Notes from a Small Island - 1015K in UK.

On Mon, 28 Jun 2004 06:36:07 UTC, Chris Rollings
wrote:

: Regretably, Mr Johnson is right.

Ah, how often I hear that.

: There are no longer
: any such things as single seat, two seat or motor glider
: records - just Open Class, 15 meter and Feminine on
: the British National and World lists plus Standard
: and (I think) 20 metre on the UK Local list.

Does the Goodhart flight get the 20m free distance record?

Ian

Well said Chris,

The records being made at present in gliders with an engine "opt out"
are in no way comparable to the same flight without an engine.

Equally why we maintain "feminine" records in this day and age is
beyond me.

Andy Henderson




Chris Rollings wrote in message ...
Wally,

Regretably, Mr Johnson is right. There are no longer
any such things as single seat, two seat or motor glider
records - just Open Class, 15 meter and Feminine on
the British National and World lists plus Standard
and (I think) 20 metre on the UK Local list.

Care to join me on a campaigne to restore the distinctions?
I, for one think Russell's 1000 km flight on Friday
was of greater merit than the first UK 1000 km. One
pilot working at it non stop for eleven and a half
hours, compared to two pilots sharing the load for
twelve hours.

I have the greatest admiration for the terrific flights
that have been done in Argentina in the last few years,
but I will respect even more the pilot who does the
same thing solo and without an engine.

Chris Rollings

At 22:00 27 June 2004, Walter Kahn wrote:
Mr. Johnson has got it wrong yet again - I assume
that Gordon and his
co-pilot will have difficulty in claiming Nick Goodhart's
record as his
is the single seater goal flight record which, of course,
still stands.

Incidentally Nick also remains the current World Gliding
Two-seater
Champion. It has been reported that some people are
keen to revive this
class again.

Well done Gordon, Nimbus or whatever, well done all
the guys who did
great things on Super Friday. When you consider that
Gordon was towed
off at 0345 and one of the Lasham pilots completed
his 750k and landed
back at Lasham at 2130 - it was one hell of a day!
Wally Kahn
In article , Ian Johnston
writes
On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 07:04:23 UTC, Gav Goudie
wrote:

: Nimbus
: 3D completed a declared goal of Aboyne (Scotland)
to
: Lasham, (Hampshire).

Does that mean that some rotten, unspeakable cad has
taken Goodhart's
Lasham to Portmoak record? If so, I am really disappointed
- sorry
guys, but doing it in a Skylark 3 is much, much, much,
much more of an
achievement than using a Nimbus 3D.

Seriously, I hope they have the decency not to claim
the record.

Ian



--
Walter Kahn

When Klaus Ohlmann talked about his Argentinian record
flights at the BGA conference a few years back, I believe
he said that having spent all day at 20,000+ feet the
engine in the Stemme would be highly unlikely to start.
Hence there is no more 'opt out' than if the flight
had been done in a pure sailplane, and the aachievement
is no less valid.


At 12:42 28 June 2004, Andy Henderson wrote:
Well said Chris,

The records being made at present in gliders with an
engine 'opt out'
are in no way comparable to the same flight without
an engine.

Equally why we maintain 'feminine' records in this
day and age is
beyond me.

Andy Henderson




Chris Rollings wrote in message news:...
Wally,

Regretably, Mr Johnson is right. There are no longer
any such things as single seat, two seat or motor
glider
records - just Open Class, 15 meter and Feminine on
the British National and World lists plus Standard
and (I think) 20 metre on the UK Local list.

Care to join me on a campaigne to restore the distinctions?
I, for one think Russell's 1000 km flight on Friday
was of greater merit than the first UK 1000 km. One
pilot working at it non stop for eleven and a half
hours, compared to two pilots sharing the load for
twelve hours.

I have the greatest admiration for the terrific flights
that have been done in Argentina in the last few years,
but I will respect even more the pilot who does the
same thing solo and without an engine.

Chris Rollings

At 22:00 27 June 2004, Walter Kahn wrote:
Mr. Johnson has got it wrong yet again - I assume
that Gordon and his
co-pilot will have difficulty in claiming Nick Goodhart's
record as his
is the single seater goal flight record which, of
course,
still stands.

Incidentally Nick also remains the current World Gliding
Two-seater
Champion. It has been reported that some people are
keen to revive this
class again.

Well done Gordon, Nimbus or whatever, well done all
the guys who did
great things on Super Friday. When you consider that
Gordon was towed
off at 0345 and one of the Lasham pilots completed
his 750k and landed
back at Lasham at 2130 - it was one hell of a day!
Wally Kahn
In article , Ian Johnston
writes
On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 07:04:23 UTC, Gav Goudie
wrote:

: Nimbus
: 3D completed a declared goal of Aboyne (Scotland)
to
: Lasham, (Hampshire).

Does that mean that some rotten, unspeakable cad has
taken Goodhart's
Lasham to Portmoak record? If so, I am really disappointed
- sorry
guys, but doing it in a Skylark 3 is much, much, much,
much more of an
achievement than using a Nimbus 3D.

Seriously, I hope they have the decency not to claim
the record.

Ian



--
Walter Kahn

That's speculation, and the record whilst a magnificent
flight is not the same as one without an engine.

Are you saying that in all of Klaus's previous practise
flights at these heights he never started the engine
to get home because the flight 'wasn't on'? I think
not.

Andy Henderson

At 14:18 28 June 2004, Alan Irving wrote:
When Klaus Ohlmann talked about his Argentinian record
flights at the BGA conference a few years back, I believe
he said that having spent all day at 20,000+ feet the
engine in the Stemme would be highly unlikely to start.
Hence there is no more 'opt out' than if the flight
had been done in a pure sailplane, and the aachievement
is no less valid.


At 12:42 28 June 2004, Andy Henderson wrote:
Well said Chris,

The records being made at present in gliders with an
engine 'opt out'
are in no way comparable to the same flight without
an engine.

Equally why we maintain 'feminine' records in this
day and age is
beyond me.

Andy Henderson




Chris Rollings wrote in message news:...
Wally,

Regretably, Mr Johnson is right. There are no longer
any such things as single seat, two seat or motor
glider
records - just Open Class, 15 meter and Feminine on
the British National and World lists plus Standard
and (I think) 20 metre on the UK Local list.

Care to join me on a campaigne to restore the distinctions?
I, for one think Russell's 1000 km flight on Friday
was of greater merit than the first UK 1000 km. One
pilot working at it non stop for eleven and a half
hours, compared to two pilots sharing the load for
twelve hours.

I have the greatest admiration for the terrific flights
that have been done in Argentina in the last few years,
but I will respect even more the pilot who does the
same thing solo and without an engine.

Chris Rollings

At 22:00 27 June 2004, Walter Kahn wrote:
Mr. Johnson has got it wrong yet again - I assume
that Gordon and his
co-pilot will have difficulty in claiming Nick Goodhart's
record as his
is the single seater goal flight record which, of
course,
still stands.

Incidentally Nick also remains the current World Gliding
Two-seater
Champion. It has been reported that some people are
keen to revive this
class again.

Well done Gordon, Nimbus or whatever, well done all
the guys who did
great things on Super Friday. When you consider that
Gordon was towed
off at 0345 and one of the Lasham pilots completed
his 750k and landed
back at Lasham at 2130 - it was one hell of a day!
Wally Kahn
In article , Ian Johnston
writes
On Sat, 26 Jun 2004 07:04:23 UTC, Gav Goudie
wrote:

: Nimbus
: 3D completed a declared goal of Aboyne (Scotland)
to
: Lasham, (Hampshire).

Does that mean that some rotten, unspeakable cad has
taken Goodhart's
Lasham to Portmoak record? If so, I am really disappointed
- sorry
guys, but doing it in a Skylark 3 is much, much, much,
much more of an
achievement than using a Nimbus 3D.

Seriously, I hope they have the decency not to claim
the record.

Ian



--
Walter Kahn

Andy,I hate to single you out, but that statement really
bothers me.What if Klaus, instead of flying a motorglider, had
hired a dozen crews complete with trailers and helicopters
to handle the retreives along his route. Would you
also consider it less of an acheivement than if he
only had one crew at the home airport?What the motorglider does is give the (relatively)
ordinary pilot the opportunity to explore areas and
work conditions that are a bit more difficult logistically.
Last November, I flew a 100km world record speed flight.
I couldn't have done it without the motor as there
wasn't a towplane available at the airport. Also,
had a towplane been available, I may not have taken
the tow to 13000 MSL (nearly 8K AGL) due to perceived
cost and not wanting to inconvenience the next person
in line waiting for a tow.Anyone who thinks the engine provides an 'out' from
wrecking the glider has not flown one of these sailplanes
seriously. What the motor provides me is the same
confidence and frame of mind as a crew driving a very
fast car and always within easy contact to come and
get me out of that field I'm about to start the engine
over. So far, my engine has always started, but I
never trust it to.In the USA, national recods do separate motorgliders
from the rest. Aside from the logistics of the very
early launch and connecting with the wave, I don't
think Kempton Izuno ever thought about the engine on
his 1000 mile flight in the Sierra earlier this year.
I pretty much don't on over 90% of my flights. But
when I do, it's always AFTER I've picked a likely landing
area.At 15:12 28 June 2004, Andrew Henderson wrote:That's speculation, and the record whilst a magnificentflight is not the same as one without an engine.
Tom Serkowski
ASH-26E

To email me, place '@' after Tom, and append '.com'

Andy,I hate to single you out, but that statement really
bothers me.What if Klaus, instead of flying a motorglider, had
hired a dozen crews complete with trailers and helicopters
to handle the retreives along his route. Would you
also consider it less of an acheivement than if he
only had one crew at the home airport?What the motorglider does is give the (relatively)
ordinary pilot the opportunity to explore areas and
work conditions that are a bit more difficult logistically.
Last November, I flew a 100km world record speed flight.
I couldn't have done it without the motor as there
wasn't a towplane available at the airport. Also,
had a towplane been available, I may not have taken
the tow to 13000 MSL (nearly 8K AGL) due to perceived
cost and not wanting to inconvenience the next person
in line waiting for a tow.Anyone who thinks the engine provides an 'out' from
wrecking the glider has not flown one of these sailplanes
seriously. What the motor provides me is the same
confidence and frame of mind as a crew driving a very
fast car and always within easy contact to come and
get me out of that field I'm about to start the engine
over. So far, my engine has always started, but I
never trust it to.In the USA, national recods do separate motorgliders
from the rest. Aside from the logistics of the very
early launch and connecting with the wave, I don't
think Kempton Izuno ever thought about the engine on
his 1000 mile flight in the Sierra earlier this year.
I pretty much don't on over 90% of my flights. But
when I do, it's always AFTER I've picked a likely landing
area.At 15:12 28 June 2004, Andrew Henderson wrote:That's speculation, and the record whilst a magnificentflight is not the same as one without an engine.
Tom Serkowski
ASH-26E

To email me, place '@' after Tom, and append '.com'

Andy,I hate to single you out, but that statement really
bothers me.What if Klaus, instead of flying a motorglider, had
hired a dozen crews complete with trailers and helicopters
to handle the retreives along his route. Would you
also consider it less of an acheivement than if he
only had one crew at the home airport?What the motorglider does is give the (relatively)
ordinary pilot the opportunity to explore areas and
work conditions that are a bit more difficult logistically.
Last November, I flew a 100km world record speed flight.
I couldn't have done it without the motor as there
wasn't a towplane available at the airport. Also,
had a towplane been available, I may not have taken
the tow to 13000 MSL (nearly 8K AGL) due to perceived
cost and not wanting to inconvenience the next person
in line waiting for a tow.Anyone who thinks the engine provides an 'out' from
wrecking the glider has not flown one of these sailplanes
seriously. What the motor provides me is the same
confidence and frame of mind as a crew driving a very
fast car and always within easy contact to come and
get me out of that field I'm about to start the engine
over. So far, my engine has always started, but I
never trust it to.In the USA, national recods do separate motorgliders
from the rest. Aside from the logistics of the very
early launch and connecting with the wave, I don't
think Kempton Izuno ever thought about the engine on
his 1000 mile flight in the Sierra earlier this year.
I pretty much don't on over 90% of my flights. But
when I do, it's always AFTER I've picked a likely landing
area.At 15:12 28 June 2004, Andrew Henderson wrote:That's speculation, and the record whilst a magnificentflight is not the same as one without an engine.
Tom Serkowski
ASH-26E

To email me, place '@' after Tom, and append '.com'

Hm,I just started using gliderpilot.net instead of google
to view RAS.Looks like it strips all line breaks and decided to
post my message more than once.-Tom
Tom Serkowski
ASH-26E

To email me, place '@' after Tom, and append '.com'

Speculation on whose part? I'm merely reporting what
Ohlmann himself said. Perhaps he was speculating that
the engine wouldn't start after spending 15 hours at
sub zero temperatures - do you actually think it would?

Seeing how meticulous he was in all other facets of
his preparation, I imagine he might have tried the
motor during a local flight to confirm that it wouldn't
start. But that's just speculation...

At 15:12 28 June 2004, Andrew Henderson wrote:
That's speculation, and the record whilst a magnificent
flight is not the same as one without an engine.

Are you saying that in all of Klaus's previous practise
flights at these heights he never started the engine
to get home because the flight 'wasn't on'? I think
not.

Andy Henderson

At 14:18 28 June 2004, Alan Irving wrote:
When Klaus Ohlmann talked about his Argentinian record
flights at the BGA conference a few years back, I believe
he said that having spent all day at 20,000+ feet the
engine in the Stemme would be highly unlikely to start.
Hence there is no more 'opt out' than if the flight
had been done in a pure sailplane, and the aachievement
is no less valid.

Hm,I just started using gliderpilot.net instead of google
to view RAS.Looks like it strips all line breaks and decided to
post my message more than once.-Tom
Tom Serkowski
ASH-26E

To email me, place '@' after Tom, and append '.com'