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#11
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On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 18:34:17 GMT, Jose
wrote: d. Aircraft classified as "high altitude" (service ceiling above 25,000' MSL) need an ..... New one on me. If the airplane is capable of high altitude, you need an endorsement even if you only ground-hop it? Got a reg # I could look up? Perhaps 61.31(g)? "(g) Additional training required for operating pressurized aircraft capable of operating at high altitudes. (1) Except as provided in paragraph (g)(3) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of a pressurized aircraft (an aircraft that has a service ceiling or maximum operating altitude, whichever is lower, above 25,000 feet MSL), unless that person has received and logged ground training from an authorized instructor and obtained an endorsement in the person's logbook or training record from an authorized instructor who certifies the person has satisfactorily accomplished the ground training." A strict reading of "operating pressurized aircraft capable" would not be limiting to in-flight operation of said aircraft. |
#12
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On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 19:28:16 GMT, Jose
wrote: d. Aircraft classified as "high altitude" (service ceiling above 25,000' MSL) need an ..... New one on me. If the airplane is capable of high altitude, you need an endorsement even if you only ground-hop it? Got a reg # I could look up? Never mind, I found it. "pressurized". Hmm... Missed that too, but are there many (any?) non-pressurized airframes that have service ceilings above FL250? |
#13
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Slick wrote:
I've only ever flown Cessna products and I've come across an area I'm not sure about. I have my private and I have flow 150/2 and 172's since I starting my training. Now I might partner up with a guy in a Tomahawk next weekend for a tour across the state. I don't have any formal training in any Piper products, will I be allowed to log any stick time? For the time that you are the "sole manipulator of the controls", you can log PIC, your friend can not log PIC (or SIC) even though he presumably is acting as PIC. I don't recall exactly how the regs layout type certification. Do I have to be signed off and have logged instruction to be PIC in the Tomahawk? No. Also if I only had time in a 150, would I have to have instruction in a 152 before I could log PIC? No, but it's probably a good idea. One last question, If I fly simulated instrument with a safety pilot, does the safety pilot have to sign my logbook? Thanks to everyone for your help and response. No. BTW: If you are (acting as) PIC, then you log PIC, your friend logs SIC. If your friend is (acting as) PIC, you both log PIC. Hilton |
#14
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ok.. so I left the word "log" out
"Jose" wrote in message m... any time you are flying with hands on stick, with or without the hood, you are PIC, any time you are under the hood, he may log PIC (acting pic) even though he may never touch the stick. Not quite. You -are- PIC when you are the final authority on the conduct of the flight (and are so qualified). You -may- -log- PIC if you are appropriately rated and are sole manipulator (your hands unaided on the stick). Yes, two people can -log- PIC, but only one can -be- PIC. Jose -- Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane. for Email, make the obvious change in the address. |
#15
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"Slick" wrote in message ... I've only ever flown Cessna products and I've come across an area I'm not sure about. I have my private and I have flow 150/2 and 172's since I starting my training. Now I might partner up with a guy in a Tomahawk next weekend for a tour across the state. I don't have any formal training in any Piper products, will I be allowed to log any stick time? I don't recall exactly how the regs layout type certification. Do I have to be signed off and have logged instruction to be PIC in the Tomahawk? Also if I only had time in a 150, would I have to have instruction in a 152 before I could log PIC? One last question, If I fly simulated instrument with a safety pilot, does the safety pilot have to sign my logbook? Thanks to everyone for your help and response. On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:09:33 -0700, "BTIZ" wrote in Z4Oce.113$fI.16@fed1read05:: No Dumb Questions.. just hard to interpret Regs.. You are qualified for Airplane Single Engine Land... a Tomahawk is an Airplane Single Engine Land.. With the exception of those aircraft that require the pilot to have a Type Rating, airmen holding a private ASEL certificate may act as PIC of any aircraft certified in that category and class. any time you have hands on stick.. that is PIC.. All time spent as sole manipulator of the controls is logable as PIC time. PIC time is also logable by the pilot who is acting as the responsible PIC, IINM. as far as the FAA is concerned.. you don't need a specific sign off.. Other than for those aircraft that require a Type Rating. the insurance companies or rental FBO may have other ideas... specific make and model sign offs are insurance company requirements.. If you are under the hood and have a rated pilot acting as a safety pilot, then all you need is his name.. any time you are flying with hands on stick, with or without the hood, you are PIC, any time you are under the hood, he may log PIC (acting pic) even though he may never touch the stick. I believe the safety pilot usually logs SIC time in that situation, but it would depend on who the pilots agreed would be responsible for the flight. I copied this out of a magazine several years ago when I was often flying with another pilot: Cockpit Resource Management CRM is the effective use of all resources - hardware, software, leadership, and humanware - to achieve safe and efficient flight operation. Don't divide duties as they are on most airlines. There, the pilot becomes too dependent on a copilot, because the pilot simply flys the aircraft, while the copilot does everything else - radios, navigation, checklists, and backing up the pilot as to proper altitudes and headings. The CRM philosophy puts the onus on the pilot for communications, checklists, and decision making. Decisions are based on the concerns of the less comfortable pilot. The copilot handles navigation, cross-checks the pilot's communication and navigation frequencies for an instrument approach, and assures that the altitude requirements are met at the final approach fix and at minimums. The copilot still has plenty to do, managing the aircraft's loran, RNAV radio, or handheld GPS moving map display that is used as a backup. In addition, the copilot scans for other traffic, keeps a running check on fields in which to land - just in case - and keeps track of the nearest airport. The copilot knows s/he is to support and backup the pilot and offer help in emergency situations. Pre-takeoff briefing is important for any flight; it can be abbreviated, however, when another pilot is aboard. It can be as simple as thinking out loud. If you expect the other pilot to help with the flight, say so before takeoff. Spend several minutes before the flight explaining to the non-pilot passenger how to control the aircraft and how to communicate. Once in the air, spend a few minutes letting the passenger fly. It is fun for the passenger and gives the pilot another resource to use in case of a medical emergency. |
#16
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On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 18:34:17 GMT, Jose
wrote in :: Got a reg # I could look up? http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text...0.1.3.10.4.7.2 § 91.1083 Crewmember emergency training |
#17
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That doesn't happen to be true. Care to quote your FAR reference for two
people logging PIC at the same time? Jim You -are- PIC when you are the final authority on the conduct of the flight (and are so qualified). You -may- -log- PIC if you are appropriately rated and are sole manipulator (your hands unaided on the stick). Yes, two people can -log- PIC, but only one can -be- PIC. |
#18
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What the hell is wrong with the reg that I referenced in my original post?
Jim \ New one on me. If the airplane is capable of high altitude, you need an endorsement even if you only ground-hop it? Got a reg # I could look up? |
#19
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You left out and inserted a potful more that was absolutel garbage.
Jim "BTIZ" wrote in message news:wZTce.164$fI.40@fed1read05... ok.. so I left the word "log" out |
#20
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RST Engineering wrote:
That doesn't happen to be true. Care to quote your FAR reference for two people logging PIC at the same time? There's an article on the AOPA web site (accessible to members only, I believe) that covers this topic: http://www.aopa.org/members/files/topics/pic.html FAR 61.51(e) describes who can log PIC time. In the case of a simulated instrument flight, both the pilot under-the-hood (sole manipulator of the controls) and the safety pilot (required crewmember on a flight requiring more than one pilot, such as a simulated instrument flight) can log PIC at the same time. Charles. -N8385U |
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