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#21
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"Dave Stadt" wrote You must never have left at high volume departure times. They will get at least 6 lined up on 18 right, 2 wide and three deep. There will also be departures on 18 left. I have been out there during "the push". I don't recall more than 2 wide and one deep, with one just breaking ground. I guess that could be due to the difference in individual controller's preferences, also. It could be CRS, too! g -- Jim in NC |
#22
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Montblack wrote: ("Newps" wrote) My thought exactly. Perhaps the tower controller was getting prepped for this year :-) Not likely as he's not eligible for OSH. Who is? What are the requirements? Anybody from the Great Lakes region and checked out at your facility. |
#23
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Mitty wrote: IFR or VFR is not relavant. Separation requirements make the crowding-onto-the-runway exercise unnecessary if both flights are IFR, as the local controller would have plenty of time to taxi the second IFR guy onto the runway before the second flight could be released anyway. You need 3000 feet between two single engine aircraft for your runway separation and then 15 degrees divergence for your IFR separation. |
#24
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("Newps" wrote)
Anybody from the Great Lakes region and checked out at your facility. Thanks. http://www.agl.faa.gov/publicaffairs...atcfacts1.html (ATC - Great Lakes Region) Montblack |
#25
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Newps wrote:
Roy Smith wrote: Hi Tom. That's a common trick the tower uses at HPN to get multiple departures out quicker. I get it every once in a while. I can't say for sure, but I suspect it's only possible when one of the flights is VFR. IFR or VFR is not relavant. Size is ! turbulence effect should be kepp in mind :-) |
#26
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Sure it is relevant, until one IFR flight has cleared the part of the
airspace relevant to his departure the second IFR flight cannot be released for takeoff. For the same reason a plane holding for IFR release cannot take off until the IFR arrival he's waiting for has either cancelled IFR or has landed. Mike W. wrote: "Newps" wrote in message ... Roy Smith wrote: Hi Tom. That's a common trick the tower uses at HPN to get multiple departures out quicker. I get it every once in a while. I can't say for sure, but I suspect it's only possible when one of the flights is VFR. IFR or VFR is not relavant. He's right, the controller is not going to issue taxi and hold to a flight that is going to have to wait 10 minutes to pick up clearance. If they are ready to go, they are ready to go. |
#27
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"Robert Chambers" wrote in message om... Sure it is relevant, until one IFR flight has cleared the part of the airspace relevant to his departure the second IFR flight cannot be released for takeoff. Yes, but at a controlled field that can occur rather quickly. For the same reason a plane holding for IFR release cannot take off until the IFR arrival he's waiting for has either cancelled IFR or has landed. Not true at a controlled field. |
#28
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Robert Chambers wrote: Sure it is relevant, until one IFR flight has cleared the part of the airspace relevant to his departure the second IFR flight cannot be released for takeoff. At a towered airport you are talking runway separation. After the first plane is 3000 feet down the runway the next one can be launched. For the same reason a plane holding for IFR release cannot take off until the IFR arrival he's waiting for has either cancelled IFR or has landed. No. The tower can provide visual separation if it doesn't have radar. |
#29
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It may depend on the field, but if you have an IFR arrival inbound on an
ILS approach, and an IFR departure waiting to take to the skies, the guy on the ground is not going to be released. At larger airports where they have more runways or larger distances separating incoming from outgoing they can squeeze the timing a bit. From my home field (class D) I know this to be the case. Steven P. McNicoll wrote: "Robert Chambers" wrote in message om... Sure it is relevant, until one IFR flight has cleared the part of the airspace relevant to his departure the second IFR flight cannot be released for takeoff. Yes, but at a controlled field that can occur rather quickly. For the same reason a plane holding for IFR release cannot take off until the IFR arrival he's waiting for has either cancelled IFR or has landed. Not true at a controlled field. |
#30
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And what happens if the incoming plane goes missed? You're assuming an
awful lot about what the tower guy can and cannot see. My home field tower doesn't have radar, or a brite scope slaved from the approach control. If there's an incoming IFR flight, and you want to go out IFR, you are not going to be released until the incoming plane either lands or cancels IFR. Newps wrote: Robert Chambers wrote: Sure it is relevant, until one IFR flight has cleared the part of the airspace relevant to his departure the second IFR flight cannot be released for takeoff. At a towered airport you are talking runway separation. After the first plane is 3000 feet down the runway the next one can be launched. For the same reason a plane holding for IFR release cannot take off until the IFR arrival he's waiting for has either cancelled IFR or has landed. No. The tower can provide visual separation if it doesn't have radar. |
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