Air America breaking news: "USA to fingerprint ALL visitors !!!"

"AJC" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 07:55:44 -0600, "Quantum Foam Guy"
wrote:

"Oelewapper" wrote in message
...
Dear allies, welcome to the age of digital fascism... :

This is not "fascism", unless you're one of those morons who thinks
dealing
with the DMV and getting fingerprinted for a driver's license is
"fascism".

Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.

Most US states started fingerprinting people applying for drivers licenses
(one electronic thumb print scan) in the early 1990s. This happened during
the Clinton administration. Fancy that.

This is the same system the VISIT program will use. It's not inconvenient,
unless you think spending two seconds pressing your finger to a glass
surface is inconvenient. If you object to it due to your ethics and
principles, I respect your opinion. Enjoy your vacation in Australia or
elsewhere this summer. Just remember that this same process will soon be
used in other countries that are on the Islamicist hit lists. That's why
you're not hearing a big stink from European leaders about the program. They
will be monitoring US-VISIT to see how to best implement similar programs in
the near future. Doubt me? Watch and see what happens.

Personally, I'd be more concerned about my privacy in Europe with so much
closed-circuit television monitoring and the facial recognition technology
they use. Like this:
http://www.spy.org.uk/n-mandrake.htm

For those who fear Big Brother, that's a true sphincter-tingler. I certainly
don't care if EU customs people want to take my fingerprint at the airport
when it confirms my identity and proves to the local government that I'm not
a criminal. In fact, with the threat of terrorism we all face I would prefer
it if they did so. The ability to track my movements around the country once
I've arrived for no legitimate legal reason frightens me.

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 20:08:48 GMT, Chad Irby wrote:

In article ,
"Marie Lewis" wrote:

"Chad Irby" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Lennart Petersen" wrote:

99% ? Interesting. I transferred recently in 6 minutes from
International to domestic including security check. Was in
Sandefjord Norway. How many transfers international-domestic are
done in less 6 minutes in U.S?

You're taking a very unusual example (EU internal transfers), and
pretending that it's common worldwide.

Now, *that's* interesting.

Take a look at the previous post.

I did. It's even funnier. He's comparing a country that has less
international airline passengers per year than *Orlando*, which isn't
even in the top 5 international airports in the US...

Why are the lines longer to get into the US? Because more people *fly*
there. And, by the way, we're having a record year for tourism of all
types...

So how do you explain Heathrow, one of the busiest airports in the
wolrd (in the top 5 IIRC), and which has significantly shorter lines
than any US airport I've eneterd the US at (7 so far and counting)?
---
Peter Kemp

Life is short - drink faster

In nobody wrote:

That is why, if you are going to leave personal information with a
government, you must have trust that the government will not misuse that
information. The current USA regime has broken that trust because it has
misused the information.

As did the one before it, and the one before that, and the one before that
and ...

As will the one that follows it.

--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN

"James Robinson" wrote in message
...
Quantum Foam Guy wrote:

Oelewapper wrote:

Dear allies, welcome to the age of digital fascism... :

This is not "fascism", unless you're one of those morons who thinks
dealing
with the DMV and getting fingerprinted for a driver's license is
"fascism".

I do consider it fascism. I also have never had my fingerprints taken
for a driver's license in the US.

Do you consider Jerry Brown to be a fascist? California started DL
fingerprinting in 1977 and it became mandatory in 1982. How about Bill
Clinton? Is he a fascist? Mr. Clinton signed the Immigration Reform Act of
1996 which encourages states to collect fingerprints when issuing drivers
licenses. Besides California, Colorado, Georgia, Hawaii, Texas, and West
Virginia all collect fingerprints. There may be others considering the list
I just read is a few years old. Almost all states require your Social
Security number (which is what I find most objectionable since it it's not
meant to be a national ID number) and digital photo for their databases
before you can get a DL. Almost all drivers licenses now are machine
readable with information stored on a magnetic strip. Considering everything
else they have been collecting about you for decades, a fingerprint is
hardly evidence of "fascism".

I just remembered that when my kids were born the hospital took hand prints
and foot prints for the birth certificate that was filed with the county. Is
that fascism in your mind?

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 15:48:59 -0400, nobody wrote:

Alan Pollock wrote:
Seriously, driver's licenses are used as ID in the US.

You know, I am amazed at the transformation of the USA. In the past, the mere
mention of a national identity card would make the republicans rabid,
professing that such a card would infringe on the rights of freedom and
liberty (etc etc).

It is interesting that those very same people today are calling anyone who is
against the current regime's measures "unpatriotic" even those measures
actually do infronge on many of the basic principles of the USA (right to fair
trial, innocent until proven guilty etc).


Patriotism can be a great force for good and bad. Throughout history
extremists on the left and the right have used it to their advantage.
--==++AJC++==--

In article ,
"Sjoerd" wrote:

You claimed that US customs ( I believe you mean immigration) is faster than
"99% of the countries in the world". I have been to 75 countries and the US
is amongst the 10 countries with the longest/slowest lines for immigration
and customs.

Is this because the process for each person is long, or because of the
relative number of people coming in at a time?

When you're flying in on a hundred-seat airliner and there's four guys
working the desk, you're going to get through faster than if you're on
one of four 747-400s landing in the same hour...

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 16:05:18 -0400, nobody wrote:

But if a government captures your own body's information (fingerprints, DNA,
eye retina scan etc), then they "own" part of your body/identity.

So since they have my address, they "own" my house?

--
-BB-
To reply to me, drop the attitude (from my e-mail address, at least)

In article , nobody
wrote:

Brian wrote:
So how can we identify a person other than fingerprints? Passports,
DLs, and every other form of ID have been no problem to duplicate
for terrorists.

And just how will the usa verify your fingerprints ?

By comparing them to known terrorists. Pretty simple, really. They can
fake IDs (or get them issued "officially" from many countries), but it's
a bit harder to fake fingerprints.

If you're a foreigner who has never been to the USA, your
fingerprints will be "virgin".

Not so. We have a lot of records of known bad guys from other sources.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

In article ,
Peter Kemp wrote:

Oh, and defending your home is not illegal, the emphasis in the UK is
defending your *life*, and to use reasonable force (where reasonable
force does *not*include waiting for burglars with an illegally held
shorgun, then shooting one of them in the back).

....in the dark, in the wee hours of the morning, in a remote area, when
the police wouldn't do much of anything...

Nice of you folks to protect violent burglars like that (look at the
wonderful followups of what the "victimized" burglar has done since).

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

In article ,
Peter Kemp wrote:

So how do you explain Heathrow, one of the busiest airports in the
wolrd (in the top 5 IIRC), and which has significantly shorter lines
than any US airport I've eneterd the US at (7 so far and counting)?

Many more bureaucrats working the incoming lines. Pretty simple, really.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.