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C-130 on Navy Carrier



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 6th 05, 12:47 AM
W. D. Allen Sr.
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Default C-130 on Navy Carrier

Does anyone know anything about the C-130 that made arrested landings and
launches from a Navy aircraft carrier back in the 1960s?

WDA

end



  #2  
Old February 6th 05, 01:26 AM
Harriet and John
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Sure. Check http://www.theaviationzone.com/facts..._forrestal.asp


"W. D. Allen Sr." wrote in message
...
Does anyone know anything about the C-130 that made arrested landings and
launches from a Navy aircraft carrier back in the 1960s?

WDA

end





  #3  
Old February 6th 05, 01:42 AM
Lorence
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On Sat, 5 Feb 2005 15:47:49 -0800, "W. D. Allen Sr."
wrote:

Does anyone know anything about the C-130 that made arrested landings and
launches from a Navy aircraft carrier back in the 1960s?



Taken from http://www.cgaux.com/C-130carrierlanding.htm
__________________________________________________ ____________

Not only was it possible, it was done in moderately rough seas 500
miles out in the North Atlantic off the coast of Boston. In so doing,
the airplane became the largest and heaviest aircraft to ever land on
an aircraft carrier, a record that stands to this day.

When Lt. James H. Flatley III was told about his new assignment, he
thought somebody was pulling his leg. "Operate a C-130 off an aircraft
carrier? Somebody's got to be kidding," he said. But they weren't
kidding. In fact, the Chief of Naval Operations himself had ordered a
feasibility study on operating the big propjet aboard the
Norfolk-based U.S.S. Forrestal (CVA-59). The Navy was trying to find
out whether they could use the Hercules as a "Super COD" - a "Carrier
Onboard Delivery" aircraft. The airplane then used for such tasks was
the Grumman C-1 Trader, a twin piston-engine bird with a limited
payload capacity and 300-mile range. If an aircraft carrier is
operating in mid-ocean, it has no "onboard delivery" system to fall
back on and must come nearer land before taking aboard even urgently
needed items. The Hercules was stable and reliable, with a long
cruising range and capable of carrying large payloads.


C-130 Hercules

The aircraft, a KC-130F refueler transport (BuNo 149798), on loan from
the U.S. Marines, was delivered on 8 October. Lockheed's only
modifications to the original plane included installing a smaller
nose-landing gear orifice, an improved anti-skid braking system, and
removal of the underwing refueling pods. "The big worry was whether we
could meet the maximum sink rate of nine feet per second," Flatley
said. As it turned out, the Navy was amazed to find they were able to
better this mark by a substantial margin.

In addition to Flatley, the crew consisted of Lt.Cmdr. W.W. Stovall,
copilot; ADR-1 E.F. Brennan, flight engineer; and Lockheed engineering
flight test pilot Ted H. Limmer, Jr. The initial sea-born landings on
30 October 1963 were made into a 40-knot wind. Altogether, the crew
successfully negotiated 29 touch-and-go landings, 21 unarrested
full-stop landings, and 21 unassisted takeoffs at gross weights of
85,000 pounds up to 121,000 pounds. At 85,000 pounds, the KC-130F came
to a complete stop within 267 feet, about twice the aircraft's wing
span! The Navy was delighted to discover that even with a maximum
payload, the plane used only 745 feet for takeoff and 460 feet for
landing roll. The short landing roll resulted from close coordination
between Flatley and Jerry Daugherty, the carrier's landing signal
officer. Daugherty, later to become a captain and assigned to the
Naval Air Systems Command, gave Flatley an engine "chop" while still
three or four feet off the deck.

C-130 Hercules

Lockheed's Ted Limmer, who checked out fighter pilot Flatley in the
C-130, stayed on for some of the initial touch-and-go and full-stop
landings. "The last landing I participated in, we touched down about
150 feet from the end, stopped in 270 feet more and launched from that
position, using what was left of the deck. We still had a couple
hundred feet left when we lifted off. Admiral Brown was
flabbergasted."

The plane's wingspan cleared the Forrestal's flight deck "island"
control tower by just under 15 feet as the plane roared down the deck
on a specially painted line. Lockheed's chief engineer, Art E. Flock
was aboard to observe the testing. "The sea was pretty big that day. I
was up on the captain's bridge. I watched a man on the ship's bow as
that bow must have gone up and down 30 feet." The speed of the shop
was increased 10 knots to reduce yaw motion and to reduce wind
direction. Thus, when the plane landed, it had a 40 to 50 knot wind on
the nose. "That airplane stopped right opposite the captain's bridge,"
recalled Flock. "There was cheering and laughing. There on the side of
the fuselage, a big sign had been painted on that said, "LOOK MA, NO
HOOK."

From the accumulated test data, the Navy concluded that with the C-130
Hercules, it would be possible to lift 25,000 pounds of cargo 2,500
miles and land it on a carrier. Even so, the idea was considered a bit
too risky for the C-130 and the Navy elected to use a smaller COD
aircraft. For his effort, the Navy awarded Flatley the Distinguished
Flying Cross.


Lorence
  #4  
Old February 6th 05, 10:29 AM
Peter Twydell
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In message , Lorence
writes
On Sat, 5 Feb 2005 15:47:49 -0800, "W. D. Allen Sr."
wrote:

Does anyone know anything about the C-130 that made arrested landings and
launches from a Navy aircraft carrier back in the 1960s?



Taken from http://www.cgaux.com/C-130carrierlanding.htm
_________________________________________________ _____________

Not only was it possible, it was done in moderately rough seas 500
miles out in the North Atlantic off the coast of Boston. In so doing,
the airplane became the largest and heaviest aircraft to ever land on
an aircraft carrier, a record that stands to this day.

When Lt. James H. Flatley III was told about his new assignment, he
thought somebody was pulling his leg. "Operate a C-130 off an aircraft
carrier? Somebody's got to be kidding," he said. But they weren't
kidding. In fact, the Chief of Naval Operations himself had ordered a
feasibility study on operating the big propjet aboard the
Norfolk-based U.S.S. Forrestal (CVA-59). The Navy was trying to find
out whether they could use the Hercules as a "Super COD" - a "Carrier
Onboard Delivery" aircraft.


Where would they have parked it between flights, had it gone into
service?
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!
  #5  
Old February 6th 05, 10:37 AM
RENABORNEY
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Default


Where would they have parked it between flights, had it gone into
service?


SNIP

On the flight deck - which would have been cleared of all other aircraft in
order for the Herc to operate. If you wanted to conduxt air ops you would have
to revert to WWII style flight deck ops - park her aft in order to launch over
the bow, then drag her forward to clear the landing area, then drag her back
aft....you can now see why the angled deck was a "good thing" (admittedly, its
primary benefit was to allow a bolter a chance to shoot another approach rather
than hit the barrier)
  #6  
Old February 6th 05, 11:09 AM
Peter Twydell
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Default

In message , RENABORNEY
writes

Where would they have parked it between flights, had it gone into
service?


SNIP

On the flight deck - which would have been cleared of all other aircraft in
order for the Herc to operate. If you wanted to conduxt air ops you would have
to revert to WWII style flight deck ops - park her aft in order to launch over
the bow, then drag her forward to clear the landing area, then drag her back
aft....you can now see why the angled deck was a "good thing" (admittedly, its
primary benefit was to allow a bolter a chance to shoot another approach rather
than hit the barrier)


Obviously on the fight deck! The reason I asked was that I haven't any
conception of the size of the C-130 compared with other naval aircraft
(I could look it all up, but I'm working today) and the available space
on the deck.

Sounds like the need to reposition the aircraft could be a major pain
from the operational point of view, or would it be no worse that having
to shuffle the other aircraft around?
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!
  #7  
Old February 6th 05, 04:08 PM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 10:09:43 GMT, Peter Twydell
wrote:

Where would they have parked it between flights, had it gone into
service?


SNIP

On the flight deck - which would have been cleared of all other aircraft in
order for the Herc to operate. If you wanted to conduxt air ops you would have
to revert to WWII style flight deck ops - park her aft in order to launch over
the bow, then drag her forward to clear the landing area, then drag her back
aft....you can now see why the angled deck was a "good thing" (admittedly, its
primary benefit was to allow a bolter a chance to shoot another approach rather
than hit the barrier)


Obviously on the fight deck! The reason I asked was that I haven't any
conception of the size of the C-130 compared with other naval aircraft
(I could look it all up, but I'm working today) and the available space
on the deck.

Sounds like the need to reposition the aircraft could be a major pain
from the operational point of view, or would it be no worse that having
to shuffle the other aircraft around?


IIRC this was the main reason the project was not pursued. "Locking
the deck" was not something that an Air Boss would like. And what do
you do if the aircraft goes "down" and requires maintenance?
Particularly heavy maintenance, like an engine or prop change?

I also have a vague recollection of the concept of the "clipped wing"
C-130 where the wing would be shorted 6-8 feet per side to give some
flexibility in deck handling. I don't think this one got much past
the discussion stage.

The project was intereresting showing what could be done. It might
even still be relevant today. I could imagine a "Tom Clancy scenario"
where we pull off an "Entebe" type operation from a carrier. Big
Mother goes out with a couple of Hercs escorted by an LHD loaded out
with lots of Harriers. You would not have to suspend too much
disbelief on this one! ;-)

Bill Kambic

Bill Kambic
  #9  
Old February 7th 05, 02:57 AM
Tex Houston
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Default


"Peter Twydell" wrote in message
...

Where would they have parked it between flights, had it gone into service?
--
Peter



How about in the normal parking spot on the base where it was stationed on
land. Don't think it was ever contemplated to have a carrier based C-130.
Think about it.

Regards,

Tex


  #10  
Old February 7th 05, 07:24 PM
Peter Twydell
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Default

In message , Tex Houston
writes

"Peter Twydell" wrote in message
...

Where would they have parked it between flights, had it gone into service?
--
Peter



How about in the normal parking spot on the base where it was stationed on
land. Don't think it was ever contemplated to have a carrier based C-130.
Think about it.

Regards,

Tex


That would be a good idea, but as Bill Kambic said, what if the a/c is
unable to take off again for several hours? That's a lot of hardware
clogging up the deck.
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!
 




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