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$75,000 2-33



 
 
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  #51  
Old March 12th 18, 12:24 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default $75,000 2-33

On Sunday, March 11, 2018 at 6:15:57 PM UTC-4, wrote:
Ever see any long winded threads with people on either side of the aisle debating the merits of an ASK21 with so many hating it with all their being? Of course not. That's because the K21 is what a standard training sailplane should be (in this century). 100k is cheap compared to the revenue lost and membership lost from US clubs and commercial operators forcing the old spam can on the unsuspecting public.


I don't know who you are or what your affiliations and experience are but I can tell you that my experiences differ a lot from your statements.
Have you written the check for an ASK-21 or are your committing other people's money?
I can toss this rock because I have written the check.
When someone steps onto the airport to try out our sport it is not the gliders that make the difference, it's the people flying the gliders. That is what captures them and that is what keeps them.
Our club does primary training in 2-33's. First single seater is a 1-26. Members also progress to 1-34 and ASK-21. The economics allow us to have many families and young people flying. I'm sure that would not be the case without our fleet mix.
UH
  #52  
Old March 12th 18, 12:30 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default $75,000 2-33

I admit to learning to fly in one with the old potato farmer in 69. Had to lift my leg to get full aileron, but it sure was cheap. Since then I have been ambivalent to them. my club, WVSC, had one and sold it because of almost zero useage.

But over the last few months a small group at Independence Airpark have been operating with a -33 and (gasp) a 2-22. But in that short time four kids under 18 have been soloed and one licensed. The others are waiting for a birthday to get a license and one young lady is starting soon, sponsored by an airpark neighbor.

We are starting a club based on those ships and a old towplane. First meeting was last week and 23 people said they would pay the entry fee just to keep this going.

None of this would have happened with glass. Give them a break, they still have a great use.

Bruce Patton
Independence Or.
Still flying my HP-18
  #53  
Old March 12th 18, 12:51 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default $75,000 2-33

On Sunday, March 11, 2018 at 7:03:30 PM UTC-4, son_of_flubber wrote:
On Sunday, March 11, 2018 at 6:16:05 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I could mow lawns during the week and be able to fly a 2-22 multiple times on the weekend on what I made pushing that lawn mower. There isn't a single glass based club running today that can make that happen.


You're right that times have changed. Kids don't fly on their grass cutting wages anymore, but here are some soaring clubs in the USA that have youth flying in glass trainers. Some of these programs combine 'line crew service' with flight lessons. In some cases these young pilots cut grass.

http://sugarbushsoaring.com/2017-fefy-day
http://sugarbushsoaring.com/doc/FEFY-Brochure.pdf

http://harrishillsoaring.org/junior-program-details/

https://www.soartruckee.org/youth-soaring.html

http://www.tidewatersoaring.org/scholarships.html

Harris Hill
Maybe wrong but I thought Sugarbush has a K&L 2-33 rebuild and a K&L rebuild 1-26. I know there are some pro Schweitzer folks up there. Your other examples of youth soaring programs are also heavy with Elmira iron.
'HHSC owns and operates 3 SGS2-33’s, numbers 1, 2, and 3. We rely on them as our primary training aircraft for new students and transitioning power pilots.'
Truckee's fleet:
Ride Glider 1 - Schweitzer SGS 2-32

Ride Glider 2 - Schweitzer SGS 2-32

Training/Rider Glider 1 - Schweitzer SGS 2-33

Training/Ride Glider 2 - Schweitzer SGS 2-33
TSS currently owns:
Schweizer 2-33A training glider
Blanik L-23 dual-place sailplane
PZL Swidnik PW-6 dual-place sailplane
Schweizer 1-26D single-place glider
PZL Bielsko PW-5 single-place sailplane.
  #54  
Old March 12th 18, 01:16 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
SF
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Default $75,000 2-33

I taught one student in a 2-33 because it was my bright idea to buy it to supplement our G1103 Acro. I hated the back seat, but it did teach me to slip to land. So far that skill set has saved me from my prior bad decisions in the pattern, twice. It may be a flying barn door, but it has a few things to teach. Not enough to bring 75K though.

SF
  #55  
Old March 12th 18, 01:33 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
son_of_flubber
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Default $75,000 2-33

I concur with Tom that a mix of re-manufactured SGS gliders and glass ships is ideal.

Where that is not possible, good condition SGS seems to work.

But POS SGS are accidents waiting to happen and they make a bad impression in the meantime.

On Sunday, March 11, 2018 at 7:51:43 PM UTC-4, wrote:

I thought Sugarbush has a K&L 2-33 rebuild and a K&L rebuild 1-26.


There is only one 2-33, so students also fly PW-6 (two) and ASK-21 (one). They progress to the Grob G102 after PPL. All tourist rides happen in PW-6 or ASK-21. The K&L rebuilds are beautiful, students love them, and they get really excited when they step up to the pristine 1-26.

'HHSC owns and operates 3 SGS 2-33’s, numbers 1, 2, and 3. We rely on them as our primary training aircraft for new students and transitioning power pilots.'


HHSC also has a club ASK-21. I flew a field check in it.


Truckee's fleet:
Ride Glider 1 - Schweitzer SGS 2-32
Ride Glider 2 - Schweitzer SGS 2-32
Training/Rider Glider 1 - Schweitzer SGS 2-33
Training/Ride Glider 2 - Schweitzer SGS 2-33


Right you are. I thought I saw a ASK-21 on their website.

TSS currently owns:
Schweizer 2-33A training glider
Blanik L-23 dual-place sailplane
PZL Swidnik PW-6 dual-place sailplane
Schweizer 1-26D single-place glider
PZL Bielsko PW-5 single-place sailplane.


I stand corrected on the glass 2 place, but the L-23 is an obvious step up from the 2-33.
  #56  
Old March 12th 18, 02:04 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default $75,000 2-33

I agree: higher-performance training gliders are much better. I still recall when our first one arrived: in addition to the big performance boost, long wings; plush interior nicely finished off; effective dive brakes; and a real door and window for the rear cockpit.

Yes, our first 2-33 was a HUGE step up from the crude 2-22s I trained and soloed in back in the mid 60s.

I've spent the past few months in UH's shop helping refinish my ASW 24. It's beautiful again, but it was a LOT of work. I shared quarters part of the time with a Valley Soaring Club group rejuvenating one of their 2-33s. Neither project is easy, but the far lower hours and relatively modest skills required to make the 2-33 look brand new despite it being tied out during the soaring season are another reason to keep these ships in the mix.

Chip Bearden
  #57  
Old March 12th 18, 07:36 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Paul[_2_]
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Default $75,000 2-33

.....the far lower hours and relatively modest skills required to make the 2-33 look brand new despite it being tied out during the soaring season are another reason to keep these ships in the mix.

Chip Bearden


I soloed and earned my Private and Commercial Pilot ratings in 2-33s, so I have lots of good feelings for old Tubby the Trainer. Nobody in this thread seems ready to admit it, but the thing is fun to fly. Stress free as long as you stay close to home, climbs well in thermals, front seat is comfy, and visibility is excellent.

And then there's the back seat. When I got our club's permission to carry a passenger, I moved to the rear perch to allow the visitor to have a better view. One of my first riders was a young woman with long, flowing hair. Shortly after takeoff, the wind from the air vent on the panel spread her lovely locks all over the cockpit, cutting off my view of, among other things, the tow plane. I passed her my hat and she tucked her hair in it; problem solved and lesson learned. But what my old friend Don Turner observed about flying the 2-33 from the back seat is true wisdom. "Although it is very uncomfortable," he said, "you can't see anything."
  #58  
Old March 12th 18, 03:22 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
krasw
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Default $75,000 2-33

So what's the story here? You are richest country in the world and insist on flying crappiest, oldest, cheapest training gliders known to earth. Please shine some light for us, training in poor countries with modern german gliders.
  #59  
Old March 12th 18, 03:43 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Tango Eight
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Default $75,000 2-33

On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 10:22:12 AM UTC-4, krasw wrote:
So what's the story here? You are richest country in the world and insist on flying crappiest, oldest, cheapest training gliders known to earth. Please shine some light for us, training in poor countries with modern german gliders.


Send me a link to your club website? I'd like to see what you have for equipment, membership, cost structure.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8
  #60  
Old March 12th 18, 03:55 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
krasw
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Default $75,000 2-33

maanantai 12. maaliskuuta 2018 16.44.02 UTC+2 Tango Eight kirjoitti:
On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 10:22:12 AM UTC-4, krasw wrote:
So what's the story here? You are richest country in the world and insist on flying crappiest, oldest, cheapest training gliders known to earth. Please shine some light for us, training in poor countries with modern german gliders.


Send me a link to your club website? I'd like to see what you have for equipment, membership, cost structure.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8


ASK21, Duo, Junior, LS1-f, 2*LS8, D2b, V2c. Appr. 1500 USD per year and you can fly everything as much as you can, or hourly rate of up to 30 USD/hr plus 300 USD fixed per year.
 




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