Official word: Runway Incursion vs Surface Incident

On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 12:04:55 -0700 (PDT), BeechSundowner wrote:

On Oct 7, 11:47*am, Mike Ash wrote:

I can't imagine that anybody in this thread cares very much what other
people think,

Only one person cares what others think and it's clear to me it's
Gattman.

You are right, everybody else probably doesn't give one rats butt but
it should be known if he is an instructor, other CFI's should be
cringing for the way he has responded and behaved these past two weeks
in the newsgroups.

Those who can, do; those who can't, teach. In this specific case I
reference "can" as being able to separate Usenet from reality.

If the CFI shoe fits the CFI delusions, let them wear them.

On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 12:04:55 -0700 (PDT), BeechSundowner wrote:

Gattman's answer "I'm doing my best not to" act like a ****** is
still a poor excuse. Apparently he can't assure that his best isn't
enough to prevent him from acting like a ******.

You wouldnt' want your childs teacher to act like he did in this
thread, a CFI is a teacher, a leader a role model and sorry for being
repetitive but what I have quoted time over time from Gattman is
simply inexcuseable. That's what raised my dander from day one.

Bad enough the information he provided was incorrect, but to not want
to provide a source for his information other then word of mouth, you
and I know is not enough.

Gattman should know this, but instead called it a some
sort of penis-measuring contest because I (and others) questioned him
was simply wrong, unprofessional and rude. I did nothing to warrant
this kind of response.

Remember the song "cruel to be kind"? Here some "of the right measure".

Today with business falling off considerably (on the overwhelming
average), being a CFI, trusting your life to student pilots for a few
asspennies a day, is either the dumbest career choice ever or one made
out of simple default and necessity. Please, no one give me that
"contribution to society" **** either. Flying isn't a social
requirement.

So to have a named CFI come to an international stage like Usenet and
drop his trousers to show his ass for the world to see only does one
thing.

It assures me that at least this Chris CFI is one dumb MF and/or he is
locked into a one pony career burdened by ****4brains as his mental
pilot.

If the latter what a better way to advance your career than to publicize
the size of your stupidity by posting as he has on Usenet.

Fre Chris-sakes, there are 5th graders with better business sense.

Jeffrey Bloss wrote:
[ Elided for brevity. ]

Good luck in building a mighty mountain of the proverbial mole hill.

On Oct 7, 6:30*pm, a wrote:

We are a few plies away from the "Your mother wears combat boots"

It's beyond that and you only have Gattman to thank for that. Here it
is again in the second line.....

I'm not out here to engage in some
sort of penis-measuring contest with a couple of usenet know-it-alls,
if that's what this is going to turn into.

While I may have called him a crap instructor in the other thread,
that was based on the above which I feel bears merit. What kind of
instructor responds like the above? Do you know any outside Gattman
on or offline? I can't say if you have encountered some but I have
not in Usenet, aviation forums, or outside cyberspace..

Would you want an instructor teaching you how to fly a plane with a
mentality of the above? I don't. and I honestly can't imagine anybody
supporting such a response and finding any good out of it. It's been
kind of amusing to see some of the "poor Gattman" responses The man
brought this on himself, not the other way around.

level -- or have we passed it? Would you want to fly with PICs who
have to have the last word? Would you want them in your airspace?.

Apparently you have one in the name of Gattman. Do CFI's count?

To answer your question, IN SOME WAYS, yes, I would want a PIC that
has the guts to say the last word ESPECIALLY if it's in the interest
of safety. Better to have a PIC make a decision then have a pilot
wallowing in the skies due to indecisiveness. Wrong decision, oops,
ok, hope nobody bends metal and deal with the paperwork on the ground,
but making a decision is "having the last word".

Of course CRM is always prudent but somebody has to have the last word
if there is a decision to be made.

On Oct 7, 12:03*pm, Jeffrey Bloss wrote:

If this conversation had been carried out in a bar instead of on usenet

But it isn't...

And that gives people like you the courage to say anything you want
without having to worry that somebody might rub your nose in it.
You have made his point.

You sound like a 13-year-old. Are you sure you're old enough to be
posting here?

-c

On Oct 7, 6:40*pm, A Lieberman wrote:

I'm not out here to engage in some sort of penis-measuring contest with a couple of usenet know-it-alls,
if that's what this is going to turn into.

Would you want an instructor teaching you how to fly a plane with a mentality of the above? *I don't.

LOL! Mr. Lieberman, I know you're not saying you would rather have an
instructor who wants to engage in a penis-measuring contest, so, why
don't you just let it rest?

Everybody can snip quotes and warp people's words out of context. Or,
maybe you actually like penis-measuring contests. I don't care.

Look, I'll make this simple so I don't confuse you: I'M NOT ASKING YOU
TO BE MY STUDENT AND YOU COULDN'T PAY TO GET IN AN AIRPLANE WITH YOU.
There. You think I'm a mentally-deficient instructor, and I think
you're a bloviating jackass who just told everybody that you'd rather
fly with people who like penis measuring contests. Contexts abandoned,
dispute resolved.

-c

On Oct 6, 8:02*pm, BeechSundowner wrote:

not being defensive on what I typed out. *You just can't take it that somebody questioned you to back up what you say. *

Mr "Sundowner", I started a new thread acknowledging that I was wrong,
and clarified my comments which, as I've told you several times now,
were made to indicate that I felt obligated to do so, even before I
actually corrected myself. When somebody challenged me to back up what
I said, I did so. Regardless of whether I was erroneous, I went so far
as to quote several sources and I even contacted the FAA. And when
they corrected me, I shared it with you all here. That is fact.

Now, you're simply lying. I don't know what motivates you to do that,
or what you think your opinion contributes to anything, but, now
you're lying. I cannot respect that and I'm sure you don't care.

-c

On Oct 8, 3:23*pm, C Gattman wrote:

LOL! *Mr. Lieberman, I know you're not saying you would rather have an
instructor who wants to engage in a penis-measuring contest, so, why
don't you just let it rest?

Not my reputation to uphold, so I thought you said good bye? Seems
you keep bringing the thread up to the top of the line. Why is that?

Everybody can snip quotes and warp people's words out of context. Or,
maybe you actually like penis-measuring contests. I don't care.

Nothing warped or snipped out of context. I quoted you word for
word. Tell me what did I quote out of text. YOU TYPED IT.

There. You think I'm a mentally-deficient instructor,

I never said this, you said it. My opinion of you is that you are a
poor representation as an instructor and all instructors. Never said
anything about your mental state.

Your responses are amazingly amusing.

On Oct 8, 3:33*pm, C Gattman wrote:

Now, you're simply lying. I don't know what motivates you to do that,
or what you think your opinion contributes to anything, but, now
you're lying. I cannot respect that and I'm sure you don't care.

Please back up with your words where I am lying with direct links to
posts that I am lying. I bet you wont.

I bet I can prove my sharp responses to you are warranted and
justified with direct links to your postings. Again, thankfully it's
all out there. I live with a very clean conscience.

Can you justify your penis statement on your FIRST RESPONSE TO A
QUESTION I asked.??? This is s a very direct question. PLEASE ANSWER
THIS. I bet you won't.

I don't instruct, I don't have to uphold a standard that an instructor
SHOULD HOLD. But these two threads do show I don't come down to your
level of verbiage in my responses to you.

What is your excuse for responding like you did to me? I bet you
won't even answer this direct question. You haven't thus far, so I
won't expect any on this posting.

On Oct 8, 2:48*pm, Jeffrey Bloss wrote:

The same kind that asks whether a post is underage and inquires about
his ass.

I'd have to agree with you here. Never answers my DIRECT questions.
He just diverts the question and adds more red herrings. Now, I am a
lier, but I can't figured what I have lied about. LOL I didn't know
asking questions was a lie, did you?

IN MY OPINION Gattman is not an instructor to be looked up to, that is
for sure.