Anti-collision mechanism

Ram, if I recall that incident correctly, ATC had repeatedly requested a
heading change and direction of turn (don't recall actual numbers) but the
flight crew repeatedly read back incorrectly. In the end the controller
deferred to the "obviously" more experienced and knowledgeable captain - and
gave in...

With respect to the capability of TCAS - it only interrogates the
transponders of nearby airplanes. It then figures out their distance away,
bearing and delta altitude (assuming a mode C or S transponder). It will
give a Resolution Advisory (Climb or Descend) instruction. It does not give
any terrain warning.

Anthony Quick

"Ramapriya" wrote in message
ups.com...
Bob, guess I didn't frame the Q properly enough.
While I knew about the GPWS and TCAS individually, I wasn't sure
whether TCAS was equipped to deal with purely traffic or whether
accidental straying into terrain would also be taken care of.
I'm asking this because I remember an incident of many years ago where
an idiot in the ATC asked an Indonesian aircraft to turn 'left' when he
had to say 'right' and the unsuspecting blokes ran into a mountain. I
was wondering if that kinduva incident can be avoided with the TCAS...

Cheers,

Ramapriya


Bob Moore wrote:
"Ramapriya" wrote

Does this get activated only when there's an aircraft in the
dangerous
vicinity or will it also trigger if the aircraft is hurtling
towards
some terrain such as a hill?

In my generation of aircraft, (B-727) they are two different systems.
First came the GPWS (Ground Proximity Warning System) and then some
time later came the TCAS (Traffic Alert and Collision Advoidance
System).

And does every aircraft have this system these days, regardless of
size?

No, only passenger jets are required to have them.

Bob Moore

"AnthonyQ" wrote in message It does not give any terrain warning.

In the US, starting this quarter, all turbine powered equipment with six
passenger seats or more will be required to have Terrain Awareness Warning
Systems (TAWS) installed. This equipment is required on private as well as
commercial equipment, freight or passenger, jet or turboprop. TAWS uses GPS
positioning compared against topographic mapping to determine if a threat
exists. A screen shows the mountains near you. Red is bad. Green is okay.
This equipment would have been helpful in the incident Ram is asking about.

D.

AnthonyQ opined

Ram, if I recall that incident correctly, ATC had repeatedly requested a
heading change and direction of turn (don't recall actual numbers) but the
flight crew repeatedly read back incorrectly. In the end the controller
deferred to the "obviously" more experienced and knowledgeable captain - and
gave in...

With respect to the capability of TCAS - it only interrogates the
transponders of nearby airplanes. It then figures out their distance away,
bearing and delta altitude (assuming a mode C or S transponder). It will
give a Resolution Advisory (Climb or Descend) instruction. It does not give
any terrain warning.

Maybe if we put mode C Transponders on every mountain top... And radio tower
for that matter.

"Ramapriya" wrote in message
oups.com...
Bob, guess I didn't frame the Q properly enough.
While I knew about the GPWS and TCAS individually, I wasn't sure
whether TCAS was equipped to deal with purely traffic or whether
accidental straying into terrain would also be taken care of.
I'm asking this because I remember an incident of many years ago where
an idiot in the ATC asked an Indonesian aircraft to turn 'left' when he
had to say 'right' and the unsuspecting blokes ran into a mountain. I
was wondering if that kinduva incident can be avoided with the TCAS...

Cheers,

Ramapriya


Bob Moore wrote:
"Ramapriya" wrote

Does this get activated only when there's an aircraft in the
dangerous
vicinity or will it also trigger if the aircraft is hurtling
towards
some terrain such as a hill?

In my generation of aircraft, (B-727) they are two different systems.
First came the GPWS (Ground Proximity Warning System) and then some
time later came the TCAS (Traffic Alert and Collision Advoidance
System).

And does every aircraft have this system these days, regardless of
size?

No, only passenger jets are required to have them.

Bob Moore





-ash
Cthulhu in 2005!
Why wait for nature?

"Ash Wyllie" wrote in message
...
AnthonyQ opined

Ram, if I recall that incident correctly, ATC had repeatedly requested a
heading change and direction of turn (don't recall actual numbers) but
the
flight crew repeatedly read back incorrectly. In the end the controller
deferred to the "obviously" more experienced and knowledgeable captain -
and
gave in...

With respect to the capability of TCAS - it only interrogates the
transponders of nearby airplanes. It then figures out their distance
away,
bearing and delta altitude (assuming a mode C or S transponder). It will
give a Resolution Advisory (Climb or Descend) instruction. It does not
give
any terrain warning.

Maybe if we put mode C Transponders on every mountain top... And radio
tower
for that matter.


Ummm...doesn't TAWS read a map database that holds such obstructions?


--
Matt
---------------------
Matthew W. Barrow
Site-Fill Homes, LLC.
Montrose, CO

"Ash Wyllie" wrote in
:

Maybe if we put mode C Transponders on every mountain top... And radio
tower for that matter.

Actually, that proposal was not too far off the mark. One suggestion for
ADS-B is to do just that - put a "squirter" (transmit only) on tall
antennas and other non-obvious obstructions. Total cost in parts is about
$30 (plus the money for FAA/FCC certification G). Operating power is
very low, so the long term cost to the operator of a tall transmitting
tower should be much less than the current required strobe light.

jmk

"Ramapriya" wrote in message
oups.com...
Does this get activated only when there's an aircraft in the dangerous
vicinity or will it also trigger if the aircraft is hurtling towards
some terrain such as a hill?


You are really talking about two types of systems here. One is for traffic
avoidance, which projects the path of yours and other aircraft and lets you
know if there is a conflict. Some of these systems depict all the aircraft
in the area, along with their direction and altitude, on a moving map.

Terrain avoidance systems warn you of terrain.

And does every aircraft have this system these days, regardless of
size?


No. The systems are very expensive and are typically not found on small
aircraft. However, more of the newer planes do have these systems,
especially the newer glass cockpit displays. There are even some handheld
devices that perform somewhat the same function with more or less
effectiveness. None of them substitute in small planes for a good set of
eyes looking out of the cockpit.

For one thing, traffic avoidance systems usually depend on other aircraft
having transponders, but some people don't turn their transponders on and
some aircraft have no transponders at all.

Bob,
To learn more -
http://www.honeywelltcas.com/
http://www.egpws.com/

Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usenet.com

I'm a fan of the Mark1 eyeball. It's generally a much undervalued
detector

On 1 Jan 2005 15:17:49 -0800, "george" wrotD:

I'm a fan of the Mark1 eyeball. It's generally a much undervalued
detector


Take a look at http://www.gulfstream.com/product_enhancement/evs/ and
tell me the bare eye is better. You'll need high speed for the video.

Also, since TCAS has been mandated, there has been only one mid-air
with equipped aircraft and it was because one crew ignored the
warning. (UPS and Aeroflot in Switzerland)

Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usenet.com

"Don Hammer" wrote in message
...
Also, since TCAS has been mandated, there has been only one mid-air
with equipped aircraft

How many mid-air collisions of commercial airliners not equipped have there
been? Before the mandate, of course (I assume after the mandate there
haven't been any commercial airliners not equipped, right?).

Pete