Recognizing and reacting to tow plane engine failure

It would be useful to hear your stories of how incidents of tow plane engine failure turned out for you. It seems that there is very little time to recognize, react, and recover. What are classic mistakes to make in this scenario?

Would it be useful to practice 'release and land to the side of the tow plane path' (and have the tow plane fly a normal departure of course)? Any other recommended training exercises?

On Thursday, October 23, 2014 10:41:57 AM UTC-4, son_of_flubber wrote:
It would be useful to hear your stories of how incidents of tow plane engine failure turned out for you. It seems that there is very little time to recognize, react, and recover. What are classic mistakes to make in this scenario?

Would it be useful to practice 'release and land to the side of the tow plane path' (and have the tow plane fly a normal departure of course)? Any other recommended training exercises?

The classic problem is one of not having a plan. All portions of the critical part of the launch need to have a plan of what to do so it is "only" a matter of execution.
There is almost no time for problem solving.
I have had 3 engine failures as tow pilot. 2 were complete power loss. 2 pilots got it right and released- one started reporting smoke from the towplane instead of getting off.
UH

On 10/23/2014 8:41 AM, son_of_flubber wrote:
It would be useful to hear your stories of how incidents of tow plane
engine failure turned out for you. It seems that there is very little time
to recognize, react, and recover. What are classic mistakes to make in
this scenario?

Would it be useful to practice 'release and land to the side of the tow
plane path' (and have the tow plane fly a normal departure of course)? Any
other recommended training exercises?


I've experienced 2 (that spring to mind) incidents of unplanned loss of tuggie
power while on tow, both above pattern altitude. Neither resulted in a radio
call - and no waveoff - that I remember. The gradual one was trickier to
detect from my end of the rope, in that the symptoms developed "non-digitally"
and could easily have been due to towpilot inattention or distraction or
"something" unrelated to a problematic engine issue. Other than the time
constants involved, both were detectable (in no particular order) by reduction
in climb rate, some loss of airspeed, and "something's different" flags
raising in my noodle. Neither resulted in "an obvious rope bow" or
deceleration before I released in both cases once it was seemed (but wasn't
"crystal-clearly evident") to me it wasn't your basic tuggie inattention
situation.

Talked with both after the flights. One was (gasp) out of fuel (slosh-related
unporting as I recall) and the other something related to the throttle
(details forgotten in time) that didn't put the tug down for the day. Both
tuggies thanked me for releasing.

In thinking more about the possibility of a gradual loss of engine power (e.g.
throttle creep), I concluded it could perhaps be one of the trickier things
for Joe Glider Pilot to detect should it happen (say) before or immediately
after becoming airborne. Never happened to me, but there's good reasons for
mentally preparing for how to recognize and deal with "the abbie-normal on-tow
possibilities."

Bob W.

So there are tuggles (new word) who are insensitive
to change in engine note and do not monitor the tach!
No surprise, unfortunately. Importnt to check the RPM
at the start with full throttle, and thereafter.
In the PIK 20E I do not need to read the tach for
full power; the noise tells me!
JMF

At 15:14 23 October 2014, BobW wrote:
On 10/23/2014 8:41 AM, son_of_flubber wrote:
It would be useful to hear your stories of how incidents of tow plane
engine failure turned out for you. It seems that there is very little
time
to recognize, react, and recover. What are classic mistakes to make in
this scenario?

Would it be useful to practice 'release and land to the side of the tow
plane path' (and have the tow plane fly a normal departure of course)?
Any
other recommended training exercises?


I've experienced 2 (that spring to mind) incidents of unplanned loss of
tuggie
power while on tow, both above pattern altitude. Neither resulted in a
radio
call - and no waveoff - that I remember. The gradual one was trickier to
detect from my end of the rope, in that the symptoms developed
"non-digitally"
and could easily have been due to towpilot inattention or distraction or
"something" unrelated to a problematic engine issue. Other than the time
constants involved, both were detectable (in no particular order) by
reduction
in climb rate, some loss of airspeed, and "something's different" flags
raising in my noodle. Neither resulted in "an obvious rope bow" or
deceleration before I released in both cases once it was seemed (but
wasn't

"crystal-clearly evident") to me it wasn't your basic tuggie inattention
situation.

Talked with both after the flights. One was (gasp) out of fuel
(slosh-related
unporting as I recall) and the other something related to the throttle
(details forgotten in time) that didn't put the tug down for the day. Both

tuggies thanked me for releasing.

In thinking more about the possibility of a gradual loss of engine power
(e.g.
throttle creep), I concluded it could perhaps be one of the trickier
things

for Joe Glider Pilot to detect should it happen (say) before or
immediately

after becoming airborne. Never happened to me, but there's good reasons
for

mentally preparing for how to recognize and deal with "the abbie-normal
on-tow
possibilities."

Bob W.

On Thursday, October 23, 2014 11:30:05 AM UTC-4, firsys wrote:
So there are tuggles (new word) who are insensitive
to change in engine note and do not monitor the tach!
No surprise, unfortunately.

The other possibility is that we (mostly) have tow pilots with enough grit that they don't wave off or release at the first hiccup. This has been my experience.

T8

On Thursday, October 23, 2014 9:39:53 AM UTC-6, Evan Ludeman wrote:
On Thursday, October 23, 2014 11:30:05 AM UTC-4, firsys wrote:
So there are tuggles (new word) who are insensitive
to change in engine note and do not monitor the tach!
No surprise, unfortunately.

The other possibility is that we (mostly) have tow pilots with enough grit that they don't wave off or release at the first hiccup. This has been my experience.

T8

That "grit" is often an inability to make a timely decision.

A true, recent incident illustrates the point:

Tug (C-182) loaded to gross with survival gear, full fuel and two aboard attempts to tow a heavy glider with two aboard from a high density altitude airport with no off-field landing options. The takeoff runway is 7,700 feet long but uphill and downwind.

The tow barely misses the REIL lights on the departure end and then begins a descent down a dry wash toward a river. No wing wave is given and the glider does not release. Finally, with no option left except landing in swift, white water, the glider pilot sees a patch of unimproved desert slightly above him and releases. He uses his airspeed to gain just enough height to make a safe landing atop a small mesa ~ 500 feet below runway elevation. The tug takes several minutes to gain enough height to land back on the runway.

So, what went wrong? The tug had a problem developing full power. Probably a muffler baffle had come adrift partially blocking the exhaust - something hard to pick up on a run up. All have been tight lipped about the postmortem.

The decision to make the takeoff in the first place is questionable. The tug had not been test flown that day which, had that been done, would have likely revealed the problem. In any event a C-182 should not have full tanks for towing so the 'test flight' should have lasted long enough to burn off excess fuel.

The tug pilot should have released the rope while the glider still had room to stop on the runway when it became clear the takeoff roll was WAY too long. The glider pilot should have released while still rolling for the same reason. Once past the departure end, neither pilot had any real options until the patch of desert atop the mesa became available.

I always suggest selecting a "GO - NO GO" point on the runway where the glider can still release and stop if the takeoff is not going well. Had the glider pilot done this, he would have stopped at the downwind end of the runway so successive tows could have been downhill and into the wind. The tug pilot would have probably detected the lack of power and retired the tug until the problem was corrected.

On Thursday, October 23, 2014 12:38:09 PM UTC-4, Bill D wrote:
On Thursday, October 23, 2014 9:39:53 AM UTC-6, Evan Ludeman wrote:
On Thursday, October 23, 2014 11:30:05 AM UTC-4, firsys wrote:
So there are tuggles (new word) who are insensitive
to change in engine note and do not monitor the tach!
No surprise, unfortunately.

The other possibility is that we (mostly) have tow pilots with enough grit that they don't wave off or release at the first hiccup. This has been my experience.

T8

That "grit" is often an inability to make a timely decision.

Happily, that isn't *my* 28 years of experience. Yours may vary.


A true, recent incident illustrates the point:

Tug (C-182) loaded to gross with survival gear, full fuel and two aboard attempts to tow a heavy glider with two aboard from a high density altitude airport with no off-field landing options. The takeoff runway is 7,700 feet long but uphill and downwind.

It illustrates something, alright, but it isn't relevant here.

T8

On Thursday, October 23, 2014 8:30:05 AM UTC-7, firsys wrote:
So there are tuggles (new word) who are insensitive
to change in engine note and do not monitor the tach!
No surprise, unfortunately.
JMF

The tuggies I know, including myself, haven't yet lost *all* their self preservation instinct and are keenly attuned to the performance and nuances of "their" machine. I take off with left hand holding throttle forward, ready to go for the release. But in truth, most of my attention during the take off roll is the take off roll, with brief scan of engine instruments to affirm all is well after throttle advance, rotation speed approaching where and as it should, and a few quick glances at the mirror to be sure the glider is tracking okay. I worry less about the engine than about the glider behind me. If Mr. Motor is going to try and kill you, it usually gives warning, albeit brief. If the glider tries to do you in, my understanding is there can be almost no time to recognize and react.

Sometimes Minden conditions get sporty, often with wave rotor it can take most of the tuggies attention just flying the plane. My biggest concern remains a glider kiting, especially with a CG hook. Happened once at maybe 30 feet. Mistook it for turbulence and reacted accordingly with stick. Fortunately for me the glider pilot recovered quickly, regaining position before I ran out of elevator or had a tail stall - - apologized to me afterwards. The line guy said, "He went way up, didn't you see that?!" Nope, clueless I guess.

bumper
MKIV & QV

When I'm flying at the front of the rope, I'm concerned for both me and the glider. I don't know a tuggie who isn't.

I've experienced simulated power failures and simulated rope breaks just after I'm flying but the tow plane isn't.

The rope breaks were a piece of cake, as the bang alerts you that something just went wrong and you instantly transition to landing mode.

The simulated tow plane power failure was not a piece of cake. It took a few seconds to figure out that something was wrong, find the release and transition to landing mode.

I think simulated tow plane power failure is definitely something you should see at least once (with an instructor in the back seat to keep you safe, of course)! You'll never forget it, and recognition will come faster if you ever have to deal with it in real life.

-John, Q3

On Friday, October 24, 2014 10:40:08 AM UTC-4, John Carlyle wrote:
I've experienced simulated power failures and simulated rope breaks just after I'm flying but the tow plane isn't.

..
..
..
The simulated tow plane power failure was not a piece of cake. It took a few seconds to figure out that something was wrong, find the release and transition to landing mode.

The case of the towplane being on the ground and aborting takeoff when the glider is flying in ground effect is problematic.

If the runway has poor straight ahead landing options (I mean poor options for landing after a 100 AGL engine failure), then aborting takeoff before the towplane leaves the ground, even for an unconfirmed engine/pilot problem, is understandable. But the glider having much less drag is fated to fly past the tow plane (if it avoids collision).

Is it possible for the glider to turn fast enough to avoid colliding with the towplane? What happens when a glider touches a wingtip to the ground at 40 knots?

At what velocity does the glider have enough energy to fly over top of the towplane? Or is that impossible?

Any experiences/thoughts?