Red Baron vs. Rickenbacker?

This is pretty ironic, if true.

Why is it ironic? Thousands--probably hundreds of thousands--of
Americans have fought against their own or their parents' homelands.
They included William Patrick Hitler, who served in the U.S. Navy in
WWII.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

That's right and, as an added example, Eisenhower isn't an Irish name, either.
(^-^)))

George Z..


"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

This is pretty ironic, if true.

Why is it ironic? Thousands--probably hundreds of thousands--of
Americans have fought against their own or their parents' homelands.
They included William Patrick Hitler, who served in the U.S. Navy in
WWII.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

Also, is it true that Rickenbacker's parents (or one of them) were
German?

Rickenbaker was a fascinating case. A 7th-grade dropout from the
sticks, he had to make his way in a group dominated by Yalies, and
this at a time when class was much more important in the U.S. than any
of us remember.

His father was a construction worker; he started out in life as a
teen-aged automobile mechanic, and by 1916 was an auto-racing
superstar. At 25 he was regarded as too old to become a pilot, so he
enlisted in the army and became a chauffeur on Pershing's staff.

You'll have to ask somebody else about his parentage, but the spelling
of his name suggests that his father wasn't an immigrant. More likely
it was a couple generations back.

(During World War II, we used to hear the same thing about Eisenhower.
The Germans, meanwhile, wondered if he wasn't a Jew.)

The Germans may have wondered if they wanted to, but I never confused his name
with names like Levy, Garfinkle or Goldberg. AAMOF, I vaguely recall some
discussions along the same lines about Josef Goebbels.

George Z.


all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

Why is it ironic? Thousands--probably hundreds of thousands--of
Americans have fought against their own or their parents' homelands.

Quite true. Still, I'm curious.

"Gordon" wrote
It mattered to Popkin and Brown. The controversy was rather heated back
then,
because many felt that no pilot was good enough to kill MvR - while Allied
pilots felt that no denizen of the mud could have possibly done it. The
wounds
show upward travel, which mades the mystery somewhat less mysterious...

MvR was undoubtedly an excellent pilot. In this case he didn't follow
his own advice by going after Captain Wop May entering into hostile
territory. Wop May was on his first combat mission and was desperately
trying to escape from the Red Baron. I might add he did this successfully
when MvR was brought down by ground or air fire. Wop May returned to Canada
after the War contributing much to the development of aviation in Canada.
If you want to read about his exploits do a search with google for "Wop
May".

Cub Driver wrote:
Gregorso wrote:
Also, is it true that Rickenbacker's parents (or one of them) were
German?


You'll have to ask somebody else about his parentage, but the spelling
of his name suggests that his father wasn't an immigrant. More likely
it was a couple generations back.

He changed the spelling of his name when he joined the Army. It was
originally Rickenbacher.

Various websites indicate that he was, in fact, Swiss-German by descent,
and that his father, at least, was an immigrant. (Possibly his mother as
well, but that is unclear.)

(And possibly a distant relative through my paternal grandmother - I'll
have to re-check that with my uncle Jim, who does all the family
genealogy stuff.)

-Marc
--
Marc Reeve
actual email address after removal of 4s & spaces is
c4m4r4a4m4a4n a4t c4r4u4z4i4o d4o4t c4o4m

Cub Driver wrote:

This is pretty ironic, if true.

Why is it ironic? Thousands--probably hundreds of thousands--of
Americans have fought against their own or their parents' homelands.
They included William Patrick Hitler, who served in the U.S. Navy in
WWII.

Reminds me of an incident described in Hub(ert) Zemke's (auto) biography
"Zemke's Wolfpack." The 56th was moving into a new base (I can't
remember if it was Horsham St. Faith, Halesworth, or Boxted), and taking
it over from the RAF. 5 or 6 56th pilots including Zemke had flown in,
and Zemke introduced them to the RAF officer waiting to turn the base
over. Along with Zemke, Schilling and Goodfleisch the others were also
of German ancestry, and the RAF officer joked that he felt like he was
turning the base over to the Luftwaffe ;-).

ISTR reading in one of Roger Freeman's books on the 8th AF that Zemke
had an uncle killed in the German military in World War 1, and a couple
of cousins in the Wehrmacht were killed on the Eastern Front in World
War 2 while he was flying in the ETO.

Guy

Thousands--probably hundreds of thousands--of
Americans have fought against their own or their parents' homelands.
They included William Patrick Hitler, who served in the U.S. Navy in
WWII.

Dan, I recall reading many years ago that Adolph Hitler's real name
was Alois Schickelgruber.

Do you know if that's true?

I gather it's well established that Josef Stalin's real name was
Visarionovich Dzugashvili (although probably NOT spelled that way).

He adopted "Stalin" because it means "steel." Did Hitler choose
"Hitler" for some similar reason?

vince norris

In article ,
vincent p. norris wrote:

Thousands--probably hundreds of thousands--of
Americans have fought against their own or their parents' homelands.
They included William Patrick Hitler, who served in the U.S. Navy in
WWII.

Dan, I recall reading many years ago that Adolph Hitler's real name
was Alois Schickelgruber.

Do you know if that's true?

IIRC, Alois was his father. His given name was Adolph Schicklegruber,
he later changed it to Hitler, his mother's maiden name.

I gather it's well established that Josef Stalin's real name was
Visarionovich Dzugashvili (although probably NOT spelled that way).

He adopted "Stalin" because it means "steel." Did Hitler choose
"Hitler" for some similar reason?

Mostly because it sounded better. ("Heil Schikelgruber!" just doesn't
have the zing, does it?) IIRC, Spike Mulligan had a lot of fun playing
with the name, though that might have been Spike Jones.

"vincent p. norris" wrote in message
...
Thousands--probably hundreds of thousands--of
Americans have fought against their own or their parents' homelands.
They included William Patrick Hitler, who served in the U.S. Navy in
WWII.

Dan, I recall reading many years ago that Adolph Hitler's real name
was Alois Schickelgruber.

Do you know if that's true?


Its untrue, that story was spread by black propaganda units
in WW2

I gather it's well established that Josef Stalin's real name was
Visarionovich Dzugashvili (although probably NOT spelled that way).

He adopted "Stalin" because it means "steel." Did Hitler choose
"Hitler" for some similar reason?


No his parents were Alois and Klara Hitler, his nephew,
William Patrick Hitler was a US citizen and served in the
USN during WW2

Keith