American disc aircraft

In article ,
"Pete" writes:

"Ed Majden" wrote in message
news8tZb.579658$ts4.461106@pd7tw3no...

"B2431"
The U.S. built and flew a few disc aircraft during WW2. The Chance
Vought
V-173
first flew 23 November 1942, which had excellent STOL capabilities and
was
apparently impossible to stall.

AVRO Canada experimented with a flying saucer type design in the 1950s.
This was funded in part by the USAF. It was known as the Avrocar. It was
abandoned as I guess technology had not been developed (i.e. computer
flight
control systems etc) for controlling successful flight. Do a search with
'google' for "AVRO Flying Saucer" if you want to read more about this
project.
Ed Majden

One of those is on display at the Ft. Eustis, Virginia, Transportation
Museum.
http://www.avroarrow.org/Avrocar/Avrocar3.html
http://www.davidpride.com/Army/us_ft_eustis_04.htm

That's also the furthest that thing's ever been from the surface.

--
Pete Stickney
A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many
bad measures. -- Daniel Webster

(B2431) wrote in message ...
The U.S. built and flew a few disc aircraft during WW2. The Chance Vought V-173
first flew 23 November 1942, which had excellent STOL capabilities and was
apparently impossible to stall. The Navy ordered two XF5U-1 which didn't get
their propellers until 1947 and were not proceded with since the Navy decided
jets were the way to go.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Actually, the idea was researched in the US since 1932 (Patent
2,108,093). It was based om the theories of physicist Charles H.
Zimmermann, compiled in technical report NACA 431. In 1939, The US
Navy provided the funding for the prototype which flew on 11/23/42 as
the Chance-Vought V-173.
Previous aerodynamic tests had already revealed the instability and
low maneuverability of the plane, so the designers were forced to
install big conventional empennages, spoiling the very concept of the
circular wing aircraft (hint: not a true disc).
Low speed performances were considered worse than in other models in
service of the time. So, the next step was a proposal for a VTO recon
plane with tilting rotors repacing the prop blades.
Other protoypes were made (series XF5U-1) equipped with 1359 hp
engines but their performance was also inadequate for the postwar
needs of the US Navy and the project was cancelled in the spring of
1948.
The Soviets also tested two circular gliders based on the German
A.S.6- the Diskoplan I with a Kreisflugel J1253 wing (investigated by
Dr. Alexander Lippisch in 1940-41 at the AVA Gottingen wind tunnel and
Messerschmitt AG laboratories). It was presented at the Moscow Airport
at Tushino in 1958. A Diskoplan II flew in 1962, but no data is
available for a powered version. It is not known if a high-performance
powered version was ever built.

Rob

"Ed Majden" wrote in message news:p8tZb.579658$ts4.461106@pd7tw3no...
"B2431"
The U.S. built and flew a few disc aircraft during WW2. The Chance Vought
V-173
first flew 23 November 1942, which had excellent STOL capabilities and was
apparently impossible to stall.

AVRO Canada experimented with a flying saucer type design in the 1950s.
This was funded in part by the USAF.
and US Army since it was really a GETOL (Ground Effect Takeoff and
Landing) aircraft.

It was known as the Avrocar. It was
abandoned as I guess technology had not been developed (i.e. computer flight
control systems etc) for controlling successful flight. Do a search with
'google' for "AVRO Flying Saucer" if you want to read more about this
project.
Ed Majden

Ed, it was a farce. The mock-up and two prototypes were demonstrated
as purpose failures to mislead the Soviets into believing this was the
direction the US was going with disc technology. Despite the AVROCAR,
the US had already aquired disc technology from Germany via AVRO
Canada and the immense documentation from Wright Field. AVRO, Lockheed
and Northrop all had disc projects way beyond the VZ-9V and some of
those designs and photos are now coming to light: Silverbug, WS 606A,
AVRO Ace/Spade, the LRV (Lenticular Reentry Vehicle), Northrop NS-97,
etc...
Meanwhile the Soviets dropped the disc plans and proceeded with the
T-60S bomber which is based on the German Sanger spaceplane. That
program and prototype(s) are still active in Russia.

Rob

robert arndt wrote:

(B2431) wrote in message ...
The U.S. built and flew a few disc aircraft during WW2. The Chance Vought V-173
first flew 23 November 1942, which had excellent STOL capabilities and was
apparently impossible to stall. The Navy ordered two XF5U-1 which didn't get
their propellers until 1947 and were not proceded with since the Navy decided
jets were the way to go.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Actually, the idea was researched in the US since 1932 (Patent
2,108,093). It was based om the theories of physicist Charles H.
Zimmermann, compiled in technical report NACA 431. In 1939, The US
Navy provided the funding for the prototype which flew on 11/23/42 as
the Chance-Vought V-173.
Previous aerodynamic tests had already revealed the instability and
low maneuverability of the plane, so the designers were forced to
install big conventional empennages, spoiling the very concept of the
circular wing aircraft (hint: not a true disc).
Low speed performances were considered worse than in other models in
service of the time. So, the next step was a proposal for a VTO recon
plane with tilting rotors repacing the prop blades.
Other protoypes were made (series XF5U-1) equipped with 1359 hp
engines but their performance was also inadequate for the postwar
needs of the US Navy and the project was cancelled in the spring of
1948.
The Soviets also tested two circular gliders based on the German
A.S.6- the Diskoplan I with a Kreisflugel J1253 wing (investigated by
Dr. Alexander Lippisch in 1940-41 at the AVA Gottingen wind tunnel and
Messerschmitt AG laboratories). It was presented at the Moscow Airport
at Tushino in 1958. A Diskoplan II flew in 1962, but no data is
available for a powered version. It is not known if a high-performance
powered version was ever built.

Rob

Is that the one hanging from the ceiling in the hangar at Monino ???

Scroll down to the bottom of :- http://mysite.freeserve.com/visits_p...cow_day08.html

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++
Ken Duffey - Flanker Freak & Russian Aviation Enthusiast
Flankers Website - http://www.flankers.co.uk/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++

Ken Duffey wrote in message ...
robert arndt wrote:

(B2431) wrote in message ...
The U.S. built and flew a few disc aircraft during WW2. The Chance Vought V-173
first flew 23 November 1942, which had excellent STOL capabilities and was
apparently impossible to stall. The Navy ordered two XF5U-1 which didn't get
their propellers until 1947 and were not proceded with since the Navy decided
jets were the way to go.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Actually, the idea was researched in the US since 1932 (Patent
2,108,093). It was based om the theories of physicist Charles H.
Zimmermann, compiled in technical report NACA 431. In 1939, The US
Navy provided the funding for the prototype which flew on 11/23/42 as
the Chance-Vought V-173.
Previous aerodynamic tests had already revealed the instability and
low maneuverability of the plane, so the designers were forced to
install big conventional empennages, spoiling the very concept of the
circular wing aircraft (hint: not a true disc).
Low speed performances were considered worse than in other models in
service of the time. So, the next step was a proposal for a VTO recon
plane with tilting rotors repacing the prop blades.
Other protoypes were made (series XF5U-1) equipped with 1359 hp
engines but their performance was also inadequate for the postwar
needs of the US Navy and the project was cancelled in the spring of
1948.
The Soviets also tested two circular gliders based on the German
A.S.6- the Diskoplan I with a Kreisflugel J1253 wing (investigated by
Dr. Alexander Lippisch in 1940-41 at the AVA Gottingen wind tunnel and
Messerschmitt AG laboratories). It was presented at the Moscow Airport
at Tushino in 1958. A Diskoplan II flew in 1962, but no data is
available for a powered version. It is not known if a high-performance
powered version was ever built.

Rob

Is that the one hanging from the ceiling in the hangar at Monino ???

Yes. Here's mo

http://www.ufx.org/soviet/sukhanov.htm

Rob

"robert arndt"
Ed, it was a farce. The mock-up and two prototypes were demonstrated
as purpose failures to mislead the Soviets into believing this was the
direction the US was going with disc technology. Despite the AVROCAR,
the US had already aquired disc technology from Germany via AVRO

Perhaps! With a little bit more imagination, they should have added a
ground effect skirt and perhaps they would have had a proto type of a
hovercraft, although a very small one. Does anyone know when the first
hovercraft was designed? The UK is generally given credit for the first
practical in use models I believe.
Ed