Stupid question about autogas

Ever been to Fleet Farm, or whatever they call the farm and ranch store
in your area? You can get tanks in all shapes and sizes from 20 gallons
on up to 120. There are tabs welded on to the bottom so thay can be
mounted in the back of your truck. I had mine mounted in the truck for
a while but it takes up space and stinks up the garage. Don't know what
the laws are, don't care.



Dave S wrote:

What are the legalities of transporting more than 55 gallons of
hazardous materials in your locale? Gasoline IS a hazardous material,
you know. Thats one of the reasons that the nice tanks that are designed
to be carried in pickup truck beds are smaller than that quantity
(unless tied into the vehicle's fuel system)

Things to consider....
Vehicle Licensing?
Driver Training and licensing?
Placarding?


Dave


Newps wrote:

I have a 100 gallon tank on a 4x8 trailer. There is a battery mounted
behind the tank for the 12 volt pump. Unless I am going on a trip I
normally fly with about 40 gallons in my tanks that have an 84 gallon
max.

Paul Folbrecht wrote:

If I buy a 152 getting the autogas STC appeals to me a lot for the
obvious reason (economy).

What I'm wondering about is exactly how the pilots that are running
autogas are getting it to the airport. I can't imagine the typical
answer is much different than "carting it there in cans" but even a
152 is going to require 5 5-gallon cans for a single fillup! That's
a lot of cans. Is there a better way?

CriticalMass wrote:

Greg Burkhart wrote:

Everybody's talking about taking the autogas to the airport... How about
just going to the airports that have autogas? I'm moving my airplane
one of
these days to the local airport that offers autogas.

At every airport I've been to with mogas the price has been too high, at
least 25 cents over what you pay at the pump at the local gas station.

In Texas, at the time I obtained a Commercial Driver's License with Haz
Mat endorsement.. youhad to have a placard to haul more than 55 gals..

What I have noticed around here in the truck and trailer shops are that
the "retail" available tanks with a pump and nozzle have a capacity less
than that. There are 80 and 100 gal tanks sold there, but they come with
piping to be connected to the vehicle's fuel system as an "aux tank"
(which obviates the placarding and transport rules)

Dave

Newps wrote:
Ever been to Fleet Farm, or whatever they call the farm and ranch store
in your area? You can get tanks in all shapes and sizes from 20 gallons
on up to 120. There are tabs welded on to the bottom so thay can be
mounted in the back of your truck. I had mine mounted in the truck for
a while but it takes up space and stinks up the garage. Don't know what
the laws are, don't care.



Dave S wrote:

What are the legalities of transporting more than 55 gallons of
hazardous materials in your locale? Gasoline IS a hazardous material,
you know. Thats one of the reasons that the nice tanks that are
designed to be carried in pickup truck beds are smaller than that
quantity (unless tied into the vehicle's fuel system)

Things to consider....
Vehicle Licensing?
Driver Training and licensing?
Placarding?


Dave


Newps wrote:

I have a 100 gallon tank on a 4x8 trailer. There is a battery
mounted behind the tank for the 12 volt pump. Unless I am going on a
trip I normally fly with about 40 gallons in my tanks that have an 84
gallon max.

Paul Folbrecht wrote:

If I buy a 152 getting the autogas STC appeals to me a lot for the
obvious reason (economy).

What I'm wondering about is exactly how the pilots that are running
autogas are getting it to the airport. I can't imagine the typical
answer is much different than "carting it there in cans" but even a
152 is going to require 5 5-gallon cans for a single fillup! That's
a lot of cans. Is there a better way?

The fuel truck would be great if you flew long distances a lot.
If you fly
infrequently or fairly locally, filling from cans isn't that bad. I
highly recommend
getting a water-separating filter of some sort, however... pump gas can
have a bit of
crud/water in it.

Our Cherokee 235 is burning 24 gph on takeoff, and around 14 gph in
cruise -- we use a LOT of gas, and do a lot of cross-country flights.

Needless to say, filling 84 gallon gas tanks from 6 gallon cans was a ROYAL
pain in the butt! Not to mention incredibly dangerous. Not to mention
having your nose 10 inches from the gas as you're pouring.

The Mighty Grape has a water separating filter, and can pump the gas *out*
faster than I can pump it *in* at the gas station. It's been a real
Godsend, and has saved me thousands of dollars.

AND -- best of all -- Atlas (our plane) runs far better on car gas than
avgas. No more fouled plugs! :-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

In Texas, I filed and got refunds for the mogas I bought and used in the
airplane, since the mogas was not used on Texas roads. A nice little
bonus to the other advantages of using unleaded regular mogas in an
airplane engine not designed to "scavenge" the 4X lead content in 100LL
versus the 80 octane they were intended to burn.

I found this for the State of Wisconsin:
http://www.dor.state.wi.us/pubs/03mf-107.pdf

If I'm reading the article correctly, I can get a refund of .285 per gallon?
Cha-ching!
--
Ben
C-172 - N13258 @ 87Y

Amen brother, amen.. Fat Albert used to eat plugs for breakfast (carbs,
can't lean enough on taxi) until I switched him to the breakfast of
champions...

The mechanic doing the annual pulls a bottom plug (I've run the mogas out
and topped with 100 lousy lead, by then), peers at nearly pristine
porcelain, glares at me, and demands, "You been running that *^&$%#! car gas
in here?"
I do my best offended routine, "Who, me?"
He mumbles, and slaps the plug into the caddy...

denny

"Jay Honeck" wrote AND -- best of all -- Atlas
(our plane) runs far better on car gas than
avgas. No more fouled plugs! :-)

I found this for the State of Wisconsin:
http://www.dor.state.wi.us/pubs/03mf-107.pdf


Disregard my previous enthusiasm. I found the actual refund claim form, and
in the instructions it says: "Refunds may NOT be claimed on fuel purchased
for use in the following vehicles: Snowmobiles, Recreational Motorboats,
All Terrain Vehicles, and Aircraft."

http://www.dor.state.wi.us/forms/excise/mf-023w.pdf

....But.. they still don't require an FBO to charge the fuel tax on
automotive fuel sold on-site to Aircraft. What's up with that?

Ben Smith wrote:

...But.. they [WI] still don't require an FBO to charge the fuel tax on
automotive fuel sold on-site to Aircraft. What's up with that?

The FBO may not have much of an option. I believe that the fuel distributor is
saddled with duty of turning the tax dollars over to the State (otherwise every
Mom & Pop gas station could be involved in tax fraud), so the FBO may be being
charged the tax by the distributor. It would be up to the FBO to convince the
distributor that the tax isn't due to the State, and there's no financial
incentive for the distributor to take the chance that this is true.

Best bet: move to Texas. :-)

Russell Kent

CriticalMass wrote:

I know airports do exist that sell mogas, but I've been to a lot of
airports in my area of the country, and I have yet to see one that sells it.

The nearest one to me that I know of is a few hundred miles away.

George Patterson
A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that
you look forward to the trip.

John Galban wrote:

Can you get an autogas STC for the 152?

Yes.

George Patterson
A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that
you look forward to the trip.