental?

Simple. What *I* can afford. YMMV

wrote in message
...
sambodidley wrote:

wrote in message
news
sambodidley wrote:

wrote in message
...
lucky lindy wrote:

wrote
I guess it's okay for people flying for fun, particularly if they
cannot
pass
a medical.


Exactly! That's what I'd be doing too, if I could afford it. Isn't
that
the whole idea of the Sport Pilot certificate. Why else would
someone
with
a PPL want to restrict himself with a LSA? The good old days when
almost
any airport had a couple of stick-and-rudder tail draggers around for
rental
are long gone. Recreation flying has become out of reach for many.
But
what the hell, I can't afford a Beemer, either. grin

How would a private pilot be restricted by flying a LSA?


Jim Pennino

A private pilot without a medical or the hopes of ever having another
one
would be restricted to the Sport Pilot limits in a LSA. But that is
all
moot anyhow if he can't afford the LSA.

And those limits would be?

Keep in mind if you have a private, you already have all the Sport Pilot
optional training.


--
Jim Pennino

Jim,
See my reply to Mxsmanic. The limits are explained in Part 61
concerning using a drivers license for a medical. If you have a private
pilot certificate AND a current medical certificate then there are no
restrictions on you for flying a LSA with the same ratings covered by the
ratings on your private pilot certificate. (Mine are Single Engine Land)
If
you have no current medical certificate and are using your drivers
license
then you are restricted to the same limits as a Sport Pilot while flying
a
LSA.

Almost correct; you are restricted to the same limits as a sport pilot who
has all the additional optional training.

The net result if you do not have a current medical:

You can not fly at night, above 10,000 feet, tow, fly IFR, or fly outside
of
the USA.




--
Jim Pennino

Granted. But all of that is of little use if I still can't afford to use
those privileges. At one time I could, but that is no longer practical.
To begin with, I live in a rural area and the nearest airport with any kind
of rentals is over 100 mile away. Even those have few or no LSA rentals.
Man, I came from the era back when every podunk town with a little grass
strip airport had a few tandem tail draggers for rent. That scene has
vanished from the earth. Recreation flying as I knew it doesn't exist any
longer. I'm not saying that is a bad thing. It's just different now and it
left me behind when it changed.