Test Q's

T o d d P a t t i s t wrote:
the only difference between a stalled wing at
AOA 3 degrees beyond the stall and an unstalled wing at 3
degrees before stall is that the unstalled wing will produce
more lift if the AOA is increased and the stalled wing will
produce less lift if the AOA is increased.

The stalled wing will also be producing more drag than the unstalled wing.
This is one of the things which causes the airplane to yaw towards the
dropping wing in a spin entry.

jsmith wrote:
There is a movie documenting Richard Bach's late-70's barnstorming trip
around the country with a pair of Fleet biplanes (same name as the book,
but I cannot remember what the title is). In one segment, he attaches
flares to the wingtips and goes flying, ignites the flares and in the
course of the flight, stalls and spins the aircraft. It is at this point
the a picture makes clear what is happening with the wings.
The smoke from the flare on the outside (flying) wing streams behind the
wingtip, while the smoke from the flare on the inside (stalled) wing
wafts slowly upward. This was filmed from the air from the accompanying
aircraft.

It would be more helpful if someone placed the smoke generators about mid-span
so that the smoke passed over the wing. That would be a much more accurate
indication of how well the outside wing was actually flying.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

In article , jsmith wrote:
There is a movie documenting Richard Bach's late-70's barnstorming trip
around the country with a pair of Fleet biplanes (same name as the book,
but I cannot remember what the title is). In one segment, he attaches

The book is "Nothing by Chance" (written in 1969). I see an IMDB
reference (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0345722/), but I can't find any
other references to the movie. I'd very much like to see that -
you wouldn't happen to have it on VHS/DVD, would you?

Tina Marie

And I would read that as "both wings are stalled"... It's a very poorly
written question or very well written (depending on your point-of-view).

Whether it's well written or poorly written depends not so much on
point of view as context.

If the context is a discussion, it's a very well written question.
It's well written because there is no clear right or wrong answer, and
there is something to discuss, and so it has been discussed. The
discussion is a good one - it goes beyond the simplifications and
misconceptions. It makes clear that a stalled wing still produces some
lift. It brings in the issue of lift curves, and explains what it
means for both wings to be stalled, and yet for one to be more stalled
than the other, and to regain and produce some lift. It's an excellent
learning question. Within the context of a test that is taken and then
reviewed and discussed, it is very appropriate - everyone will learn
something from the review and discussion.

It's a terrible testing question within the testing context used by the
FAA. You take an FAA test, and then you're not even told which
questions you got wrong, only the subject areas. There is no
discussion and review. Thus none of the question's benefits are
realized within the context of the testing method used. Also, since
none of the answers are really right, and yet none are really wrong,
there is no real way to get the question consistently right by knowing
the material, no matter how well you know the material. The only way
to get it consistently right is to have seen it before - and seen the
answer.

Michael

George Patterson wrote:
jsmith wrote:
There is a movie documenting Richard Bach's late-70's barnstorming trip
around the country with a pair of Fleet biplanes (same name as the book,
but I cannot remember what the title is). In one segment, he attaches
flares to the wingtips and goes flying, ignites the flares and in the
course of the flight, stalls and spins the aircraft. It is at this point
the a picture makes clear what is happening with the wings.
The smoke from the flare on the outside (flying) wing streams behind the
wingtip, while the smoke from the flare on the inside (stalled) wing
wafts slowly upward. This was filmed from the air from the accompanying
aircraft.

It would be more helpful if someone placed the smoke generators about mid-span
so that the smoke passed over the wing. That would be a much more accurate
indication of how well the outside wing was actually flying.

Correct me if I'm wrong (it happened once b-4) but a stalled wing is
one which is not producing enuf lift to hold up the associated weight.
A stalled wing can still be moving forward, even as it falls toward
Momma Earth. Also, in a spin don't you always have one wing rotaring
around a point defined by the lower wingtip? The smoke in the above
example acts exactly as I would expect it to.

I'd answer A.

BTW, does anyone know what answer the FAA considers correct???

Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

---Hilarious!!!!

NoGoals wrote:

A stalled wing can still be moving forward, even as it falls toward
Momma Earth. Also, in a spin don't you always have one wing rotaring
around a point defined by the lower wingtip? The smoke in the above
example acts exactly as I would expect it to.

A stalled wing is one in which the airflow has separated from the upper surface
of the wing. It may indeed still be moving forward. Blow smoke across a stalled
wing and you can clearly see the burble in the airflow over the surface. Smoke
generators at the wingtips will not show whether a wing has stalled or not.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

T o d d P a t t i s t wrote:
George Patterson wrote:

A stalled wing is one in which the airflow has separated from the upper surface
of the wing.

Nope, this is closer to the right definition, but it's still
doesn't define a stalled wing.

Jeppessen says you're wrong.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

T o d d P a t t i s t wrote:

The flow is separated when the wing is stalled, ....

So, as I said, "Blow smoke across a stalled wing and you can clearly see the
burble in the airflow over the surface."

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

T o d d P a t t i s t wrote:

I thought we were discussing whether a wing with separated
flow is *by definition* stalled.

Well, *I* was discussing using smoke generators to determine the degree to which
the wing is stalled. Dunno 'bout you.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.