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#1
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Holds for currency requirements
I recently did 6 approaches to get back current again, but I forgot to
do a hold. My last hold was less than 6 months ago, so I'm still legal for a few more days. What counts as a hold to fit that vaguely worded requirement? - A self-assigned hold while flying solo VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a safety pilot while VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a CFII while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in IMC? - A hold on a PC-ATD? Also, what constitutes a hold? - Doing the entry? - Doing one full circuit? -- Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/ `And when you've been *plonk*ed by Simon C., you've been *plonked* by someone who knows when, and why, and how.' - Mike Andrews, asr |
#2
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I recently did 6 approaches to get back current again, but I forgot to do a hold. My last hold was less than 6 months ago, so I'm still legal for a few more days. What counts as a hold to fit that vaguely worded requirement? - A self-assigned hold while flying solo VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a safety pilot while VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a CFII while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in IMC? - A hold on a PC-ATD? Also, what constitutes a hold? - Doing the entry? - Doing one full circuit? It's (of course) not defined in the FARs, one must infer. I would infer that the hold must be done in actual or simulated instrument conditions. I'd say the entry is not enough, you need to do at least a full circuit... enough to become "established" in the hold (timing an outbound leg, testing your timing on the inbound, making a wind correction on the next outbound, and testing it on the next inbound. If you haven't applied a wind correction, I would say that you haven't done enough "hold" to even test to see if you are ok at it. I would infer that the hold does not need to be controller assigned. It can be self assigned, if your assignment of direction and orientation is independent of your present heading. If the PC-ATD is certified for logging instrument time, then I would infer that a hold done there would be fine. Howver, in order for the time to count (and the hold to count) there must be an instructor preseent and supervising (according to my understanding of logging flight simulator time) Jose -- (for Email, make the obvious changes in my address) |
#3
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Paul Tomblin ) wrote:
What counts as a hold to fit that vaguely worded requirement? Inline for what I would count towards the requirement for my logbook: - A self-assigned hold while flying solo VFR in VMC? No. To me, this is similar to flying an ILS solo while in VMC. With the responsibility for traffic spotting solely on me, I cannot use the gauges enough to benefit from the exercise. - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a safety pilot while VFR in VMC? Yes. - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a CFII while IFR in VMC? Yes. - A controller assigned hold while IFR in VMC? Yes. - A controller assigned hold while IFR in IMC? Yes. - A hold on a PC-ATD? I don't have access to a certified simulator so I do not know. Also, what constitutes a hold? In this case, I look at it from the PoV of what demonstrates to me that I am proficient at a hold. Thus, I consider the entry and at least one full circuit (for wind/time correction). -- Peter ----== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- |
#4
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I would assume, as others have, that the hold should be done in actual
or simulated instrument conditions, or on PC-ATD (I believe an instructor has to be there for that). My view is that currency is not just about time and numbers, but rather is about are your skills current and safe for a foray into the clouds. I can shoot an ILS approach with the best of them, but if I do 6 ILS approaches under the hood for currency, I would be quite reluctant to do a partial panel NDB approach in the soup. Taking a few trips around a hold, especially on a day with a bit of wind, takes very little time, and will sharpen your skills to the point of not just meeting the regs, but goes a long way in making you really "current". Just my $.02. Paul Tomblin wrote: I recently did 6 approaches to get back current again, but I forgot to do a hold. My last hold was less than 6 months ago, so I'm still legal for a few more days. What counts as a hold to fit that vaguely worded requirement? - A self-assigned hold while flying solo VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a safety pilot while VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a CFII while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in IMC? - A hold on a PC-ATD? Also, what constitutes a hold? - Doing the entry? - Doing one full circuit? -- Remove "2PLANES" to reply. |
#5
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Paul Tomblin wrote:
I recently did 6 approaches to get back current again, but I forgot to do a hold. My last hold was less than 6 months ago, so I'm still legal for a few more days. What counts as a hold to fit that vaguely worded requirement? - A self-assigned hold while flying solo VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a safety pilot while VFR in VMC? - A self-assigned hold while flying under foggles with a CFII while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in VMC? - A controller assigned hold while IFR in IMC? - A hold on a PC-ATD? Also, what constitutes a hold? - Doing the entry? - Doing one full circuit? The purpose is to help maintain some level of proficiency. So, the question I would ask is which of the above contribute to IFR proficiency. The first one doesn't contribute much. The rest should with the last one being dependent on which PC-ATD. Also, I don't think it counts as a hold until you are established. I don't know of an official definition for this either, but I think at least one ciruit with the wind correction reasonably well nailed would be a decent definition. Anyone who only plans to do the first option above obviously cares nothing about proficiency and only about checking a legal box. If that is the case, then you might as well just log in as though you really did it and save the gas.... Matt |
#6
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#7
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In article , Dan Truesdell
writes: I can shoot an ILS approach with the best of them, but if I do 6 ILS approaches under the hood for currency, I would be quite reluctant to do a partial panel NDB approach in the soup. I would be "quite reluctant" to do a partial panel NDB approach, no matter how much practice I had. G Chuck |
#8
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FAA Letter dated 19 Dec 2003 from Robert A. Wright, Manager, General
Aviation and Commercial Division allows certain Elite PCATDS./ Note this is the PCATD version with specific hardware. There IS a requirement of a CFI for time logged for ratings, experience and proficiency checks. There is NOT a requirement for 61.57(c)(1) currency. You must also report use of the machine annually to the local FSDO and have a copy of the letter on display. Elite can furnish a copy of the letter if it is relevant because you own a PCATD. I can email you a copy if you need one because you own a PCATD. |
#9
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Dan Truesdell wrote
My view is that currency is not just about time and numbers, but rather is about are your skills current and safe for a foray into the clouds. I agree - which is why I feel the discussions about what meets the minimum definition of 6 approaches is silly. But when it comes to holds, I take a somewhat different view. In my opinion, the only holds that really matter are the ones where a hold is done in lieu of PT for course reversal. Those must be flown competently if one is to become adequately established on the FAC. All other holds are just a way of being in some defined chunk of airspace until it's time to do something different. Taking a few trips around a hold, especially on a day with a bit of wind, takes very little time, and will sharpen your skills to the point of not just meeting the regs, but goes a long way in making you really "current". The skill you need to sharpen is being established on the holding course before you cross the holding fix. Realistically, anyone flying anything that goes fast enough that remaining in the protected airspace is an issue is getting regular recurrent sim training anyway - for our purposes, as long as you can get yourself established on the inbound course before you cross the holding fix, you're good to go. Going around the hold multiple times is pretty much a waste of time. If you made a good entry - meaning you were properly established on the inbound course before crossing the fix - call it good. If not, exit the hold and do it again. The hot tip is to simply combine this with shooting approaches - use a hold in lieu of PT to do the course reversal whether it's charted that way or not. Recall that a charted PT allows you to reverse course in any way you like as long as you're on the protected side, so this is legal. It will also make it really obvious whether you did a decent enough job in the hold - because if you didn't, you will hose the approach. Michael |
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