Methods for altitude changes

writes:

Then back off the appropriate number of notches.

How many notches?

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writes:

Assuming you're in straight and level flight,
with constant power setting: when you change
trim, do you adjust the yoke (or joystick)
position to keep things straight and level?

Only if the trim adjustment puts me out of trim. Then I have to hold the yoke
continuously. If I gradually trim correctly, I can apply less and less
pressure to the yoke.

I thought so. Do you see the problem?

Not really. It's a bit like saying the simulation isn't realistic because it
uses a stick instead of a yoke. The difference between a stick and yoke is
trivial.

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In rec.aviation.piloting Mxsmanic wrote:
Just go look it up! writes:

Even more basically, if the servo didn't care about pressure then why
would it have a feedback generator to tell the trim servo just how
much adjustments it needs?

Different autopilots work in different ways. The autopilot maintains altitude,
or heading; it does not relieve control pressure. If the aircraft is
perfectly trimmed at 5000 feet and you set the autopilot for 4000 feet, the
autopilot will adjust trim (in APs that work this way) despite the absence of
any control pressure. An autopilot looks at instrument readings, not control
pressures--some aircraft don't even have control pressures.

Your understanding of real autopilots is extremely simplistic and
incorrect.

All real aircraft piloted by humans have control pressure, including
aircraft with fly-by-wire systems.

--
Jim Pennino

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In rec.aviation.piloting Mxsmanic wrote:
Gig 601XL Builder writes:

They don't because they don't have emotions. But the owners of the A/P do
care because if the A/P servo is having to fight the control pressure it is
also going to wear out sooner.

If the servo actuates the control column.

If the servo is controlling the control surface, it is hooked into the
cable or hydraulics that the yoke controls.

All real aircraft have elevator trim.

snip

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Jim Pennino

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In rec.aviation.piloting Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

You're demonstrating that you've never been in a real
plane, nor even in a good simulator ("good" meaning
one that simulates control pressure).

Some people here have only been in one type of aircraft, and mistakenly
believe that all aircraft are the same.

Anyway, if you're trimmed for a very slow
airspeed, (high AoA, nose-up pitch) you'll
absolutely know it. You'll know it by the sloppy
feel of the controls, the sound the plane makes,
and your airspeed indicator. Likewise, if you're
trimmed for a very high airspeed, you'll know
it by the stiff controls, the sound, and the
airspeed indicator.

In some aircraft, yes. But I wouldn't trust that in all aircraft.

That's because you have never been in a real airplane.

Other than maybe something exotic like a SR-71, they ALL do that.

--
Jim Pennino

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In rec.aviation.piloting Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

Then back off the appropriate number of notches.

How many notches?

A couple.

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Jim Pennino

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writes:

Your understanding of real autopilots is extremely simplistic and
incorrect.

Explain the errors.

All real aircraft piloted by humans have control pressure, including
aircraft with fly-by-wire systems.

Most, rather than all. And in some aircraft the pressure is simulated, simply
because the pilot expects it. Obviously, it wouldn't make sense to simulate
control pressure and then use that to control an autopilot. Besides, as I've
said, autopilots don't exist for the purpose of relieving control pressures.

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writes:

All real aircraft have elevator trim.

Not true. Some move the stabilizer instead. The difference is significant
because moving the stabilizer conserves the entire operating range of the
elevator, whereas moving the elevator with a trim tab does not.

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writes:

That's because you have never been in a real airplane.

No, it's because I know that there are many different types of airplane, and
that such generalizations are not universally applicable in consequence.

Other than maybe something exotic like a SR-71, they ALL do that.

I wonder if a pilot who had flown only SR-71s would insist that all aircraft
have unstarts.

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writes:

A couple.

How many is that? Didn't you say that real pilots learn this during their
training?

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