Why GA is Dying

After I landed from this morning's flight, a young guy (maybe 18 or 20 years
old) came over, complimented my airplane and asked if he could take some
pictures. Of course, I was flattered and told him to shoot away. He hung
around and we talked for 20 minutes or more as I wiped down the airplane for
bugs, cleaned the canopy, etc.. Turns out, he has his "ultralight pilot's
license? (???) and is about ready to start training for his PPSEL. Nice
guy.

Once I took care of a few things (and the airplane cooled), I taxied over to
the wash stand and gave the RV a nice bath. - Can't go to Oshkosh with a
dirty airplane. The young guy from before happed to be over by the wash
stand with his camera, so we had another conversation as I was washing the
airplane.

In the middle of this, one of the employees from the FBO came over and asked
the guy to go to the FBO and present his photo ID so the FBO would know who
is making pictures at the airport. I steped in and asked where this
requirement came from, and the FBO guy hemmed and hawed, saying that he
thought it came from the airport authority. I asked if he could show me the
requirement in writing. He hemmed and hawed some more, and never could
answer the question. The FBO guy said that people didn't like having others
make pictures of their airplanes. (Huh??) Like, who? I asked. Again, no
good response.

I'll verify this with the FBO owner and the airport authority on Monday, but
no way, no how, is there a "must present an ID before taking pictures"
policy at my home field. Someone at the FBO didn't have anything to do and
decided to play "big man on campus" for fun.

So, what does this have to do with the slow death of GA? It has to do with
the attitudes around some airports. Today's 20 year old picture taker will
be tomorrow's private pilot who'll be paying for flying lessons, gasoline,
etc. and will eventually rent aircraft or own his own airplane. That is, if
he wasn't put-off by the FBO. In which case, that's one more person who had
his dream squashed, and will never become a pilot. Given the sharp decline
in the number of pilots in the US, it amazes me how unfriendly FBO's can be.
You'd think they would be out begging for business. Naah. It must be far
more productive to run off prospective customers. No wonder there are so few
new pilots.

FYI, my home field is just outside of Atlanta. Go one airport farther away
from Atlanta in any direction and you'll get great service by very friendly
people. Go to any of the airports closer to the city and they will
practically beg you to leave unless your aircraft is turbine powered. I'd
bet those unfriendly airports turn a lot of people from potential pilots to
boat or Harley owners.

By the way, the 20 year old guy did go inside the FBO and present his ID.
His choice, and a nice gesture. I thought a different gesture might have
been appropriate.

KB

Nobody is forcing you to use that FBO. Frankly, I like the idea of
them keeping tabs on people hanging around planes they are responsible
for. If I owned a plane, I might seek out a place like that.


Kyle Boatright wrote:
After I landed from this morning's flight, a young guy (maybe 18 or 20 years
old) came over, complimented my airplane and asked if he could take some
pictures. Of course, I was flattered and told him to shoot away. He hung
around and we talked for 20 minutes or more as I wiped down the airplane for
bugs, cleaned the canopy, etc.. Turns out, he has his "ultralight pilot's
license? (???) and is about ready to start training for his PPSEL. Nice
guy.

Once I took care of a few things (and the airplane cooled), I taxied over to
the wash stand and gave the RV a nice bath. - Can't go to Oshkosh with a
dirty airplane. The young guy from before happed to be over by the wash
stand with his camera, so we had another conversation as I was washing the
airplane.

In the middle of this, one of the employees from the FBO came over and asked
the guy to go to the FBO and present his photo ID so the FBO would know who
is making pictures at the airport. I steped in and asked where this
requirement came from, and the FBO guy hemmed and hawed, saying that he
thought it came from the airport authority. I asked if he could show me the
requirement in writing. He hemmed and hawed some more, and never could
answer the question. The FBO guy said that people didn't like having others
make pictures of their airplanes. (Huh??) Like, who? I asked. Again, no
good response.

I'll verify this with the FBO owner and the airport authority on Monday, but
no way, no how, is there a "must present an ID before taking pictures"
policy at my home field. Someone at the FBO didn't have anything to do and
decided to play "big man on campus" for fun.

So, what does this have to do with the slow death of GA? It has to do with
the attitudes around some airports. Today's 20 year old picture taker will
be tomorrow's private pilot who'll be paying for flying lessons, gasoline,
etc. and will eventually rent aircraft or own his own airplane. That is, if
he wasn't put-off by the FBO. In which case, that's one more person who had
his dream squashed, and will never become a pilot. Given the sharp decline
in the number of pilots in the US, it amazes me how unfriendly FBO's can be.
You'd think they would be out begging for business. Naah. It must be far
more productive to run off prospective customers. No wonder there are so few
new pilots.

FYI, my home field is just outside of Atlanta. Go one airport farther away
from Atlanta in any direction and you'll get great service by very friendly
people. Go to any of the airports closer to the city and they will
practically beg you to leave unless your aircraft is turbine powered. I'd
bet those unfriendly airports turn a lot of people from potential pilots to
boat or Harley owners.

By the way, the 20 year old guy did go inside the FBO and present his ID.
His choice, and a nice gesture. I thought a different gesture might have
been appropriate.

KB

"Stubby" wrote in message
...
Frankly, I like the idea of
them keeping tabs on people hanging around planes they are responsible
for. If I owned a plane, I might seek out a place like that.


Yup, our FBO requires ID for those that enter the ramp thru the FBO. I
think it's a small inconvenience for the step up in security. If people know
they can walk in off the street without question, that's where some trouble
could start.

A lot of these requirements are being driven by TSA. Badges for people
employed at the airport. People with their own airplanes may soon need
badges too.

Also, many Airport Authorities, not the FBO, require permits for photo or
video that may be taken at the airport and sold for commercial use. This
does not stop the aircraft owner or CFI taking pictures of his newly solo'd
student.

BT

"Michael Ware" wrote in message
. ..

"Stubby" wrote in message
...
Frankly, I like the idea of
them keeping tabs on people hanging around planes they are responsible
for. If I owned a plane, I might seek out a place like that.


Yup, our FBO requires ID for those that enter the ramp thru the FBO. I
think it's a small inconvenience for the step up in security. If people
know
they can walk in off the street without question, that's where some
trouble
could start.

On 2006-07-23, BTIZ wrote:
A lot of these requirements are being driven by TSA. Badges for people
employed at the airport. People with their own airplanes may soon need
badges too.

I find it amazing that if I wait 5 years, flying in Britain will be more
free than flying in the United States. We USED to really look up to the
US system.

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de

"BTIZ" wrote:
People with their own airplanes may soon need
badges too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stinking_badges

On Sat, 22 Jul 2006 20:38:07 GMT, Michael Ware wrote:

Yup, our FBO requires ID for those that enter the ramp thru the FBO. I
think it's a small inconvenience for the step up in security.

A gain in security because you produced some form of ID? ridiculous.
And producing it for some college guy working the desk at an FBO? even more
ridiculous.

#m
--
Did you ever realize how much text fits in eighty columns? If you now consider
that a signature usually consists of up to four lines, this gives you enough
space to spread a tremendous amount of information with your messages. So seize
this opportunity and don't waste your signature with bull**** nobody will read.

"Stubby" wrote in message
...
Nobody is forcing you to use that FBO. Frankly, I like the idea of them
keeping tabs on people hanging around planes they are responsible for. If
I owned a plane, I might seek out a place like that.


They are not keeping tabs on people hanging around the airport. There are 2
gates to the ramp and both are wide open all day. The gates are not
monitored. Automobiles are allowed on the ramp. Bikes are allowed on the
ramp. People are allowed on the ramp. No ID, no anything other than an
active GA community to keep an eye on things during the day. At night, one
gate is open and there is a security person around.

I'm fine with that. I don't need/want big brother at the airport. I don't
want to have to sign in or card in or have to meet guests at a security
gate. That kind of security just isn't necessary at a GA field.

The issue today was that the kid was taking pictures instead of just
pointing and talking. Why you'd need to have an ID to take pictures (as
opposed to walking the ramp or driving on the ramp) is unknowable. And, why
someone with the FBO would fabricate a rule about having a photo ID to take
pictures is bizzarre.

KB

Years ago I was talking with Bill Sweet [Air Show America]
and he told me a story about something that happened to him.
He was flying to an air show and stopped for the night and
put his plane in a hanger and the operator, a friend of his
let him stay over-night in the hanger with his airplane.
During the night he said he heard a DC3 taxiing on the
airport and looked to see what was going on. He then went
back to sleep.
The next morning there were more than a dozen airplanes
sitting on the ramp, firewall forward missing and the
avionics were all taken. Later the DC3 was caught and they
had rigged a canvas and chain hoist on a rail out the door.
They'd taxi near a Bonanza or C210 and if the couldn't steal
the airplane, they'd use power saws or cutting torches to
remove the parts they wanted.

Drug smugglers, plain thieves, and terrorists all want your
airplane. But we need to still be able to have airport
kids, lookers, and future students feel welcome.The major
airports have bigger budgets and more threats. Should we
all carry a dozen official government ID cards? I hope not.
But a digital camera [or Polaroid] can take a picture of the
people who are allowed on the ramp. It is just security,
everybody on the ramp needs to be escorted or instructed in
safety around airplanes, prop/jet blast, danger zones for
props and rotors, nothing will get your airport closed
faster than a headline, Toddler Killed by Private Plane's
Propeller.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"Kyle Boatright" wrote in message
. ..
|
| "Stubby" wrote in
message
| ...
| Nobody is forcing you to use that FBO. Frankly, I like
the idea of them
| keeping tabs on people hanging around planes they are
responsible for. If
| I owned a plane, I might seek out a place like that.
|
|
| They are not keeping tabs on people hanging around the
airport. There are 2
| gates to the ramp and both are wide open all day. The
gates are not
| monitored. Automobiles are allowed on the ramp. Bikes are
allowed on the
| ramp. People are allowed on the ramp. No ID, no anything
other than an
| active GA community to keep an eye on things during the
day. At night, one
| gate is open and there is a security person around.
|
| I'm fine with that. I don't need/want big brother at the
airport. I don't
| want to have to sign in or card in or have to meet guests
at a security
| gate. That kind of security just isn't necessary at a GA
field.
|
| The issue today was that the kid was taking pictures
instead of just
| pointing and talking. Why you'd need to have an ID to
take pictures (as
| opposed to walking the ramp or driving on the ramp) is
unknowable. And, why
| someone with the FBO would fabricate a rule about having a
photo ID to take
| pictures is bizzarre.
|
| KB
|
|
|
|
|

Jim Macklin wrote:
Years ago I was talking with Bill Sweet [Air Show America]
and he told me a story about something that happened to him.
He was flying to an air show and stopped for the night and
put his plane in a hanger and the operator, a friend of his
let him stay over-night in the hanger with his airplane.
During the night he said he heard a DC3 taxiing on the
airport and looked to see what was going on. He then went
back to sleep.
The next morning there were more than a dozen airplanes
sitting on the ramp, firewall forward missing and the
avionics were all taken. Later the DC3 was caught and they
had rigged a canvas and chain hoist on a rail out the door.
They'd taxi near a Bonanza or C210 and if the couldn't steal
the airplane, they'd use power saws or cutting torches to
remove the parts they wanted.

Drug smugglers, plain thieves, and terrorists all want your
airplane. But we need to still be able to have airport
kids, lookers, and future students feel welcome.The major
airports have bigger budgets and more threats. Should we
all carry a dozen official government ID cards? I hope not.
But a digital camera [or Polaroid] can take a picture of the
people who are allowed on the ramp. It is just security,
everybody on the ramp needs to be escorted or instructed in
safety around airplanes, prop/jet blast, danger zones for
props and rotors, nothing will get your airport closed
faster than a headline, Toddler Killed by Private Plane's
Propeller.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

I visited a friend (in New England) at a large county (but uncontroled)
airport, with a small regular commuter airline, and parked my plane on
the ramp. During the visit he gave me one of his old high powered deer
rifles as a present. When I went back to the plane I walked right
through the terminal with it and out to my plane. Started up and left.
No one gave me a second look. I laughed about it most of the way home.

Jim